I think it’s pretty well established (and not in this thread) that Jeffery was a crook. He’s been accused of that by many people. Where we lose touch with reality is the accusation that he was in bed with the Mafia and MI5 and killed Hendrix for money.
Correct.
It is possible Hendrix somehow pocketed some Vesparax and took them earlier - but it is unlikely according to the scenario we are being told. I doubt he took any sleeping pills at the party. It wouldn't make sense. So it is more likely Hendrix took those pills after his arrival back at the Samarkand Hotel around 3:10 to 3:15am.
You are following correct logic. - Thank you - The obvious thing we need to find out is the likely time period it took for Hendrix's blood to show the 3.9mg level of barbiturate? We would then impose the "triangulation" timescale I outlined into this determined time. Once we get a graph line for this barbiturate ingestion time period we can compare the other graph lines of functional capacity and blood alcohol level in relation to it. Another part of the triangle is Dannemann's and Wright's stories and how they line up with this information.
I agree and also noted that. The coroner needs to define the "full stomach" to determine what you ask. What is most important here is the stomach's condition being on the incriminating end of the scale which a full stomach would be in this instance.
Let's be honest here. The reason the Colorado State chart shows the average stomach emptying time as being right on the money with the coroner's claim is because that is the well-known average. That's why they show it in the link. It doesn't take a genius to figure out that the reason the volunteer's digestion times are exactly in synch with the coroner's claim is because that is the average digestion time. It didn't verify in the volunteer sample for no reason. What I love about these challengers is that even when their own examples come in precisely in your favor they still try to force it as working against you. In my opinion we can use that as an accurate barometer of their credibility.
There's no doubt we need a closer analysis of the rice stomach contents. That's exactly what I'm calling for and is best handled in a credible, professional court venue. This should have been done at the Inquest in October 1970. And it's criminal that it wasn't.And now it’s time for the Was Jimi Hendrix Murdered? Forensic Internet Poll, guaranteed accurate to within 100 mg% either way. Vote for your preferred choice(s) and don’t all cram into the voters’ booth at once. Answers will be compiled and sent to Colorado State University, which will prepare a pretty graph of the findings in multiple colors, suitable for framing.
Vote for:
a) The inquest findings were correct, and Hendrix died of asphyxiation after vomiting under the influence of a sedative drug and wine.
b) Hendrix was murdered by drowning in wine. The guilty party is
1. Monika Danneman
2. Jeffery the crooked manager
3. MI5
4. The Mafia
5. Tappy Wright
6. Eric Burdon
7. the Queen
8. Anyone residing in or visiting the environs of Greater London during the
time period in question, the particulars don’t matter
c) I’m very very confused and need more time for deliberations
d) I don’t give a rat’s ass, but it’s fun demolishing nutbar conspiracy
theories
e) Dr. Bannister as presented by various sources is the sorriest excuse for
an M.D. since bloodletting went out of favor
f) Monika Dannemann was kind of hot, if you like wasted dominatrix types
g) Jimi Hendrix is still alive, since dead people don’t release new albums
I’ll go on record as voting for a), d) and e).
As extra incentive for participation, a randomly selected voter will be invited to a special wine and barbiturate party hosted by Hendrix conspiracy enthusiasts at the London Palladium. Doc Bannister and the original Crazy Wadhams ambulance crew will be on hand for resuscitation in case things get out of hand.
Colonel Mustard, in the parlor, with the cabernet.
It should be clarified that voting is open only to those with common sense.
(crickets)
If this is true, then you have established the prospect that Jeffrey may have been fiddling the books. Well done. I had not appreciated the detail of this earlier. I am not sure how $50,000 payments to musicians being recorded as $10,000 payments advances Jeffrey’s financial position (as opposed to potentially easing the tax positions of the band members), but let’s assume he was stealing as opposed to fiddling the tax.
The assumption that Jeffrey was stealing is not evidence of murder. It is still less evidence about CIA/MI5/mafia involvement. To get evidence of murder, you have to press your hopeless speculations about timing, drug and alcohol ingestion and so on, and we have been at pains to point out to you why that is going nowhere.
