I did. He has 2 black eyes, a broken/injured nose. cuts and abrasions on his face and head. We have witnesses who saw the struggle occur. We have a phone tape of a person screaming for a sustained period of time. We have pictures documenting the assault.
He had a gunshot wound to the chest.We have witnesses who saw the struggle occur. We have a phone tape of a person screaming for a sustained period of time. We have pictures documenting the assault (the dead body).
we’re done. I don’t know what game you’re playing but it will have to be with someone else. Your questions are now beyond stupid.
If you want a real discussion in the future then present a point of view with facts to back them up.
This is funny…I was about to say the same about you.
Have a good night.
I meant the term more generally than news media.
I was trying to make a joke. But I guess I failed. :smack:
I meant more along the lines of cop shows, lawyer shows, etc on the screens.
Bad guys get caught. They just do on those shows. Except for the Exception. But generally a case is able to be put together that is called solid.
But in reality it seems that it’s actually a more circuitous and ambiguous affair.
Who would have thought that popular entertainment would have misled me so?
Also, if anyone reading these “stupid questions” think they won’t be relevant to possible jurors and a trial, you are sadly mistaken.
They will want to know.
I hear you.
But in this case, assuming a trial, I think the prosecution can bring a good case against him, if they do their homework.
Even though this was a different case and somewhat different circumstances, Raul Rodriguez (Texas) put himself in harm’s way and ended up shooting someone who charged him. He claimed he “feared for his life”. I am sure he did.
He got 40 years.
What the jury “wants to know” is irrelevant. They will know what they are told, and make a decision based on that.
Being creepy, following someone with a (concealed) loaded gun, calling the police due to your suspicions, and asking someone what they’re doing isn’t illegal in Florida. Shooting someone who’s been attacking you, and put you in reasonable fear of death or serious injury isn’t illegal in Florida.
Please point to something Zimmerman provably did that’s actually illegal in Florida, and that the jury will be allowed to consider in this case.
Why did Martin have brain edema indicated on his autopsy?
Food for thought.
This is the first I have heard of this, but dad gum it, it’s right there in the medical examiner’s report. Martin had severe global edema of the cerebrum. There was no other brain abnormalities noted, so it’s hard to say that this was caused by head trauma. I’m wondering if this might have been a consequence of hydrostatic forces resulting from the gunshot wound.
I am wondering if this was a consequence of Zimmerman inflicting head trauma on Martin or possibly cutting off his supply of oxygen: like from smothering him.
Of course, the Zimmerman crowd will attack this as “unsubstantiated”.
I have a feeling that Zimmerman is turning around what happened: What he said Martin did to him his what Zimmerman did to Martin.
Another curiosity: why wasn’t Zimmerman’s DNA found under Martin’s fingernails?
Damn: “pounded his head into the pavement” and not a lot of Zimmerman’s dna or blood on Martin.
Also, it would appear Zimmerman’s back was wet with grass–real wet. Sounds like a pavement induced thing here.
This is for you Shodan.
As I read the evidence dumps again last night, the more I said to myself, “this dude is going to fry”.
I listened to the enhanced audio of someone saying “I’m begging you”. That sure as hell didn’t sound like Zimmerman.
Now that I look at this, I am actually sure Martin did say “you got me”. That’s when Zimmerman shot him. Zimmerman was never out of control here. Never.
I actually missed some details from the dumps.
Un-freaking- believable.
you in the face,
I was researching…no…it’s actually EASY to say this was caused by head trauma.
Basically, the causes of this edema are:
traumatic brain injury (TBI–basically a head injury)
strokes or hemorrhages
infection
tumors
high altitudes
I think we can rule out the last three. I have to ask my friends who are in medical school about the hemorrhages. But I think TBI is very likely here.
Apparently, edema causes the following:
Headache
Neck pain or stiffness
Nausea or vomiting
Dizziness
Irregular breathing
Vision loss or changes
Memory loss
Inability to walk
Difficulty speaking
Stupor
Seizures
Loss of consciousness
Wow. This was the first time that I really looked at this.
What a sadist. Unbelievable.
Right now, it is NUMBING how people are defending this guy.
So the pavement made his shirt wet with grass? What the hell are you talking about?
If you were intending these as cites that Zimmerman used a throw on Martin and ended up underneath him, or that Zimmerman was not alone, then you better try again. They contain nothing that has not already been presented. And they have nothing to do with your rather bizarre allegations.
I doubt anyone believes you actually have any evidence for whatever it is that you believe, since you are apparently just making it up as you go along.
