Czarcasm doesn’t really junior mod. He just quietly implies people are childish over-reacting dunces for disagreeing with the real mods. No rule against that!
It’s just wishful thinking that anything would’ve been done 
Maybe it’s just me, but the whole post actually makes it look *less *insulting. Anyway, it makes sense to suspend him for sending twicks messages saying “Fuck you,” but the original warning itself was utter, complete, unequivocal bullshit. All he did was point out Czar’s smug and irritating junior mod posting style. Oh shit, is this a personal insult too?
Can I ask a clarifying question?
mhendo’s suspension was, by moderator description, based on insulting language in a post toward another poster.
It appears that “insulting” is debatable. It’s certainly debated.
Is the principle in play really “insult”?
I suspect the principle in play is “ad hominem”: attacking the person rather than the idea. In fact, I’ve seen that phrase in discussion of other banning or suspension actions.
The nice thing about “ad hominem” is it’s not really a slippery subjective slope like “insult”. Ad hominem has a single clear objective standard: you attacked the poster, not the post. A post whose subject is the intentions, intelligence, heritage, or other characteristics of the opposing poster is ad hominem, period. Regardless of whether the post rises to the level of “insulting” or “fighting words.”
Ad hominem is a worthless rhetorical technique. It’s a logical fallacy. It’s the second-to-last refuge of the incompetent. And it’s grammatically obvious. If the subject of the key sentences of the post is “you”, it’s ad-hominem.
OK. Now, I’m sure this will get some flamage, because frankly, a lot of posters seem to want the right to fall back to ad hominem. But whether you acknowledge or not, it’s a low and cheap debating technique. It contributes heat but no light.
Anyway: my point is, rather than calling it “insult”, can we use the actual rhetorical/forensic term “ad hominem”?
Bolding and italics mine. Both warnings are NOT Czarcasm’s fault! :eek:
CITE! I do not think threadshitting is acceptable at any time, whether or not the person being verbally crapped on is doing things the way others would if they were in the person’s shoes! Edit: And please note, that is from a week ago, and the moderator (not Twickster) who gave the warning ALSO got cussed out via PM.
We don’t have a rule against apologizing for us (it’d be difficult to make one work), although we do ask that people who think we’re great find a way to express themselves without junior modding or insulting other people.
Then he should’ve thought of a better way to disagree with the warning. No matter how “not surprising” the reaction was, it was completely inappropriate. If you repeatedly curse out the staff, your posting here is going to be curtailed. I don’t think that’s unexpected or unreasonable.
I think that probably is just you. 
Yes. Last chance: I will close this thread or start giving out warnings if people keep posting this kind of stuff in this forum.
No, it was based on his insults toward the mods after those warnings. It’s my fault if I wasn’t clear enough in making that distinction.
They’re pretty much the same, and “insult” won’t require as much explanation and translation. So I think we’re going to stick with insult over ad hominem.
I like mhendo very much. I think he is an intelligent and excellent poster and person, and I hope to see him back as soon as possible.
Dumb.
You people have completely loony ideas about what personal insults are, especially considering that’s some of the *tamest *shit I’ve seen in ATMB. It’s noon now. I’m getting a drink.
Uh, yeah - that’s why I did, in fact, say “I’ll take your word for it”.
Not really - if anything it shines more light on the offensive portions of the post. If we’re drawing lines in the sand, are you really going to suggest that saying “you’re being condescending” is over it? Seriously? For it to be a personal attack, doesn’t it have to be both a) personal and b) an attack? Just because something is a shade negative doesn’t mean it’s an attack - if that’s going to be the rule, just assign BigT to be an administrator here and be done with it.
A lot of people are against the actions taken, just wanted to chime in and say that I think it was absolutely justified, that mhendo’s post was indeed over-the-top and absolutely insulting. Was glad to see a warning issued, it was appropriate.
And no, czarcasm using the “pot” word as a kettle/black reference was not over-the-top and not at all in the same category as mhendo’s hatred frothing post.
I think it’s obvious a lot of people are just looking to criticize czarcasm and twickster every chance they can. Let’s save the criticism for when it’s justified, try to be fair. Otherwise you’re only serving to discredit yourselves.
If you think that’s “a shade negative,” you may have watched too many presidential campaign ads. Sorry, that’s not “a shade negative,” it’s a personal attack. There are three separate insulting comments in there if you want to get down to it: ‘You are self righteously condescending,’ ‘you should beg for your [mod] job back’ and ‘you have an unwarranted sense of superiority.’ Any of those individually would probably deserve a mod note, all three of them in one post is enough to justify a warning.
How is “you should beg for your mod job back” insulting?
Amazingly, in my decade here, I’ve barely posted in a handful of threads about what TPTB do here. Very seldom has my opinion been one of criticism. However, it is impossible to ignore Czarcasm’s junior modding. It’s noted in a ton of ATMB threads and is complained about left and right. If no one is actually going to address that based off of his past history, then what is the recourse for us members? Would you all suggest we report his posts every time we see him do this? If so, can we take it a step further and say that we’ve done so in the thread, thus perhaps encouraging others to do the same? Maybe then, do to sheer volume, TPTB would finally be compelled to apply the same rules for him that they do for everyone else.
What else would it be? If you don’t feel it’s insulting I doubt anything I say about it is going to matter, but I can’t think of ‘you should beg for your mod job back because you can’t get by without it’ as anything other than an insult.
*ad hominem : marked by or being an attack on an opponent’s character rather than by an answer to the contentions made
insult : to treat with insolence, indignity, or contempt *
Ad hominem regards what is being said.
Insult not only regards what, but how it is said. You can answer the contentions and still be insulting.
The whole insult the post and not the poster is BS anyway. If direct insults aren’t allowed, then insulting one’s reasoning shouldn’t be either. It is wishful thinking that insulting someones thought process doesn’t insult them as well.
I do not believe that mods should have to put up with abuse. I agreed completely when discussions of mod actions were removed from the Pit. So I can understand the reason for action against him if he was abusive.
But the original warning was horribly stupid.
Something will be done. It will be ignored like its not happening. That’s something.
He was warned twice in a week though! Go look at the announcement yourself? The first warning was warrented, and it wasn’t given by twickster. BOTH moderators got abusive PMs from Mhendo as well. Edit: You are all focusing on czarcasm, and your dislike of his junior modding, and not seeing the rest of the events that more heavily contributed to this suspension. Why not start up a topic to discuss the junior modding? 
So now it’s against the rules to say anything even slightly negative about a post or a poster outside the Pit? We can’t say we think someone is being self-righteous and condescending? That’s not an insult, it’s a description of behavior.
Suspension because of “abusive” PM’s doesn’t fly either. Sticks and stones, ya know? Don’t read them, block them, take away the poster’s PM privileges, whatever. But suspending someone for something they said in private? That’s chickenshit.
Oh wait. I guess “chickenshit” should have been in the Pit. :rolleyes: