I didn’t write a fanfic.
If I were you, I’d revise that statement, REALLY FREAKIN’ FAST. Otherwise, you’re going to be having some copyright problems, my friend.
Beyond that, for the record, the pros never got a CHANCE to give you an opinion on the writing quality. Everyone assumed we’d be biased.
It’s neither here nor there, now, anyway. I’m out of here – nothing new, only more of the same, and no way out of these arguments… Dio, I only hope that someday, people start treating you the way you and yours the way you treat them. Of course, considering your sense of entitlement, I’m sure you’ll never understand why the universe is being so bloody unfair to you and your most magnificent ego, huh.
While I understand emotions have tended to run fairly hot in this thread, a mod has already stepped in to tell everyone to cool it with the personal insults. If you want to go to town on another poster, take it to the Pit.
This is also inappropriate. Focus on the argument all you want, but the discussion is not about individual posters. Again, the Pit is the better place for this type of comment.
I’m starting to think that DtC’s irrational vitriol towards screenwriters is the result of being a frustrated writer himself. Just a guess. Either that or a screenwriter murdered his puppy once.
And anyway, the quality of his screenplay completely notwithstanding, if he wrote it and it was produced for television or the Internet or movies or anywhere else, he’d deserve to be adequately compensated for it.
How can you have participated in dozens of pages worth of discussion on this topic, complete with vitriolic screeds against the greedy and talentless writers, and not know what a Webisode is? I mean, seriously?
It took you a month, maybe, to write that script? The implication you gave in the earlier threads was that writing a better script than a common 'Til Death episode is easy and then you took forever and a day to get it done. I don’t think your victory is as clear-cut as you think it is.
I seriously doubt it, but I’ll take my chances.
Then how do explain all those pros, including you – giving their opinions in that thread?
What do you knowabout how I “treat” people, and what do I appear to feel “entitled” to? I’m expressing irritation at other people’s sense of entitlement (namely the WGA), but I han’t proposed that i’m entitled to a damn thing myself.
The issue of “promotional” webisodes is utterly ridiculous and it’s another aspect of the contract on which I wholly agree with the writers, same as fair payment and residuals.
On the other hand, I’d still like to hear the response to John Ridley.
as I explained many times in that thread, it wasn’t my job, I wasn’t getting paid, I actually have a job and other duties in my life and I was going to take my own sweet time. I also had to do my own research, unlike the real writers for that show. Pay me and give me consultants and I’ll speed things up.
So pissing a better script in the snow means if you give me a check and a bunch of flunkies I can write a better script? Interesting.
That’s actually a mischaracterization of the critique I posted. In addition to the minor issues, I pointed out what I thought were four significant problems:
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The wordiness of the dialog. Note that this is not the same as “length”. Fixing wordy dialog is not merely a matter of cutting but usually involves a substantial rewrite.
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The unnaturalness of some of the diction. Specifically I said: “It’s written as though its going to be read off the page, not spoken aloud. Some of the dialog is awkward or doesn’t align with the emotional tone that it will need to be delivered in.”
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The lack of multiple levels of emotional play.
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Unsteady characterizations with a lack of clear motivation.
You’re free to decide that I’m full of shit and that none of these criticisms are valid. However they do go well beyond “formatting and length”.
Listen, it’s your call whether you want to bail on this thread, but I think it would be very interesting to hear your takes on some of these issues. Letting this thread devolve into another digression on the nature of self-delusion would be a waste.
I would be extremely interested in your opinion on the Ridley piece linked by AzTeach for one. I lean pretty strongly pro-writer, but his article gave me pause. How would you respond to it - particularly, to his points about the combination of a closed shop and the squelching of dissent?
Thank you, AzT. Doing DtC a favor and posting a few extracts ended up unleashing his whirlwind (again), hopelessly hijacking the thread. I hope Elenfair does come back…
I’ve gotten way over the top with some of my statements, too hyperbolic, too dismissive, too sweeping…a whole bunch of stuff.