And it is still an assumption. Do you know how difficult it would be to prove fraud after 40 years? The books are almost certainly lost, the bank records are almost certainly gone (banks don’t keep records forever). Any inquiry re-investigating this is going to be hamstrung by these problems.
I hasten to say that putting money in a bank that other crooks use takes you nowhere - loads of crooks put money into Swiss banks, Channel Island banks, etc. There is always a country whose banks are the current flavour of the month for dodgy deposits. Doesn’t mean that all the crooks who take advantage of that are otherwise connected to each other.
And none of it means that there was “no serious investigation of Hendrix’s death”. I have mentioned above that this use of language by you is just code for “no investigation that comes to the same conclusion as me”. It is manifestly a not very subtle example of assuming what you have to prove. Yet you continue to speak like this. It does not advance your credibility.
I’m going a) and d).
I’d actually prefer this was an Elvis-style conspiracy, and that Jimi is still alive. I vote he is now Morgan Freeman (who, by the way runs a blues bar in Mississipi). Did anyone ever see them in the same room together? Note that in 2008 Freeman claimed to have a car accident which left his LEFT HAND damaged. This is suspiciously just before the 2009 book came out by Wright. Obviously Freeman is lying low, making excuses with a “convenient” explanation for why he can’t play the guitar if asked.
By the way, I have some unclaimed money in a bank account in the Bahamas if that will tip the randomness generator my way for the ticket to the London Palladium. 
No, Jeffery was ripping Hendrix off blind. Being desperate to gain fame Hendrix took Jeffery's word that he would handle the business end and set-up some offshore accounts that would accrue into later riches. Jeffery's management cut was the unprecedented sum of 40% when most managers took 10-15%. His perfidious nature was witnessed by Eric Burdon and the Animals who ended up separating from Jeffery for the same reasons. He wasn't under-reporting to up their cut on the tax shelter end he was doing it for self-enrichment. He was a crooked bastard, and one, I suspect, whose crooked doings could land him in jail if exposed.
Only if you ignore the obvious and stretch towards the fringe excuses. I stick with my assertion that there was more than enough normal evidence to at least *investigate* Jeffery which was unexplainably never done!
Confession anyone?
I'd love to see Tappy Wright given a polygraph.
Are you saying it would be difficult to prove the otherwise-obvious motives for murder here? The records are most certainly destroyed as is legally done according to bank rules.
Noel Redding was escorted out of band membership shortly after he inquired where exactly the suitcases of cash they were earning from their concerts were going?
Which is why I try to stay away from involving that suggestion for now. But it has to be admitted that if there was such a connection this common assassination-funding CIA bank would not *hurt* the suggestion. It could be that the BCCI bank was the best well-known bank of the time for tax shelterers and it was just a coincidence that Hendrix's assets shared that same bank. But I suggest you research the background of that bank. The CIA had a deal with the mob that they would allow them to control the hotels and casinos in the Caribbean if they helped prevent another Cuba. CIA took a cut of mob proceeds through BCCI as payment for this truce. Those proceeds were directed to covert ops funds that funded anti-communist operations in Europe that also involved the European mafia. The French mob was allowed to process heroin in Marseilles in return for fighting leftist movements in France. The "French Connection" is based on this true story. So while Jeffery's stolen loaves might have been in this oven by coincidence the 'bakery' itself fits the picture perfectly. Considering Jeffery's MI5 membership it is rather like arguing that the player is dressed in the team uniform and out on the field but we have no proof he is playing in the game.
No, you can't say that. There's more than enough basic proof to show the Inquest failed to answer some very basic questions. It is generally accepted that the Inquest was a quick process that never sought to look into any other cause than accidental drug overdose. As I mentioned before if we compared other cases of such murder where suspects were involved with equal motive and evidence I think we would see that the authorities took action and investigated in most cases where such evidence existed. I think you are committing a self-exposing exercise by attempting to deny Dannemann's stories were quickly refutable and incriminating. Or that Jeffery didn't have a plainly-apparent motive that would normally at least be considered. Forget the fact Jeffery made some clumsy bungles like acting like he wasn't aware Hendrix was dead when cohorts contacted him. That was the obvious attempt at an alibi it was and the sign of someone trying to cover-up knowledge and guilt. Jeffery acted like a guilty man when he sat outside in the limousine at Hendrix's funeral.
