I haven’t been able to figure out what it is you did say - you didn’t have a bad time with chicken pox or mumps, so they’re no big deal? Not everyone has the same experience as you with your rosy-tinted lenses.
Which is the problem right there in a nutshell. Not everyone has the same experiences to draw on - since no one in my family or circle of friends back then had any trouble with the common childhood diseases, I couldn’t understand why it is now required that kids get vaccinated for them. And when I asked, I was labeled anti-vax, and I still don’t know that getting the chicken pox or the mumps as a child is all that bad, since I have no idea what your definition of “misery” is. Shrug, again not my problem.
Unvaccinated baby dies of whooping cough in Orange County.
Guys I vaccinated my dog against whooping cough and five years later he got autism, I diagnosed him on a mommy board too not some nonsense you know like a quiz so I know its for real. So it is settled.
You vaguely heard something about it but didn’t bother to follow up but then question the results anyway based on your vague memory…
Yeah, we’ve got several kinds of words for dumbassery like that.
In fact, ‘dumbassery’ serves pretty well for it.
Anecdotes are not data. That’s science 101 stuff right there.
See I never got the smallpox vaccine. Never suffered any more “misery” than otherwise. Oh wait, that’s because we eradicated smallpox through a concerted immunization effort.
Getting the vaccine is better. Chicken pox can be lethal, even if fatalities are rare. Even if you caught chicken pox as a child, you can still catch it as an adult. Immunity is not permanent for vaccinations or naturally developed immunity.
[Not being snarky on this one and being totally serious] Even if you contracted chicken pox as a child, you should consider talking to your doctor about getting a shingles vaccine.
Back to the snark: this is all stuff easily researchable via Google. Why the hell haven’t you fucking Googled any of this over the last week?
Okay, now I’m getting a troll vibe. 
curlcoat is not a troll. she is just very, very stupid.
And THAT, m’dear, is precisely why we have science instead. That way, we can use statistics and actual DATA to make these decisions, instead of just asking people what they reckon sounds right. An obvious corollary to this way of decision making is that there will be some people - perhaps many people - whose gut instincts will vary significantly from what is actually true. The correct response to people who raise objections based on these gut reactions is to attempt to educate them as to the facts.
More and more I become convinced that the only solution is to take all the antivaxxers and leave them all on an island somewhere. Maybe another planet. Another planet would probably be better. I hear Mars is nice this time of year.
I got screamed at a few years ago in the pit for saying the same thing.
I’ve been insulted by Curlcoat. All I need now is for Big T to pit me and my life will be complete.
Leptospirosis, kennel cough, Lyme, and coronaviruses are not considered core vaccines in dogs. The importance of all them is very limited to age, geography, and climate. It’s the same as me not having a vaccine against hepatitis A or never receiving a BCG vaccine (against Mycobacterium tuberculosis). I do not live or travel to a place that would require a HepA vaccine, and I’m way too old and lived in a country that does not routinely vaccinate against TB.
Most of the recent veterinary classes have been trained to administer most of the core vaccines every 3 years, excepting those that are only approved for one year (most of the bacterial vaccines, a couple of rabies vaccines that are only valid for 1 year). If your veterinarian insists on vaccines every year (other than rabies, which may be mandatory by law depending on region), then the information used is outdated. This is even more important in cats, as there is a type of vaccine-associated tumor that is very well known and recognized.
My own dog, which has been for most of her life a blood donor, only gets the core vaccines every 3 years. Annually, she gets lepto because of where we live it is a possibility and I don’t want her to go through that (I’ve seen dogs die from it), and the bordatella because she does regular dayboarding at a large veterinary clinic.
Also, rabies exists, and rabies is a very serious public health issue. Having rabies vaccines up to date means that in case of an accident (animal biting dog, unknown rabies-status of biter), the protocols to follow would be much less expensive and worrisome.
You are completely wrong. Quite a bit of time, money and effort went into studies that link over-vaccination and auto-immune disease in dogs, and vaccine protocols have been modified several times. Because dogs and humans are both mammals, I asked a question and got labeled an anti-vaxer by the vax nazis. That is the sum total of my contribution to the discussion. People like you like to jump to stupid conclusions - that is dumbassery.
What I said was in response to needscoffee, so your comment on anecdotes and science 101 should be directed there. It does help if you read for context.
You want me to get my information from the internet??? Seriously? Come on, it would be easy to find sites that look legit that would agree with any preconceived idea I might have. Theoretically, we have someone here who has actually done real research and been published, and if she wasn’t such a knee jerk asshole to those who have questions, none of this would be necessary.
Science begins with questions such as “why did this happen here, but not there?”
They aren’t now but lepto and kennel cough used to be, and corona was for awhile when it first came out. Vets still push all of them, some more than others depending on location, just as they push heartworm and flea/tick preventatives all year round. Most boarding kennels still require them.
What might be the same, and what has never been answered due to snark is the safety of the number of shots given at once, the need for boosters, and the need for vaccinations for diseases that are rarely serious.
Every three years is still too frequent but it’s good to hear that new vets are being trained away from annual.
My personal vet knows I give all my own vaccinations except rabies - he isn’t the issue. The problem comes when I place a pup or adult dog, and the new owner’s vet insists on giving a 5-way right away, no matter what the records show when the dog had it’s last shot. Most vets didn’t got thru school recently and are still requiring boosters every year, and more frequent boosters for puppies. So at times I sell pups to people whose vet gives them 2 - 3 extra five ways as it grows, maybe corona too, and then boosters every year. Way too much.
My only issue with rabies is the fact my city requires it every two years, when the manufacturer itself says it’s good for at least three. Particularly since we don’t really have much in the way of rabies vectors here.
Rather than sounding like an idiot by railing against “antivax nazis”, you might want to educate yourself about immune system capacity and research looking at this subject (including studies like this one debunking the “too many vaccines” hypothesis).
Why does it bother you that immunity against some diseases (i.e. tetanus) is enhanced by periodic booster shots?
Like mumps, which is unpleasant and debilitating at best, but which you think is just a walk in the park?
curlcoat provides an excellent example of the unlovely combination of qualities that identifies so many in the woo crowd - ignorant, confused and belligerent.
Neither of those address any of what I have said, since I have never said anything about what happens at the time of the vaccinations. Except when I mentioned that I tend to have an allergic reaction to the flu shot, and that only in the context of why I don’t get it. You would really look like less of a numbnuts if you respond to what I post, rather than one sentence in the middle of a post about pet vaccinations.
Read what I’ve already posted - it’s there, and not that far back.
You linked to a site about complications in adults. I never said it was a “walk in the park”, but I did say that I didn’t know any children who were in misery in response to needscoffee. Again, you don’t look like as much of an idiot if you respond to what was said, instead of what you ass-ume from a tiny piece of a conversation.
Also again, this is not something I really give a rip about since I have no, and never did have, any kids to vaccinate. But since autoimmune disease is rising in children, I’d think that concerned parents would be interested to know that a link between autoimmune diseases and vaccinations was discovered in other mammals, quite some time ago, causing protocols to be radically changed and supposed experts questioned. However, here people are not only not interested, they view it as the raving of an anti-vaxxer. Shrug.
Nothing I have said has anything to do with any woo crowd. Yours is merely the knee-jerk response of “I’m right and you’re wrong! LALALALALA!!”
Yes, because kennel cough IS a common disease in that type of environment (hey, it’s in the name, even!). Hence they want to make sure the animals they board are vaccinated to decrease the incidence of it.
They’ve been trained that way for close to ten years, if not more. It also helps that new vaccines have been developed that have been shown to last longer. Similarly, peer-reviewed articles had been published demonstrating some of those vaccines do last quite a while (at least 3 years). I’m not sure if there have been studies showing the vaccines’ efficacy for longer than that.
Also, puppies need boosters (just like babies need boosters), to ensure that their immune system develops a good immunity agasint those diseases, particularly parvovirus and canine distemper, both of which are certainly NOT good diseases to get as a dog.
And those who board their pets every year when they go on vacation end up having to take them for a kennel cough shot every year because the boarding kennel still believes they “wear off”. And the dog probably ends up getting a 5 way every year because their vet doesn’t stock anything else. Until I told them to stop, my vet’s office would send reminder postcards every year for “annual boosters” for my pets, even tho they only see them once or twice in their lifetimes.
Then what the heck is wrong with my city? Sounds like I need to talk to someone over there…
Puppies need boosters, but not every two weeks until 16 or 20 weeks, as was recommended back in the dark ages when I first got into dogs. I still see frequent and/or early vaccination recommended.
They do recommend a lot of boosters (3-4 shots spaced over a few months) of the 5 way because of parvovirus. The vaccine is not as effective in producing a good, long term protection with few boosters (as rabies is, for example), particularly in young pups and certain breeds. Since it is a nasty disease, they’d rather vaccinate than let a pup not get a good response and then fall victim to the disease.
They are trying to research newer vaccines, but until more information is published, that is the reason they get so many of those boosters. Parvo sucks.
Since you were responding to a comment specifically about human vaccination, it is relevant to educate you about human vaccination.
As you object to having your ignorant offhand remarks about immunization addressed, here’s advice for you - don’t make them.
Nope. It’s about mumps complications in general, including those that occur in children. Try reading it again.
You’re giving a good imitation of someone who is revved up about the subject, but has little to contribute.
Concerned parents who investigate the subject will find that it has been addressed and such a link has not been found in humans, who differ from other mammals (you will however find such claims widely touted by highly dependable :dubious: sources such as whale.to, naturalnews, the Ron Paul forums etc.).
The Questions you’re Just Asking are right out of the woo/antivax playbook, and proponents similarly refusal to acknowledge facts that get in the way of their beliefs.
Hi, my name is **Spaz **and I have an autoimmune disease. You know what gave me this particular affliction? This little thing called “genetics.” The tendency towards autoimmune diseases runs in my family. You know what triggered my disease? Puberty. The change in hormones made my immune system decide that platelets were a tasty snack and it took me eight years and a gasp FDA trial to get my immune system to the negotiating table and agree to a remission. (An FDA trial that ended up with the tested drug becoming one of the standard treatments. I had the best reaction in the stage 3 trial. preens)
You know what didn’t have a goddamn thing to do with my autoimmune disease? Vaccinations.
You do know that just because something happens in other mammals doesn’t mean it happens with humans, right? Because of, like, y’know, biology and shit. But that’s okay, you don’t need to know that science shit 'cause you’re in tune with the universe and can extrapolate its secrets from the air. Or something, I don’t know.
(I know I shouldn’t stir the big pot o’ crazy, but sometimes you just can’t resist a quick twirl of the spoon.)