It does, and Miller’s post stands. But here I’m inquiring about the general, not the specific.
Toleration of blatant rules lawyering trolls is not good for the long term health of the Dope. You have a simple rule that covers things well. Instead your post plays into rules lawyering. This doesn’t seem like a very sound idea.
If you don’t think Shodan was too much of a jerk overall, fine, plenty will disagree, more won’t even care. But if you start trying to define more rules and build that bright line that posters like Octopus want so much, you will without question make the place only more welcoming for trolls.
The rule doesn’t seem complicated to me: Don’t use the personal suffering that a person has shared as a weapon against them. If Rita has shared about her double mastectomy, or Leroy about his cancer-related orchidectomy, mocking them for no longer being a real woman/man is a jerk move. If Frank talks about his kid’s anxiety, mocking him for causing that anxiety is awful. If someone is caring for an elderly parent with Alzheimer’s, saying that they got the disease so they could forget what a failure their child was is inexcusable.
How is this complicated?
Wow!
I find it difficult to believe there is no punishment available to sanction Shodan.
I’m not privvy to every insult he’s thrown at other posters. Buy, with ‘just’ this particular incident in mind he was being a ‘jerk’. There’s no other way to read it. He meant it to hurt and belittle. The fact that ‘margin’ is a woman makes it misogynistic.
He knows it was meant to be hurtful. He’ll never admit that or offer a disingenuous apology. But he can/should be punished. IMHO.
That’s just swell if we assume every member reads every post in every thread and, therefore, knows that Jebediah posted about the time he fell dick-first into a prickly pear patch before telling Jebediah to go fuck a cactus.
I think the rule could very easily be something like “don’t be egregiously jerkish, even in the Pit”. One instance could be a note or warning, depending on how bad, and so on.
There is a context there: this swipe margin made at Shodan about fifteen posts earlier. Also, this shot at post 93. The comment wasn’t completely out-of-the-blue, it was in response to several insulting posts margin made to Shodan.
Time after time? There was one thread in 2011, and the post two days ago. That’s twice in eight years.
Calling people “crazy” as an insult is pretty common, even when you don’t have certain knowledge of the other person’s mental health status. Specific references to “psych wards” aren’t exactly unprecedented. Here’s Emiliana using it as an insult against another poster a few years ago. Here’s you using it as an insult, although not against a poster. That’s two from a very casual search of the specific term “psych ward” in the Pit, and not bothering to click through any of the results that were five plus page monstrosities. I suspect I could turn up more if I looked for variations like “institution,” “loony bin,” etc.
two that we know about.
seriously, the mods can and should do better than this. :mad:
That’s nice. My opinion is that calling anyone a pedophile *purely as a insult *is wrong, and the person doing it is a jerk.
Call Epstein one sure. But not a anon poster just for a insult.
The irony is rather thick.
Thanks, but other than gun control, I think we agree more than you think.
Certainly, the rule is “No Personal insults”, a rule that works well in all other forums. Try it!
Because
Not entirely different. The evidence that Shodan was aware and deliberately referencing a shortish Pit thread from twelve years ago is pretty weak, which renders the question of, “Was this too mean?” moot. But even if that was conclusively established, I’m still not a fan of moderating stuff for being “too mean.”
Then you will have a board full of men who victim blame 11-year-old gang rape victims, attack rape victims in general against all evidence, describe women as “hysterical”, and in general behave like Shodan. That is not fighting ignorance. That is enabling it.
As best I can recall, the only people who have brought up the too mean argument are moderators. Too mean isn’t the issue. Off-fucking-limits is.
You don’t attack someone’s children or someone’s relationship with their children. You don’t attack someone’s actual mental health issues (as opposed to a mere “You’re crazy!”). You don’t insult someone’s physical disability.
So now it’s all margin’s fault? Nice victim blaming there, kudos. New levels of shitty. slow clap
The answer is pretty clear: you can be quite reprehensible in the Pit. I agree that some things should be off-limits and that someone who is not a complete jerk would apologize if they even inadvertently crossed that line. But the line itself is hard to cross in The Pit, so declared in this thread.
To my mind there is no question that Shodan is a jerk at best, across all fora. Not sure why he has not been reigned in better but his jerkishness is given wide berth for reasons that are hard to fathom. He has moments of adding value to discussions, if only by provoking some quality responses that the rest of us learn some things from, but only moments.
Overall he is a net negative to the board. IMHO.
OTOH The Pit is pretty easy to avoid. Meaningful, even respectful, conversation can and has broken out there, and creative funny invectives can sometimes be read, but mostly if one goes there one should expect to see people choosing to engage in ugly behaviors. And it is further clarified in this discussion that quite ugly indeed is okay there.
I do NOT think skipping over, or ignoring, trollish posters in discussions in other fora is a fair expectation. Hijacking trolls in particular should be stopped in their tracks there. But those who enter The Pit should not be surprised that they end up having to scrape some vile shit like Shodan’s posts off their shoes.
Again IMHO.
So calling him out for lying about the facts is unacceptable? I just want to get this clear. Shodan presents lies, gets called on it, and because he doesn’t use expletives it’s acceptable. What’s not acceptable is being sarcastic at the endless lies----and ALWAYS they are about rape victims, women, etc., etc., He tells the same lies over and over again, but he’s polite about it. You can’t call him out on something he chooses to do, but it’s acceptable for him to accuse rape victims of lying, for decades without proof, but every last response to him must be perfect and polite and come with cites.
decent people sure don’t.
and what about people who don’t even think that’s being a jerk? decent people don’t want to be around them, not IRL and not online.