Yeah, cite? Since that violates one of the most basic tenants of Muslim belief, I.e no one can intercede on your behalf on the last day. Unlikely to be a belief that “fundamentalist” who see anything remotely not specifically mentioned in scripture or sunnah to be false.
I found it in this book by Dr. Qanta Ahmed who is herself a Muslim.
I don’t have In the Land of Invisible Women right here in front of me, so I can’t tell you what page I read that on.
Now, I extrapolated a bit when I connected the “dead children interceding for parents to Allah” belief to Jihadists, and maybe fundamentalist Muslim beliefs too, but it seemed like it would apply in a case like this.
Dr. Ahmed described this belief as something that people say to parents who have had a child die. She was talking about children who die in car accidents, not suicide bombers though. Apparently, children dying in car wrecks is distressingly common in Saudi Arabia. However, there are folks who think that dead children can soften Allah’s heart toward their parents’ entry into heaven.
Extrapolated a* bit*. Something said to grieving parents of dead children is applied to fundamentalists who allegedly sent their kids as suicide bombers. That’s not extrapolating. That’s running to Mars with it.
Well, if the parents did have that belief, and did this to their own seven-year-old, that could be part of their reasoning behind doing such a thing.
Perhaps they were only thinking of sending their child straight to heaven, but perhaps there was self interest in the act as well.
We find such a motive repellent, but that doesn’t mean it would never occur to someone. Especially someone with such extreme religious views.
That would not be an extrapolation, that would be the sheer invention.
The idea of the intercession is the exact opposite of the ‘fundamentalist’ - that is the Salafiste - belief system.
Since you actually have no such knowledge, perhaps best not to invent it.
Indeed.
Since when has “your religious book actually says the opposite of that” ever been persuasive to religious fundamentalists?
[QUO<script id=“gpt-impl-0.8026977604914709” src=“https://securepubads.g.doubleclick.net/gpt/pubads_impl_107.js”></script>TE=AK84;19870460]Extrapolated a* bit*. Something said to grieving parents of dead children is applied to fundamentalists who allegedly sent their kids as suicide bombers. That’s not extrapolating. That’s running to Mars with it.
[/QUOTE]
Okay, why would YOU think these parents would send their seven-year-old on a suicide mission?
Ramira, feel free to chime in as well. Educate this ignorant Westerner.
They wanted to expand her horizons.
What he said was basically would for an American be something like saying that Christian fundamentalists would support abortion. Now maybe somewhere some fundamentalist does. However generally that runs counter to belief and intepretation that cohort holds so you would be right in being skeptical.
Salafists fconsider the idea of intercession and saints to be dead wrong. The word they use to describe such concepts is “bidah”, literally “innovation” but here having a sense of corrupting the belief and basically the worst insult they can give.
So yes, I doubt what he presumes very very much.
Okay, you’ve convinced me. These parents blew their kid up for completely selfless reasons. How noble of them.
And I’m a “she”, by the way.
You completely misunderstand.
It is that the ‘explanation’ given by the Two Cats is in complete contradiction to the Takfiri Salafiste internal theology.
It was just ignorant bullshitting asserting a fictional reason.
The sick theology of the Takfiri Salafiste does not allow for the intercession, but it does idealize the martyrdom via the suicide (itself a form of the bida3 but they have normalized).
the extreme ideological support to the idea of the death in the violent martyrdom.
This is internally consistent to that ideology. The intercession is a traditional, Sufiste style thinking this ideology violently and explicetely rejects (and indeed is the basis in their ideology for the hateful declaration of takfir, of the apostasy, on other believers).
What a massive straw man you construct.
Just becaue AK and I are telling you that your fictional imagining of the rational of the Takfiri action is wrong does not mean we are defending the actual action.
You must make a lot of Costco trips as I imagine being such a giant asshole requires an awful lot of toilet paper. Then again, you seem more the type to just let it dribble out and leave a trail along the street.
There are 1.6 billion muslims in the world: the notion that the actions of two of them, even if true, somehow define or illuminate any characteristics of the other 1.6 billion is beyond ridiculous.
I know you’re relatively new here, but we strive for better.
the first education is not to invent and assert as the facts the supposed beliefs with respect to a religion and a belief system you clearly do not know much about.
I certainly myself would not go around making the stateements about the beleifs of the extreme Protestant sects of the USA that I have read one book about, I know better - so I have read about the snake handling beliefs, I have no strong idea about this belief system and would not be so stupid as to “extrapolate” about them.
I know this is the Pit, but perhaps more Westerners would be willing to learn about Muslim beliefs if they were spoken to with less condescension and arrogance. Something plentiful in your posts on this Board.
If you were truly interested in educating folks on Islam, you wouldn’t be such a snot about it.
If the story’s even true…
It’s easy for us to sit, point and pass judgment on this (Syrian) couple. But we don’t know their life nor what demons haunt them every day.
If I’m ever accused of a crime, I want you on my jury.
More than one decade here tells me that there is no end to the bigottry and the ignorance, and I am not paid to be your educator.
The example is simple enough, I do not assert what the christians believe as I do not have that knowledge, and it is not hard to avoid not making stupid, ignorant statements.
Otherwise, when there is less of the gross hostility and the bigotry, then maybe I can say it is worth it to be kinder to the obvious ignorant stupidity and the obvious ignorance.
In any case, rather than assume and admit any error and your pure invention of an assertion of fact, you complain we are not nice to you when it is pointed out you have asserted a pure fiction as a ‘fact’.
The Westerners give no fucks about the Muslim beliefs and there is not going to be any learning about them, if we avoid the fate of the European Jews, we will be lucky. It makes me sympathetic to the Israel aliya at one level.
Who’s extrapolating now, doofus?
Extrapolating: I don’t know, the person who made the blanket statement about what “fundamentlists” of a certain religion believe, without having any knowledge about them and just “extrapolating” from a book they read that does not even state such things?
Of course there are the butt hurt people who rather than admit that they made up complete a non factual assertion, will make the complaints and play the martyr rather than openly admit their inventions and their gross errors.
This can of course give us some insight into the psychology of the partisan who closes out the contradictory information and reacts to correction by the attacks and the denials.
For the word doofus, I think this means someone who is stupid, uninformed and clumsy. Okay you think this applies to the persons who showed you completely invented some “facts” about the beliefs (we can use the pretext ‘extrapolated’ to make the excuses of course, but then if that is the case, I can extrapolate on this same basis that Trump intends to have the concentration camps, I read it somewhere).
But you do not need to worry, the SDMB is a safe space, it is fine here to assert the protocols kind of discourse, it is only necessary to be very pollite as if we are in an English tea room discussing the possible inferiority of the wogs in the sudan.