I can’t read anymore of this. On here, or on the Teeming Millions site. Too…many…words. Too … many … words. Ack!
All I know is (at this point) that I am damned glad I am not moderater, I never want to be one. (Never did, not that anyone would ask…) Never want to be involved in the administration of this board, ever. Yikes. What a soap opera.
RE: CalifBoomer – Hey, consider the source. I consider being held in contempt by the likes of you a compliment.
TO: Diane – my most heartfelt condolences.
RE: The whole “It’s my party and I make the rules and If you don’t like it take a hike” argument.
Well, I always thought rule number one of TSD was fighting ignorance through rational thought and the application of cold hard facts. Was that rule followed here? Don’t market this place as a haven of free speech, logic and the truth then refuse to play by your own rules.
If this were any other topic (say a Great Debate), the credible posters would demand facts and documentation to back up any and all claims. Ed, Lynn, want credibility for your business losses allegations? Show us numbers. Out of curiousity, is the Reader a publicly traded corporation? Also, there’s a little invention called “liability insurance”. Perhaps the “former hippies” at the Reader should investigate it. Hard for me to believe that a newspaper (hippie published or not) of your size is completely uninsured.
I find the “guest” metaphor fascinating. (I think a better word might be “customers” or “readers” or “participants”. Out of curiousity, have the former hippies at theReader exploited the steady number of us who peruse this board regularly? Call it southern hospitality, but I treat my “guests” better than you do. Someone said “If my guest spits on the rug, I reserve the right to throw him out.” Fair enough. Here’s a corollary. “If my host, who proclaims himself far and wide to be a paragon of wisdom, fairness and objectivity, treats my fellow guest shabbily, then refuses to disclose the reason therefor; I reserve the right to criticize my so-called host and think he’s an ass.”
I want to make myself perfectly clear. Melin may have deserved banning. Haven’t read her response yet, haven’t read any of the threads referred to. Not my call.
Here’s my point. If you’re going to take the drastic step of banning a legitimate poster (these rules don’t apply to trolls), then based upon the culture and environment of The Straight Dope you better have a damn good, factually demonstrable reason – especially if you’re going to dump a poster as popular as Melin.
I haven’t seen your damn good reason yet, Ed. I remain willing to consider any reason you submit by the same standards applicable to any GQ response or Great Debate posting – rigorous factual and logical analysis.
Play by your own rules, dammit!
Admitting that you banned Melin because she personally annoyed you would be far more honest and acceptable than the gutless BS you’ve published so far. Don’t like her? Be a man and say so. Kick her outta the party 'cause you don’t like her face. Fine with me. Just be honest about it.
Plunging like stones from a slingshot on Mars.
Just for your information, liability insurance generally only protects you against liability for personal injuries and property damage. It will not usually protect you against defamation suits, commercial torts or contract claims (although I’m not sure whether newspapers would carry defamation coverage, and if so, whether the message board would be covered as well).
Here’s the response, from OpalCat’s thread: http://fathom.org/cgi-bin/sdmb.pl?read=1284
Maybe she was banned because she was a lawyer? Discuss.
rocks
Oh my, an insurance expert, are you? Let’s see, how shall I respond. Well, first of all, I’ve been practicing a insurance law for nine years now. The past five years, I’ve been counsel for the Kentucky Department of Insurance. One of my areas of concentration has been P&C insurance (that’s property and casualty, for your information. In case you didn’t know, liability insurance is a type of casualty insurance.)
They taught us in law school that defamation is a personal injury. As you so aptly note, personal injuries are covered by liability policies. Hard for me to believe that a big city newspaper (run by former hippies or not) would operate without liability coverage for defamation. Oddly enough, they mentioned something about this in journalism school too. I’m pretty sure a CGL would cover it.
But, hey, you probly know more about it than I do…
Plunging like stones from a slingshot on Mars.
Ive been reading all the posts including one from someone I can’t stand who threatened that his last post was on this thread. I don’t know anything about Melin whether whe deserved being banned or not…but…since none of the complainers pay one nickel …just their arrangement of words found in Webster’s dictionary…I think the producers of the SDMB have a right to do what they saw fit. When one of my patients threatened a lawsuit, justified or not, out she went from my practice. Who in the hell are you schmucks who hide behind your desk all protected from danger to curse Zotti, et al.?
Don’t ever say 288 in polite company. Its just two gross!
Wow, I pop off the board for a day and look what happened while I was away.
This makes me very sad. I like Melin. She’s smart and knowledgeable. I don’t necessarily agree with her on everything, but she’s a good member of the message board. Having read Melin’s response, and the ensuing discussion on Opal’s page, I have the general feeling that no one is really in the right - or the wrong - here. This entire soap opera is based on mistaken assumptions and legal paranoia. I rather doubt that Mr. Zotti would have kicked Melin off because he didn’t like her, but instead overreacted at her mention of legal actions. He must have known that Melin is a reasonable person who would be willing to make amends, and I think Melin surely would see Mr. Zotti in that same light. These are not stupid people here - but humans can and do overreact. I think most people here would be pleased to see the people in question attempt to straighten out this mess and allow Melin to return.
I know that this post is sympathetic to Melin. Again, I don’t think she is “more right” than the SD Staff, but as a regular ol’ poster, I am perhaps more empathetic to her position.
I’ve said it before, there is nothing we can do. Its a very unfortunate incident.
oh, and califboomer. Eat cheese off my dogs dick.
well, at least one person wants to meet me…
http://fathom.org/polldata/pollcheck.adp?poll=dope-page5&question=62
Cheers!!
Yesterday, in the wee hours of the morning, this is what I said.
I was, during the day yesterday, in repeated contact with both the parties by e-mail. And it’s fair to say I now understand the decision to ban Melin.
It still saddens me no end. But the situation at the time I first posted was that the banning appeared with virtually no supporting rationale. That has changed.
I don’t think that I would have done the same in Ed’s shoes. But I do understand why he did it, and I don’t think he abused his discretion in doing it.
My comment about leaving was not intended to be dramatic flair; it was simply a recognition that I wouldn’t want to play in the sandbox if the kid who owned it wouldn’t play fair. I hated to do it, because I really like this place.
And I am glad to now be back.
As are we, Rick.
Coldfire
Voted Poster Most Likely To Post Drunk
"You know how complex women are"
As I recall (having almost zero civil law practical experience) compensatory damages arsing from a defamation suit would be covered by a run-of-the-maill liability policy. Punitive damages would not.
Really? Was it me? You can’t stand me? I had no idea!
Well… er… sorry I’m back, then.
On the issue of legal costs, please note Billdo’s comments earlier. There is a high cost (Billdo says $5,000 to $10,000) in responding to lawsuit, EVEN IF the case is thrown out at the earliest possible moment.
“These charges against you are frivilous,” says the judge, “and it will cost you $10,000 to have them dismissed. Now, you may think that’s very expensive, but let me tell you, a Kennedy or Rockerfeller could not have it dismissed for one penny less. This is not a land where there is one law for the rich and another for the poor.”
“Long time lurker, first time poster to the pit”. Looks like a lot of built up animosity enhanced by bad communication. Still, even though Ed and Tuba seem to be high handed and condesending, Melin did light the litigation fuse and in business that requires a strong response. A good negotiator should be able to get this resolved to the satisfaction of both parties. It seems a shame that an impasse such as this has resulted in so much vitriol among so many.
One question though; How many members have been banned and for what reasons?
{{The e-mail in that link is almost a month old, Lynn. Who is Frookie? Who is Astor? And what does any of this have to do with Melin the poster? }}
Frookie is Asterbark’s nickname. She’s not a member of the Straight Dope staff, but she was one of the targets of the proposed lawsuit.
As for how many posters have been banned, it’s under 30 addresses. Some of them are simply new addresses for old trolls, so there’s some duplications. I can’t tell you the reasons for each banning (mostly because I don’t remember right off the top of my head), but there’s a couple of cases of “handle-spoofing” (someone used the handle Aurasear to impersonate Auraseer, for instance) and there’s several cases of “Junior found a new site, it’ll keep him out of his parents’ hair for a while”. But I’m pretty sure that the number of actual PEOPLE banned is two dozen or less. We don’t ban lightly.
Lynn
The world is coming to an end. Please log off.
My… God… why… have… you… for-…saken… me…
Hhhhhh…
Maybe someone should sell the rights to this story to some big-ass network n’ release a made-for-TV movie? 
::::::running away as fast as possible:::::: Heeeeeeee!
E.
“Semper Ubi Sub Ubi.” =-)
Hey Ed, why not just admit that you banned Melin because you dislike her? I mean you, personally. It won’t make people any happier with you, but at least you’ll be telling the truth.
Melin wanted an apology; she got an apology. Therefore she is not going to sue. If the idea of a lawsuit was really what bothered you, there’d be no problem, now would there?
