See my reply above yours.
Yes, thanks. That’s a great idea.
I don’t get this.
Experts in childcare do not place kids in areas with history of deadly flooding, with inadequate communication, inadequate emergency preparations, and no means of evacuation.
Experts in ministry? Well, the good lord does work in mysterious ways. 
Obviously radio and TV stations were broadcasting warnings. But I very much doubt that many people were listening to the radio or watching TV in the early morning hours when the situation got really bad.
As to Camp Mystic they had a no electronics policy so neither the girls nor the counselors could have received warnings [although the top staff could]. And since the power and wireless were lost the only way the top staff could communicate with the cabins was if someone went there in person.
Quietly in one’s sleep is pretty good. I mean, you know, if I could choose.
This is what Im trying to figure out, i.e. tropical storm quantities of moisture being picked up and dumped there without any acknowledgement of its possibility or forecasts. I saw Pam Brown on CNN earlier with some guy from accuweather talking about NWS flash flood warnings, etc “and our warnings were 30 mins earlier” BS, but I feel like the potentials could have been advised, but I dont think they were or not heeded? I cant find any advisory/warnings about the potential for flash floods on, say 7/2 or 7/3.
I went to the NWS forecast discussion to san antonio for 7/1 and it mentions Barry, but after that, its just “plume of moisture.” I feel like there was enough mention of the amounts possible, but no action.
These forecasts discussions are still online at the NWS San Antonio pages.
This event is really upsetting to me, more than more recent
Edit apologies for lack of punctuation, etc. I dont like typing on phone
Yes. If you live in tornado, flood or hurricane areas the NOAA weather radio is a must have. I’m not sure how they work for wildfires.
These camps have many dangers. I suspect the stats on children and accidents is a very very long list.
But this beyond the pale.
I bet heads will roll before the investigation is over.
Too too sad.
“Kids & accidents” short list do not/doesnt equal deaths like this.
There could be a trend developing, including flooding rains and increasing pushed-aside lack of awareness
And make sure it’s not wheelchair-accessible.
People could see Hurricane Helene coming, although most people in the area were completely unprepared for the resulting damage. This was something nobody to my knowledge could have predicted.
Officials seem to be saying “we can handle it”. “We dont need, our have … we…Texas can…”
This is from (my opinion) the nationwide official press appearance to someone not in TX
I think they were downplayed.
A former appointee of the Houston, TX mayor pointed out something I had noticed myself - that it looked like everyone affiliated with the girls’ camp was white - and got in trouble for it. As in, that’s why she’s a former appointee.
Did anyone else notice this?
I do understand this. I was saying these places are rife with problems. Accidents and dangers are every where. Starting with the church urging parents to send their small girls to such a remote place. Probably with no outdoors skills or even aware there are dangers. And as young as they are no cel phone of their own. Or allowed to even have them.
This a particularly bad thing.
If I was a parent of these young girls I wouldn’t send my kid, at all. Especially not a church camp.
I don’t trust that.
They were there, though. And it’s terrible.
Yes and the environment is changing. We’ll have to change our way of being.
I would expect the counselors to have had 2 way radios (walkie talkies, ) at least they do at the camp my kids went to that was also electronic free campus.
Remote? According to the map it’s a half an hour drive from Kerrville, and the camp’s website says 18 miles. That doesn’t sound particularly “remote” to me. This wasn’t (apparently) the sort of camping where you’re in a tent in the woods and crapping in a latrine.
I started camping around age 10. That’s a fine age to start teaching outdoor skills. Cellphones didn’t even exist back then. The counselors and camp director had access to communications if needed. Oh, and the county we were in also had the sense to pay for and maintain warning sirens for severe weather. There is a real difference. Also, our tents (because we were in tents) were on high ground. There were buildings to retreat to in severe weather. Also on high ground. I’m sure those cabins down by the riverside were very picturesque but they were on a floodplain
I don’t think sending kids that young to camp is a bad thing. Getting them away from electronics and phones for awhile is good, too. The biggest problem was cabins built on a floodplain and no watch/warning system. When I went camping as a kid (and I did a lot of camping through the Scouts at least one adult stayed up all night so that if Something Came Up they could take appropriate action - did they have a similar monitoring system? I don’t know.
I agree the whole “church camp” thing raises my hackles, too.
I’d expect that, too. And someone to keep an eye on weather forecasts.
It’s easy to armchair-quarterback and second-guess the people who actually found themselves in the middle of a disaster.
No, but now that it’s been mentioned I checked out their website. That’s a very White crowd of people. Found one picture of a camper who is either a very dark Caucasian or a very light-skinned Brown Person. The only two black people shown were a handyman and a secretary hired in the 1950’s in the history section. Otherwise… yes, all White.
Should be noted that Camp Mystic was not the only camp in the area. Again, a look at a map shows a half dozen or more. Many also experienced catastrophic flooding, but none lost as many people (that I can find out about) as Mystic. I’m wondering if those other camps had the people sleeping on higher ground rather than the river floodplain. Admittedly, the river flooded beyond that flood plain, but the higher up you are the more potential there was for you to realize there was a problem and move to higher ground.
Yeah - but FREEDOM!
Why is the race of campers relevant. (I know you didn’t bring it up.)
First - the lady who noted that characteristic apparently got fired for noting it, but it does seem to be factual. I find that disturbing because people shouldn’t be fired for telling the truth even though that seems to be becoming more common.
Kerr County, Texas is about 70% White, but it’s also 25% Hispanic. Well, a camp that (presumably) draws campers from all over rather than just the county it is in doesn’t have to reflect the ethnic mix of the county it is in. OK, Texas overall is about 40% White, 40% Hispanic, 12% Black, with a sprinkling of others according to the latest Census information. The camp presents itself as “non-denominational Christian”. It’s a little… odd… that it is apparently just as White campers and staff. Prior to the Civil Rights Era Texas had racial segregation so I would expect historical photos to show all White campers (although the camp did employ at least two Black people in the 1950’s in what might be called support positions) but modern photos? It’s a bit odd. Sure, there may be socio-economic factors at play, it may be that White folks in Texas are more likely to have the money and inclination to send their kids to camp. It doesn’t have to be something sinister.
It’s still a bit odd that there seem to be no minorities in recent group photos.
None of which is relevant to the disaster that occurred.
If you haven’t yet seen this video from NPR, it’s worth watching. It’s a time-lapse of a camera that’s monitoring a low-water LLano River crossing. The rapidity and the amount of the rising water flow is staggering.
I guess everyone realized that one of the enduring appeals of religion is that it is one of the few remaining areas in which one is free to discriminate.
LSL posted this and another cite over in a Pit thread. Let’s stop saying there was no warning and no one coulda anticipated this.