See?
Do I have to do everything around here!?
The one thing that is clear is that many people are seeing a massive amount of detail in one, grainy, long-range video from an unhelpful angle and where the key action immediately prior to contact is obscured by the victim. There is no clear “push”, there is no clear “deviation” There is a reaction by the runner a split-second before and during the contact at 26 seconds into that original video, but no definite “push”. his arms go up only after the contact and she falls down flat on her arse and then bounces and tips over backwards into the road. Had she been pushed by a hefty bloke with closing speed of >10mph she would have flown into the road. It looks like a simple slight collision but at those speeds it is easily enough to knock you down and cause pain and injury.
Try it, recreate the jogger and walker speeds and do a slight collision with an arm (when the walker is not expecting it) and then a deliberate “push” and see what happens. This video looks like the former to me.
I have accidentally collided with another pedestrian while I was running. I am familiar with the forces involved. You are completely wrong.
ETA: Heck no, I will not be deliberately surprising walkers by pushing them! What a very odd suggestion.
What is clear is that you are going to stick to your guns no matter what, but let me add to the chorus of people saying that you are completely and utterly wrong.
He pushed her, its clear and obvious that he pushed her, anybody with eyes in their head can see that he pushed her, and how anybody can pretend any differently is rather strange to me.
You are a Defense lawyer’s dream.
It was a definite push, and this is clear to pretty much everyone but you. He shoves her. We define a shove as using one or both arms to push another person, which he clearly does here. Clearly. He uses his arms to push her. It is simply not possible that you do not see this. Between seconds 03 and 05, his right arm, then his left arm both come up and make a shoving motion.
They slow it down. Slow motion. Between seconds 24 and 28. His arms come up and out is a shoving motion. And it’s in slow motion.
I don’t think he tried to kill her. He may have been unaware that a bus was coming up behind them. But he was a dick and he pushed her.
He could not have been unaware that there was busy traffic in the traffic lane - there was traffic pacing him the whole way - and, insofar as he appears to be a grown up, he could not have been unaware of what the consequences might be if you shove someone into busy traffic.
Also, note that at the start of the video, the jogger’s on the left side of the path (left from his vantage point). A man in a suit walks down the path toward the jogger, along the traffic divider, eventually passing the jogger on the jogger’s right. The jogger ignores this man.
It’s only when the woman comes into camera range that the jogger veers right, eventually colliding with her and shoving her towards the traffic lane.
It’s a damn shame that they apparently can’t find him.
He could have been distracted. It happens.
Distracted, perhaps. Not stopping upon knocking her down, and not stopping on the return run, do not suggest momentary distraction or absentmindedness, and instead suggest deliberation. The question then is why the deliberation – thus my steroid-rage guess.
and I have accidentally collided with and shoved people while running. The way they behave and the forces imparted are very different…so…one anecdote each yes?
No, of course don’t do that, just get a willing accomplice to try it out.
No, I am perfectly comfortable with accepting that I’m wrong and if better evidence came forward to show a deliberate push I’d have no problem with saying so. I personally think the opposite is true. Everyone has decided that an intentional push is the only answer (it is certainly the most interesting and sensational answer) and so are interpreting the video in that light.
I’m not pretending otherwise, I simply don’t think it is at all clear that he “pushed” her. He certainly collided with her but at that point we have two grainy, blurry figures at the top of the video frame and anyone clearly seeing anything from those few frames is stretching things somewhat.
How do you factor in the victim saying he pushed her?
you are the one talking in certainties where none exist.
they do come up but at the low framerate and resolution of the video it is not clear at all whether that happens before the first contact or in response to the first contact. The angle of the video and the fact that the victim blocks the view of the jogger until the contact has already happened makes a lot of what you say guesswork at best.
before the first contact or in response to it? And how does she fall? does she not spin around on her axis and fall on her arse?, i.e. more like a slight body check than a push?
on the basis of that video alone you’d have a very hard time proving it beyond reasonable doubt in a court of law.
There is certainly a chance he did it on purpose but I simply don’t subscribe to the certainly that others have. I reckon it is probably 80/20 accidental and he’s a dick for stopping. What odds would you give to it being accidental?
She probably saw and felt his arms come up at the point of collision, as shown on the video. Which is exactly what would happen if you saw yourself running into an unavoidable collision with someone and you have a split-second to do something about it, your arms come up in self-defence. Again, anyone who has played contact sports knows this.
So your default is not assume what she says she experienced (which is supported with what the video shows) didn’t happen.
Sure, it still could not be true, but why is the default to not believe her?
There’s one in every crowd.
I disagree that the video conclusively shows a deliberate push. I absolutely believe she thinks she was pushed and have no reason to doubt her sincerity. The two are not mutually exclusive.
So you think your assessment of an “inconclusive” video is probably more accurate than her assessment of the event which she experienced?
Someone should push them out.
Who said conclusively?
I said supported. It doesn’t invalidate what she said, so why not believe her? Nice use of “thinks” to cast doubt on her persona testimony.