The doctors really screwed-up here. If they saw unusual wine in Hendrix they should have reported it right away. If Bannister realized Hendrix was dead for many hours he should have pressed it. Bannister needed to be at the Inquest and tell what he knew. Someone on the internet made a good point. If this was John Lennon or Paul McCartney this pathetic investigation would never have been tolerated. There's no way these flimsy stories would have sailed through the Inquest unquestioned. It is kind of obvious the reason the doctors did come forward to tell what they did was because of their realization that the Inquest had made a serious blunder. It is just coldly, defiantly running against all of the obvious grain here to suggest there was nothing unusual in the lack of investigation of Hendrix's death when everything we know says otherwise...Good to hear you say that. I was a bit reluctant to put him on the suspect list.
Which reminds me, you haven’t voted in the poll yet.
I gather you’re referring here to an illicit relationship between Jeffery and Monika Danneman. But what is this ‘bakery’ of which you speak?
All credible sources say Jeffery worked with MI5 during his British National Service.
I've never seen any challenges of it outside this thread.
We know Jeffery did 2 years of National Service. Unless you can produce something that shows he was in the regular army, we have to assume he was in the MI5 since even Jeffery himself bragged about it. There are ZERO people who came forward and said "Oh yeah, Mike Jeffery was a good mate and we served together in the regular British Army in the so and so regiment based at so and so." Nobody. Nada. And this is a person widely and publicly accused of a notorious crime.
It makes sense that since the British Government stays dead quiet on this simple issue that Jeffery was in the spook corps. This is important because he claimed to have murdered people and others said he did insurance scams.Not true. None of your sources to this point have been credible.
Have you ever discussed it with anyone before?
This is nonsense.
As proved by the sources you are using, he is not “widely and publicly accused” of anything. A few people blame him for Hendrix’s death, but most people accept the obvious conclusion that Hendrix died by accident.
Do you know I can’t even find old Michael Jeffery’s birth date? Assuming he was in his late 30s when he died, he would be around 70 now. How many British senior citizens are patrolling the internet for stories about their ex army buddy, do you think?
You know Redding and Hendrix didn’t get along well, don’t you?
Thank goodness this MI5-trained criminal artist was too stupid to not go to the funeral in the first place.
There's no serious Hendrix observer who challenges Jeffery's MI5 membership. The lack of any formal acknowledgement or record of it is almost proof in itself.
My sources are more credible than your sources - which are *none*. You are arguing that I have no pants while having no legs yourself.
I doubt you will be able to find any source out there that questions Jeffery's MI5 membership. If you do, I'm sure they won't answer the points I made about his membership, just like yourself. There's a reason there's dead quiet out there on this.
Short, one-line answers not acceptable.
I think you just can't refute my point.
You're just in contempt of the facts. Google Tappy Wright's confession to see if this wasn't widely available in public. He was all over the internet and on radio shows. He even had a touring speaking show in England.
Most people haven't been exposed to the true facts of this case. So far the British Government has successfully prevented them from coming forward. And most people aren't a trained medical doctor who came forward to say he witnessed drowning by wine.
No, you can't give an answer like that unless you acknowledge that all the other evidence like the stomach contents, dried hard vomit, Bannister's and others' observation that Hendrix was dead for a long time, Burdon's admission that he was called "at daybreak", Dannemann's proven lies, and other factors all point towards this. There's no excuse for not further interrogating Wright and giving him a lie detector test. After all, we have an alleged confession from the man accused. Valid investigations use knowledge, methods, and equipment to seek the facts. Cover-ups seek excuses not to do so where there's really no reason not to.
For your edification I suggest studying intelligence agency methods. When people get too close they do something called a "limited hang-out". What that is is a story that gives enough true information to make it exposing but does it in a way that controls the content and outcome in order to lead people away from the true perpetrators. So if Jeffery was guilty and did it for CIA the limited hang-out in this case would be providing a confession that seals Jeffery's guilt but in such a way that satisfies the public's interest in a closing way. That's why there's been no follow-through on the "confession" and also why there is no official investigation. What "most people think" is highly irrelevant in relation. "Most people" thought Saddam was involved with 9-11.