Regards,
Shodan
Shodan,
Does everything have to be in explicit form for you to understand something?
-
I will let you figure that one out. My point, though, is that the fight was on the grass.
-
I was hoping you read the NY times article about Deedee. She’s making up hearing Martin say “get off, get off”? What the hell else could that exchange have been about?
So you mean to tell me Martin was “doubling back” while on the phone with Deedee and attacked Zimmerman?
What about the deedee hearing the clip getting knocked off Martin?
Let’s see if you can grasp the implications I am making on how they got to the ground.
What about the link I gave you to the voice analysis? What do you make of that?
- I wanted to ask you a personal question: Are you a math guy or a computer guy?
Sounds bizarre, but I ask for a reason. Your thinking is extremely linear.
You are missing the implications that I am making.
If it were caused by head trauma, you would expect there to be hemorrhaging of the brain as well as edema. You’d also see signs of contusions on the skull, but there were none noted by the ME.
Hydrostatic forces can cause cerebral edema. So we can’t rule this out. When the ME is called to testify, he will be able to interpret the report for the jury and explain the most likely cause for this observation. Hopefully he’s seen enough gunshot fatalities to say whether this kind of brain edema is typical for these injuries. I just don’t know enough to automatically see this as evidence against Zimmerman, although it is an interesting finding that merits an explanation.
Trayvon was a suspect now? Suspect for what? What crime did he commit? The only reason Zimmerman thought he was suspicious was because (1) he was black and (2) he was talking on a bluetooth device. To a caveman (or someone who woke up from a ten year sleep for the first time) a human interacting with a bluetooth device could give the idea that the person is talking to him or herself. Zimmerman was not obliged to follow or keep Martin in sight so it was not a prudent thing, it was a stupid thing. The dispatcher explicitly told him not to follow.
Also, the evidence that betenoire39 brings up about head trauma from the coroner’s report is fascinating. I’m on pins and needles waiting to hear how the peanut gallery explains that away.
Not that anyone cares but I want to reiterate my accusation that Zimmerman is a narcissist - it’s obvious from his media grandstanding, his interaction with women, lack of empathy and remorse, purported bullying of his colleagues, and a host of other factors. Narcissist are slippery to pin down precisely because they muddy the waters by giving specious but entirely plausible explanations for their behaviors. Which is exactly what he is doing now. Think about this: Say you kill someone in a middle of the woods and no one saw the fight. Why wouldn’t you save your ass and say that the dead man started it? That the dead man grabbed your gun, threatened you with death, assaulted you until your head was going to explode, and made you fear for your life until you had no choice but to end the victim’s life. If you’re guilty and you just killed someone, why wouldn’t you muddy the waters to deflect responsibility to the victim? Serious question.
- Honesty
Indeed.
Possibly the shot alone caused it, of course.
Possibly Zimmerman caused it, independent of the shot.
It most certainly deserves an explanation.
On another note,
I reread Zimmerman saying that Martin “pounded his head into the pavement” for “over a minute”.
Hopefully some medical experts will testify why there were no concussions or fractures after such a prolonged “pounding”. :smack:
- Of course they will say that Travyon BECAME a suspect after he “pounded Zimmerman’s head into the pavement”.
This is a total complete non-sequitur, but they’ll say it anyway: the actions that he supposedly committed during a ‘struggle’ made Zimmerman’s initial pursuit (oh wait, he didn’t pursue him 
) justified.
See, logic!!!
-
They’ll come up with some ad hominem or some bullshit, rest assured.
-
I agree. Now they will attack Martin as “No limit Nigga” (with a hair trigga–as Shodan said).
disgusting…
Honesty, I think you are being too generous with your assessments.
I hate when people use the term ‘stupid’.
What happened was EXTREMELY serious.
Even that excuse of a human Frank Taffee (spelling??) said that there had to be anger issues for someone to do what Zimmerman did.
Even for a rogue like that to say this, things have to be that obvious.
Stupidity? No. More like a hunter seeking prey.
Don’t give Zimmerman leeway for what he did.
I cannot (as a human being) imagine myself doing what Zimmerman did.
He could have had his lights on, pulled up to Martin IMMEDIATELY (rather than trail him as long as he did) and say “Kid, relax, Neighborhood Watch–didn’t mean to scare you, you just didn’t look familar…”
The shit could have ended RIGHT THERE–RIGHT FUCKING THERE.
Zimmerman CHOSE not to do this.