I’m going to review the votes on Texcat now, and try and get up early enough to review the others tomorrow.
First vote : Visorslash in [post=15231611]post 337[/post]. If Visor hadn’t been revealed Town by Storyteller, I’d be incredibly suspicious of this vote. There is no substance to it at all. I’m going to stop before the analysis reaches four times the length of Visor’s “justification.”
Second vote : Mahaloth in [post=15233492]post 349[/post]. Votes Texcat for suggesting that there were no Mafiates on Visorslash’s bandwagon. It is perhaps worth noting that Texcat justified her vote on the Visorslash wagon primarily because of the three in fifteen “slip” Visorslash perpetrated Day 1, although she retained her “no lynch” vote as well. I think the suggestion that there were no Mafiates is a bit of a stretch for a Townsperson to conclude, personally; however it would be risky for a Mafiate to make that statement because it stands out.
Third vote : Mosier in [post=15236763]post 371[/post]. Mosier justifies his vote partly because of Texcat’s campaign for a no-lynch (although I feel Mosier overstates how close it came to success; no lynch never collected more than 3 votes, peaking in 155; Visorslash already had three votes at that point, and rose slowly to 5 before the rush at the end, prompted in part by his own self-vote) and partly because of her attempts to steer people away from looking at the bandwagon.
My trouble with Mosier’s vote is that he is, in part, placing a vote when he did because of how it looks. He doesn’t want to be accused of jumping on a bandwagon. That pings – he’s doing it for appearances sake. Town shouldn’t be worrying about appearance. They have the giftof a clear conscience.
I’m going to
vote Mosier
for that. I intend to review other cases before Nightfall, but can’t do so during the day as we can’t use the Internet for personal business except at breaktimes.
I’d also add, since unless I missed it on multiple readings, Stanislaus never mentioned it, the Summoner’s power doesn’t just let him see whether his target did something, but whether someone did something to his target. So if Mosier’s Scum, and not using the Memento to access his Summoner power, he’s not just guessing that SP didn’t do anything, he’s guessing that no other Investigator investigated him, and nobody spammed a protective power on him. Which, as it turns out, seems to be accurate, but if he were Scum false-claiming, I would expect him to wait until someone else claimed to lower the chances of being contradicted, not be the first to claim.
So, yeah, low chance of Scum.
We still have crap information to go on, and that annoys me.
I’m also tired as shit, so I can’t think…I’ll vote before Nightfall, but not now.
I’m very surprised my vote timing drew two votes already. Do you really think it’s unreasonable for me to be concerned about how it might look for me to jump on a bandwagon, after two other people today drew suspicion for joining the Visorslash bandwagon late in Day 1?
Especially troubling to me is Mhaye’s vote, which is a few hundred words to basically say, “me too.”
Anyway, the Day won’t last too much longer. I don’t like the fact that nobody else cares to make an investigation claim. I’m hoping people are just holding out til the end of the Day, but waiting until there isn’t enough time left to have a real discussion about it is a bad idea, in my opinion.
I am the man of law. Last night I investigated Stanislaus and was informed that he is not a member of the brotherhood unless the cloak was used.
I wanted to avoid overlap and thought it safest to investigate someone unlikely to have garnered too much attention. I chose him specifically from that list because I feel he is a strong mafia (the game) player and knowing his alignment held more weight than the other candidates.
I think the mafia version of Chutzpah has to be a person with two posts in two weeks of playing the game complaining about how quiet this game is. You want to know why it’s quiet? It’s specifically because of YOU and your lack of participation in this game.
In fact, I’m going to throw out there that anyone with less posts than storyteller0910 isn’t posting enough. Call him the rabbit in our greyhound race. That’s Babale, Mahaloth, and KellyCriterion for those playing along at home.
Not unreasonable at all, whether you are Scum or Town. More likely if you are Scum. A Town placing a vote just to “look good” is risking placing a vote on a fellow Town. Scum don’t have to take that risk, since they know who everyone is.
ETA: Enderw24, I’m sorry you feel I don’t post enough. But real life takes precedence. You’ll notice that when I do post, I try to make my posts long and filled with analysis.
I am surprised at the Mosier voters. His claim feels pretty solid to me. Taking a risk on Suburban not doing anything last night seems like a big unnecessary risk for scum. If Mosier is scum and Suburban is random town, then there is a big risk that he was actually doing something last night. If Mosier is scum and Suburban is also, then why would they tie themselves together so unnecessarily?
I agree that if you think my vote on gnarly is so weak, then the suspicion of Alka is even weaker, even is not quite to the ridiculous point. I do hope that if either gnarlycharlie or Alka flips scum at some future point, you will re-look at this.
I did not place a vote just to look good, which is of course why you put it in quotes. I placed a vote because I suspect someone. The timing of my vote was to avoid scrutiny for trying to hide in a bandwagon (which is exactly what several players are being accused of now, for good reason), and it was all above-table. I have played openly every step of the way this game.