Oh, and…
I never thought these words would pass my fingers, but Krispy Original has hit the nail on the head.
I don’t quite believe that the Reader is in such desperate financial straits, that you must defend in this manner against the mere possibility of a lawsuit or go under. But if that really is the case, if you’re that hard up, you’d better ban people from walking up your front steps, because if they slip you’ll be stuck for the medical bills, and there goes the site. And make sure every single employee has an ergonomic keyboard and a lumbar support, or somebody might get carpal tunnel and go on Workman’s Comp, and there goes the site. Oh, and make sure you cut off those scary pointy corners of all the newspapers, or somebody might get a papercut or get poked in the eye, and that’ll be the end of straightdope.com forever and ever and ever.
Yes, my examples are a bit ridiculous, but no more so than your explanation. Though some people have come to expect you and the rest of the upper echelons of SD staff to lie at the drop of a hat, I do not, and I don’t think it’s very becoming. Just go ahead and admit that you kicked Mel out because you got pissed off and didn’t want to her to play in your sandbox anymore, and maybe some of the Steaming Millions will calm down a bit.
“Continued from lower abdomen”
Winner, SDMB Sexiest Male
Winner, Best Photo In Profile (male)
I really have no opinion about whether Melin should have been banned or not. Since I haven’t been here all that long, I don’t have any friendship or other emotional attachment to Melin. She’s never impressed me either way as being a “goodguy” or a “badguy”. I think it’s difficult to judge any situation like this without actually having participated in it. And it’s really none of our business…according to the rules, it doesn’t matter if she did anything or not, she can be banned.
I will say that if I were all of you, I would watch what I say about this board while on this board. Obviously, from the rules that are posted and possibly (again, just possibly, not definitely), from the experience that Melin’s had, anyone can be banned at any time for any reason (or no reason). This is not a free forum and the rules of free speech do not apply. We are all here at the discretion of Ed and the administrators. We do not matter to them, either as human beings or as “customers”. That has been made very clear in the above posts that discuss the financial benefits (or lack thereof) of the message boards.
And, well, maybe that’s how it should be. Life isn’t fair. These boards are just an example of life being life and people being what most people are…petty, emotional, drama queens.
I apologize for my cyncism, but neither the soap opera that has occurred between Melin and the SDMB administrators, people’s reactions, or the counter-reactions have surprised me in the least. This is a great place to come and get good conversation and discussions, but there are other places in the world to do that. I like the people here and I’ll continue to come and chime in when I have something to say. I’ll just be careful to remember the non-value we all have here.
The sheeshes are falling like hard summer rain, ponding up on the ground beside me.
To Melin: sheesh sheesh sheesh sheesh………this “grievance” which could cost your professional reputation is incredibly petty and no sane person thinking with a reasonably clear head could possibly agree that this could destroy your real life professional reputation. Your conclusion that the TSD was officially involved in provoking Asterbark into calling you names was so speculative that it bordered on paranoia. In fact, I would say that the litigious attitude you brought to this dispute only reinforces the stereotypes of lawyers that outrage you so intensely. I mean, threatening to hunt down Asterbark in Northern VA so you can get her deposition to use against TSD……sheesh sheesh sheesh sheesh sheesh………get a grip.
To Ed and the “official” TSD folks:……sheesh sheesh sheesh sheesh………OK, I don’t blame you for severing contact with someone who threatens to sue you. It’s an effective tactic, I’ve used it myself, but it is only effective or believable when you DO IT RIGHT AWAY. C’mon, the lawsuit threat happened something like a month ago, and I don’t believe that this is why you are “banning” her. Despite the fact that the vast financial holding of the Chicago Reader were at stake, you continued to speak to her, you agreed to her “demands” to avoid said lawsuit, and you did not cut her off. I think that you are just annoyed that she is using the “best moderator” line in her sig to tweak you and you don’t have any other way to stop her and now that you’ve set a precedent by banning Cyberian you now see this road as a solution to all your frustrations…………sheesh sheesh sheesh sheesh
Barbara
Voted Best Moderator 
And ChiefScott was voted SmileyMaster and I was nominated for Mr. Congeniality. Either some people were being sarcastic or they were lamenting the absense of a “Most Litigious” category.
Great, now I’m gonna get sued.
Gypsy: Tom, I don’t get you.
Tom Servo: Nobody does. I’m the wind, baby.
Frankd6, Bricker (and another unnamed),
You are all correct that defamation is covered by CGL policies. I posted before doing my research and I was wrong. I’m sorry.
Bill