What does that tell you???
If Jeffery was just a regular army member he would have a regular army record. Hendrix was a regular army member. Hence we have a regular army member record easily accessible for Hendrix. There's none for Jeffery. There is no record for Jeffery because, like most intel spooks, their records are concealed. (Hello?)
Could it be Jeffery's records are mysteriously unavailable because he was MI5??? (???) You are suggesting that researchers and authors that have collected and described some highly arcane and hard to access histories and facts surrounding Hendrix were somehow unable to get Michael Jeffery's army service record? A rather preposterous suggestion, considering. Especially since this is the most controversial matter involving Hendrix.
(He was born either in 1931 or 33. I forget which.)
Hendrix had artistic and personality differences with Noel. Hendrix was ready to make a change in the band's sound once he had gotten to this stage in his career. However, if you understood the band's situation, it was in Michael Jeffery's interest, and was his stated intent, to keep the Experience together because it was the model he intended to exploit and control for the nefarious purposes already described. Jeffery actually tried to get Noel back in to the band. So the correct context of this is, although Jeffery stridently wanted Noel in the band he consented to his leaving because Noel's protestations over the proceeds was the more threatening of the two options.
We explained this at length further back in the thread.
Jeffery tried to avoid the funeral and was going to until cornered by cohorts where his ducking out of the funeral would be more incriminating than going. So he went and stayed in the limousine.
You're forgetting your side tried that already and it was refuted (without response).
Jeffery was a guilty man who had murdered Hendrix and behaved in a way that suggested it. He later confessed privately to close associates. The reason the evidence for murder continues to show up and prevail over all attempts against it is because it is real and Hendrix was murdered. True evidence has a tendency to do that. The "few people" being his closest friends and others in the most important positions to know.
We can, once again, just plainly ignore that his closest female friend Devon Wilson was running around telling people Jeffery murdered Hendrix and mysteriously ended up dead out the 8th floor window of the Chelsea Hotel.
- - -
When I first heard of conspiracy theories over Jeffery's death I thought it was ridiculous. Because how could they direct two planes toward each other and why would they kill another 150 people in the process?
On March 5th 1973 France had an air traffic control strike that lead to military controllers coming in and directing commercial traffic. Jeffery was flying back from Spain to go to court in London over Hendrix's proceeds. The Iberia Airlines jet he was flying in was accidentally directed to the same level as another aircraft and had a mid-air collision killing him and all the other 67 people on board. The other plane was damaged but managed to land safely.
As much as I try to avoid it this has an intel fingerprint on it. The strike could easily have been provoked and arranged as could the air traffic. Or the air traffic directing could be done in a hasty act where they realized there was an opportunity to off Jeffery without suspicion.
The people who did this would really need for there to be no follow-through investigation.You don’t see a hilarious contradiction between these two statements?
A “serious Hendrix observer” has standing on a par with “serious 9/11 Truther”, in other words, none.
No, I think you’d acknowledge that a denial would be more convincing proof. Come to think of it, the existence of both a lack of formal acknowledgement and a lack of denial, when taken together, are incredibly sinister and are virtual proof, even better than if they’d admitted it.
Which, according to you, is incriminating. So why didn’t he go inside and avoid incrimination? I hear rock star funerals have pretty interesting refreshments.
Thank you for supplying some extra touches to the impressive (though by now slightly unwieldy) sinister-MI5-mob-thug-running-roughshod-through-the-Jeffery’s-stolen-loaves-insurance-scam-message-in-the-dew-fabricating-onus discharging-hysterical-wine-soaked-groupie-girlfriend-without-a-flat-cleaning-reason-cornered-by-cohorts-Eric Burdon-at-dawn-common sense-Third Reich-Black Bomber-we-are-not-idiots-Tappy-Wright-touring-speaking-show-18-inch tube/metal sucker-fountains-o’-pure-wine-gushing-from-the-windpipe-sword-cuts-both-ways-casinos-in-the-Caribbean-literary roadie-barbiturate-polluting-common sense-crazy Wadhams–Satanistic-retarded-spook corps-Intel-fingerprinted-Iberia Airlines-crash-clumsy-bungles-digestion-noble gas fart-exploding-extreme evacuation-process-in-the-Resuscitation Room-3.9 mg-percent-5 mg-per-100 ml-profuse-dense-vomit-dodgy-deposits-event-how-dare-you-undeniable-ballpark-of-bullseye-firm-very-dangerous-criminal forensic-ouija-board-prosecution-of murder theory.
