["Judge not, that ye be not judged":] What Part of No Don't You Understand?

[Polycarp]

I wrote a long post discussing good vs. bad Pharasaism, what evaluation of action vs. judgment of person is proper, etc., and the hamsters ate it – wise hamsters; it was a poor post.

Badchad, would you do a point-by-point short-sentence runthrough of where you see me as wrong or hypocritical from your perspective? I think I grasp what you’re objecting to, and if so I can answer it – but I’d like to see single brief points to address; what we have going here is a nebulous set of concepts which mean that we will indeed be talking past each other. Has IzzyR summarized your position well? If so, let’s debate on that basis. If not, gimme some specific points you see at contention, and I’ll answer them.

Thanks.

[andros]

BTW, only one e in judgment.

Not true. “Judgement” is a perfectly acceptable alternative spelling according to every dictionary I can lay my hands on.

Nice try, though. :rolleyes:

[Zenster]

*Originally posted by Zoe *
Zenster, isn’t there a difference in being discerning and in being judgmental? When I read “Judge not,” I am thinking that the verse is about not judging other people’s worthiness or unworthiness as if I were some kind of gods myself. It doesn’t mean that I won’t make judgments regarding the person I marry or the people I allow to babysit with my grandchildren.

In reading through several threads on Christianity in the last few months, I know that for whatever reason, there are some Christians here whose love I do not feel.

Zoe, I did not mean to ignore your post. Thanks for requesting clarification. Trisk defined personal judgment rather well in his post. I’ll go along with what he has said, though not including the theistic angles because I’m a devout agnostic.

[Zenster]

*Originally posted by badchad *
… As to your attempts to respond to my points: they are simply word games.

Really? That’s what I would say your points are …

badchad, I haven’t seen a lot of your replies at these boards, but I have read many of tomndebb’s and find them to be among the most consistently well-informed and clearly written posts that appear here. You may wish to examine whatever critiques that have been made of your statements a little more closely before issuing such a challenge. Just a little unsolicited advice.

[badchad]

tomndebb:

This discussion. You made two claims that the “liberals” would have to dodge the question

Looking back my said that liberal Christians would ignore the verses I posted as usual. I just gave verses and didn’t ask any questions. The light bulb that is popping up now however is the realization that you’re a “liberal Christian” and that you have factually shown that the verses I posted were not ignored. Is that true? For some reason I had you pegged as a well read onlooker like Diogenes the Cynic. If that is the point you are making then I will concede it to you, though I’ll respect you a little less for believing that crap.

and when your claims were noted as erroneous, you switched the point to say that the fundies would disagree–avoiding the issue that you have mischaracterized the “liberal” position.

Well if your saying that I erroneously assumed that liberal Christians would ignore those verses I posted and then you came around, ok. If think your commentary on the verses in question showed that I posted them in error, and there is no contradiction between them and what Jesus made god say, then I say hogwash.

You continue playing the game in this post, claiming that because you don’t believe in a soul, the actions described by Christian writers have to be the same for all the uses of the verb “to judge” as you would characterize them.

Your mistaken. To clarify I said that I did not believe in the soul and as such I would have to be judging Polycarp’s behaviors. When I was referring to the “Christian perspective” I put in parenthesis the “guilty parties” who along with me were being accused of judging. I think that was His4ever and Nomadic_one. I mentioned that if you asked them they would say they are only judging behavior as well. I did not at this time equate my atheistic beliefs with that of the writers of the bible just the members of this board.

They are not–and you know it, but acknowledging that would not provide you as much amusement.

Oh I think they are and I think you know the points you made did a poor job of demonstrating the contrary, but acknowledging this wouldn’t give you a graceful exit to this argument.

Polycarp:

I wrote a long post discussing good vs. bad Pharasaism, what evaluation of action vs. judgment of person is proper, etc., and the hamsters ate it – wise hamsters; it was a poor post.

Let me guess. 10,000 words on what you do is good judgment but what others do is bad judgment.

Badchad, would you do a point-by-point short-sentence runthrough of where you see me as wrong or hypocritical from your perspective? I think I grasp what you’re objecting to, and if so I can answer it – but I’d like to see single brief points to address; what we have going here is a nebulous set of concepts which mean that we will indeed be talking past each other. Has IzzyR summarized your position well?

IzzyR summed me up very well in this thread. However, what I see as your hypocrisy was better stated on the other thread (titled the godhead something) and how you cherry pick the bible to support your morality that is pretty similar to secular humanism, yet call it Christianity. Saying you follow the teachings of Christ when you only follow the easy stuff, and saying that you, as human, just fall short of Christ’s expectations but later admit that you don’t even agree with some of what Christ’s teachings are. Strangely enough when Christ disagrees with what is our societies predominant secular morality.

If so, let’s debate on that basis. If not, gimme some specific points you see at contention, and I’ll answer them.

Well this wasn’t a rhetorical question.

Polycarp:
But, my friend, Scripture repeatedly characterizes God as predominantly loving

How much scripture do you have to ignore (or define as non-scripture) to come up with such a statement?