I apologize. I have a tendency to always want to battle my way out of minor disagreements rather than ever admit I’m wrong. When my back is against the wall, I dig a tunnel through the wall. It’s a personality flaw. I’m sorry.
I do respect anyone who can make a living at writing. I know that not all television is crap, and obviously I know that without writers there is no entertainment industry.
Give 'em what they want. I’m undoubtedly wrong on the conflict itself. I was recting against certain attitudes I perceived in the WGA but even if they’ve been sanctimonious that doesn’t make them wrong.
Mea Culpa. I’ve come close to being a jerk. I’m not really as much of a dickwad as it appears sometimes.
Apologies especialy to Elenfair who i’ve never had a problem with before this whole thing.
Thanks, Dtc. This always seemed to strime me as a bit atypical of you and I, for one, appreciate your apology.
I’m glad to hear you say that Diogenes. FWIW, I also had been feeling like your extreme position on the strike seemed to be at odds with the normal thoughtful tenor of your postings.
No, walking out the door implies quitting. As in, you leave, they try to hire someone else for the salary they were willing to pay, you try to find someplace else willing to pay the salary you want. Refusing to work AND preventing anyone else from doing the work instead until your demands are met is not “walking out the door.” I mean walking out the door and walking away, not walking out the door and then blocking it.
I ask for more money. If he refuses, I do a cost-benefit analysis as to the value of the job to me in time, money, self-respect, and benefits, and I decide if I will stay for the money she’s willing to pay, or leave to seek the money I think I deserve.
I don’t know. But when I left, I would leave, I wouldn’t insist on more money for myself while putting them out of work anyway.
Who are they stopping from working? No one’s stopping the networks from hiring scabs.
So when you’re employed by the only game in town, what do you do?
I can’t tell if you’re being disingenuous or not. THEY prevent other people from working for the producers. They make everyone who wants to work in that field belong to the union – membership is compulsory. And any union member who crosses picket lines may be reported and subject to unspecified reprecussions:
The only choice for dissenting union members is to go “fi-core” and even that may lead to blacklisting. This is what a striking guild member said about soap opera writers who went “fi-core”: “[T]hey’ve got people scabbing in there. We don’t know who. They shield their identity to protect them from repercussions from the guild.” Cite.
Any non-union member crossing the picket lines risks never being allowed to join the union. So long as the union contracts require the producers to hire union writers only, that means, literally, “you’ll never work in this town again.”
I’m making no comment on the justice of these reprecussions, but I don’t think the seriousness of them is in any doubt.
I already answered this: I decide if I’m going to stay and if I feel I can’t or shouldn’t, I leave. There are other jobs and there are other towns. That’s life for the vast majority of people who don’t belong to unions.
It occurs to me that a network-by-network system of contracts would greatly strengthen the writers position, at least on popular shows. With this industry-wide strike, I’m not worried about the established shows that I like getting replaced. But if it’s a case-by-case basis and the writers on a given show strike, viewers will leave for other shows, a scary proposition for the network. It’s an interesting situation.
Good on ya Dio. Thank you for this post. Knowing that some people skim threads or skip around, it could be missed by some. I hope everyone reads it. I don’t even know you but I’m very proud of you for writing it. I even bolded it in an effort to make sure people see it.
In other news, I just read this. I’ll bet more and more production companies will start making individual deals.
Weinsteins make a deal with striking writers (Reuters story)
I just hope that a deal is made for the Oscars (though not at the expense of the writers). Much to my surprise and shock, two of my favorite films of the year by two (well, three) of my favorite directors are pretty much locks for Best Picture, Best Director and Best Screenplay nominations (just to mention a few), No Country For Old Men by the Coen Brothers (Joel and Ethan), and (especially) There Will Be Blood by Paul Thomas Anderson, with the Coens and their film the frontrunner to win. That happens so rarely (top favorites of mine being top favorites to be nominated and win) that I’m stunned with joy at how this awards season is shaping up. Too bad this couldn’t have been a normal year when I liked a lot of nominated movies but wasn’t passionate about anything.