It’s a doozy.
So jetblast what do you bring to the table here? You know what professional background I bring to this. You know what jackmannii does, and maybe some of the others here.
What does your professional background bring to this?
I ask, because your arguments are not really arguments at all; substantially they are just assertions. So what do you bring such that we should accept your assertions?
So based on this logic, Frank Abagnale Jr. really was an airline pilot and Ferdinand Waldo Demarra really was a surgeon.
(Note:
With this business about how “MI5 caused a mid-air plane crash killing dozens of people with the expectation they could silence Jeffery to prevent their role in the Hendrix murder from coming out”, I believe that Jetblast has finally, conclusively jumped the unicorn.
(sidles away uneasily)
Bold added.
Whoah, whoah, whoah. Hold the phone. Earlier you said this:
That was in response to this from me:
So there was litigation about Hendrix’s assets? Even though you claimed to have demonstrated that no-one would have any interest in, or capacity to, conduct such litigation? Who was pursuing it? In the pleadings, were there allegations of theft? Who won? Was Jeffrey a party to the litigation or only a witness?
And your cavalier use of the word “easily” shows a serious disconnect with reality. This sort of exponential explosion in murder makes even Macbeth look sane. On this principle, MI5 would necessarily have to have depopulated the world by now just to cover up the murder of one man, since each murder breeds the need to cover itself up by committing hundreds of subsequent ones. A veritable pyramid scheme of murder.
And how does MI5 (a British organisation) persuade the French military air controllers to murder 150 people? They don’t have a dog in the fight.
Naturally enough, of course, you will follow the SOP of conspiracists and rope them in too, because you have to to keep this big ball o’ poo in the air. Now, the CIA, MI5 and the French military wanted Hendrix dead, and were prepared to kill hundreds of innocent people to do it. The entire Western security apparatus were now essentially In On It. Geez, with this level of animosity, I’m surprised the Russians didn’t rescue him, just on general principles.
Or maybe they did. Without DNA identification, how do we know it was Hendrix who actually died? Who identified the body? Support grows for my increasingly plausible Morgan Freeman theory…
What on earth had Hendrix done (that was not done by huge numbers of other rock stars) to warrant this level of ridiculous overkill? Shag Pat Nixon?
And how does Jeffrey merely wanting to steal money fit with this? How does he get killed when it was his plot to begin with? And if his plan was to kill to cover up his theft, how does he get MI5 to buy in?
This is now well in the category of Not Even Wrong, it’s so staggeringly incoherent.
Jumped the unicorn?
The OP has jumped a Bremen Town Musicians pile of unicorns, T-Rexes, Saturn V space craft, grassy knolls and World Trade Centres.
Which, if it happened literally, I would actually pay to see, so I suppose I can’t complain.
What do Michael Jeffery’s army friends, if any, care what you are saying on the internet?
People commit suicide sometimes. You have not proved anything unusual happened to her. You’ve implied a connection between her statements about Jeffery and her death, but that doesn’t mean a connection exists.
I don’t believe you. Ridiculous conspiracy theories seem to be your stock in trade.
You never try to avoid this. You suggest it at every available opportunities, no matter how stupid the theory is. You can’t even agree with yourself about whether Hendrix was killed by MI5 or for money by Jeffery. If Jeffery killed him to cover up his theft, why did some government kill him?
Just to ask the obvious: Assuming this unsourced tale is true, how is Jeffery making money by reporting $50,000 payments to band members as $10,000? I can easily see it as rip-off had it gone the other way: pay the band members $10K, tell Jimi you paid them $50K, pocket the difference. But as described, it sounds more like extremely sloppy record keeping or a dubious tax dodge than Jeffery ripping off Hendrix.