You are deliberately twisting what I said and did, to make it appear as damning as possible. Your arguments should be able to stand on their own, without misquotes, misdirection, and distractions. They don’t, which is why I expect you’re not actually serious about your vote and are just using it to apply pressure. I don’t like the strategy, but I understand it. However, it still doesn’t explain why MHaye hopped aboard. That’s just boggling.
Well, my vote is against Snickers because of behavior I noticed and stood out to me. The suspicion of you and some of the others were because other players made their case and I thought they were decent. So, if you had not voted at all, I would still consider that suspicious (though I could more easily believe that something just kept you away from the game), but in all honesty, it would depend on whether I noticed it, or someone else noticed it and mentioned it.
Are you not even considering that Mosier claimed to watch Suburban and did not see anything happen?
So, do you think Mosier used the Memento and actually watched Suburban, or do you think he just took a guess that Suburban did nothing, or do you think Suburban is scum along with Mosier? I just don’t think any of those three are likely(though I do give some chance to the Memento) and I am surprised that Mosier is picking up votes at this point. (Or after refreshing, what TexCat said.)
I think you chose a good target and I for the time being am going to consider Stanislaus Town. Of course, this tells us nothing about your alignment, since you would still reveal Stanislaus as Town even if you are scum.
As I said, I am finding these votes for Mosier rather weird. It almost had me changing my vote. The problem is, just like I could not see scum pushing for the no-lynch, I really don’t see scum pushing to lynch Mosier. I can’t really see why Town would think Mosier the best choice for a lynch right now either, though. I just find the whole thing rather bizarre.
I am not going to change my vote for now, but these votes for Mosier definitely bother me.
I’m sorry for your loss, visor. I know this is a difficult time. Please accept my best wishes for you and your family. (Obviously, we understand that this game is no longer any kind of priority for you. Forget about it.)
And yes, Babale, even without visor’s bad news, that was out of line. I too could have wished that visor had explained his thought processes more - but there’s a difference between criticising someone’s playing style on one hand, and personal insults on the other.
It’s pretty tight. It’ll be interesting to see how that moves in the next few hours. (I make it c.3.5 hours to first Dusk, or Twilight, or whatever we want to call it.) Right now, a tie = no-lynch.
Will anyone be surprised if I confirm fubbles’ result? (I think you’re doing me too much credit, btw.) Also, it seems churlish but necessary to point out that getting my alignment correct doesn’t offer any solid evidence of yours. Babale, a question: why do you completely disregard **Mosier’s **claim?
MHaye: do you believe that **Suburban **is also scum, or that **Mosier **got lucky in guessing a Town player who neither acted, nor was acted upon? (Good point, Tengu).
I’m going to cross my fingers and work under the assumption that Stanislaus was not cloaked, and is therefore town. With that in mind, I was prepared to give extra credence to his vote of Inner Stickler. However…
In making his case, he pointed out several things he found scummy about Inner Stickler…but not so much about him, as his playstyle. And in reading through the case, I find Stickler’s playstyle to me extremely similar to mine.
Stanislaus has problems with Sticker bringing up strategies, but “not married to it” and “non-committal”, when I find inflexibility to be very anti-town. I can’t make heads nor tails of his accusation that “He’s happy to push discussions that don’t themselves lead to finding scum. E.g. Directing investigators”, since it seems like he’s saying “investigators don’t find scum”, which is clearly not true.
So, while I disagree with much of what Stanislaus has to say, I’m going stick with the thought that he’s saying it from a townie perspective. And although it wasn’t part of his reasons for voting Stickler, he also quoted a bit that is pinging me more and more:
I had already mentioned there was a very good strategic reason for scum to lay low on Night One, but Sticker pressed the idea that getting in one kill was worth the trade of likely causing several power roles to waste their one-shot ability and possibly get caught. Don’t care for that line of reasoning one bit.
Visorslash, so sorry to hear that. Be good to yourself and your family right now; we’ll be around when you get back.
Not that it means anything, but I too get a “leans town” vibe from Stanislaus. I think that fubbleskag’s reasoning for targeting him is also pretty sound.
I don’t know that I think Mosier’s reasoning in choosing Suburban Plankton as a target was the greatest, but I can follow it and understand it. I do rather think it was a wasted use of his power - I think it might’ve been more informative to wait to use it - but hey, it’s his power and he gets to choose what to do with it. And I think the mental gymnastics of Mosier being scum and using the Memento to use his power on SP (scum or not) are a little convoluted and unlikely (and besides, if the scum have the Memento, I think they’d use it to recall something more powerful than a weak investigator anyway), so that doesn’t wash with me. I don’t like his “Imma vote so’s nobody thinks I’m a bandwagon jumper,” but I also know that in the mafia game I participated in (it was LOTR, not Harry Potter - I went back to check), I was concerned what people thought of me and my vote, and I was town. In gnarlycharlie’s list, Mosier’s listed as a fairly new player, so I’m inclined to believe his claim and put him in the town category.
I don’t like TexCat’s two votes on D1. I agree with earlier posts that multivotes that are still standing at EOD just water down accountability. But right now that’s not enough for me to put her in either category, although her seeming to direct suspicion to groups that don’t include her is troubling.
Leaving my vote where it is for now, as Mahaloth still isn’t being forthcoming.