See, that’s the perfect response. Willingness to help the children but not willing to enable the adults.
Of course, the other side of the coin is that such children are trained from a young age to behave in the same problematic ways as the parents, and there’s usually not much anyone can do about it: there’s no way to re-train them while they are living with their parents. Sigh.
I made my choice not to have children long ago. I go above and beyond already for my niece and nephew. I will not sacrifice my whole life, sanity, and health, to do so.
I understand it takes a village to raise a child…but the fact is, they already have four people looking in on them instead of two, merely by virtue of the fact that we don’t have children. We spoil them and love them, but as long as the parents are around, it is their responsibility to take care of them. No, I wouldn’t let them go to foster care - I’d adopt them if that was the case, or at least give money to the grandparents if they took them in - but while the parents are fit and capable of working? You made them, you take care of them.
In the OP’s situation, if I was the husband and my wife was on board with me, I’d offer to take care of the kid and let her live with me as long as was needed. Mommy needs to find her own damn apartment, even if it is a tiny thing, and move out. I can take the responsibility of the kid off her plate, at least for a time, and she can get her act together and then the kid can move back in with her.
However the OP’s wife is not on board. Is he really supposed to work two jobs and drive himself to an early grave even though this kid has two working parents?
The dad is no winner. Basically he convinced the judge he could not afford the statutory amount for child support but since he’s now making more money he is helping out with some of the child expenses beyond his legal obligation. Everyone thinks he’s a jerk and from the few minutes if been around him that may be true. But y’all are forgetting something - this is the USA. Unless there is actual neglect going on as in call CPS, the father will not get custody of his kid. The 8 year old has clothes, food and shelter (thanks to Mrs. Cad more than her mom). Her mom doesn’t do drugs and waits until her daughter is with her dad to whore around. Is she a good parent? Nowhere close but she’s not bad enough to lose custody.
And the worst part is Mrs Cad is frustrated too but with her enabling (of everybody), this idea that an 8 year old and her mom will be living in an alley giving handjobs for a place to stay that night and some sort of “I was a single-mom so I know how rough it was.” and let’s be honest, Mrs. Cad is the diplomat of the family and I’m the asshole, she just will not say to her, “You owe us this money. We’ve given you breaks on rent before to help you pay bills. I’m not saying pay us right now but you don’t owe us money then blow us off with ‘whenever’.”
Maybe this will sum it up over the $30:
Mrs Cad: It’s not worth the $30. She has a disability so she doesn’t get it.
Me: It’s not about $30, it’s the attitude of “whenever” and her complete lack of appreciation for anything we do for her. She has the poor mentality that because she is poor, we (and everyone else) owe her a good life. And her disability doesn’t help that.
Mrs Cad: You need to get over it and deal with it.
Me: No I don’t. I pay my bills and take care of my 14 year old. She’s the one responsible for an 8 year old and has no means to live independently.
Mrs Cad: She has a disability you ignore.
Me: No, she has a disability you don’t help by ignoring. How will she function better if you condone her behavior because of the disability.
Fundamentally it comes down to this. I asked Mrs. Cad if at this point in time, what we are doing is helping SIL. She says yes and I say no.
I’m really hoping that once SIL is accurately diagnosed ($5 says autism) then Mrs. Cad will be open in listening to how to deal with someone with autism if you want to help them.
From everything you’ve said, I think this is a vain hope. You’re expecting something to happen which will make Mrs. Cad start dealing with this from a rational approach. If she’s not listening to you now, what makes you think she’d listen to an outside expert who’s telling her something she doesn’t want to hear?
SIL would never agree. She is in SILland and is worried that her daughter will hate her if she is not a good mother. Being a good mother includes:
Leaving your (at the time) 7 year old alone for hours. Actually Mrs Cad told SIL flat out if that happens again we’re calling CPS. Hasn’t happened since.
Not cooking a hot meal for your child if someone else is around. The only way the 8 year old gets a weekend breakfast other than cereal is if I’m up before she is.
Yelling at her about math. I actually stepped in and told SIL diplomatically to get the fuck out of the room and later told her that what she did was called educational abuse and was borderline emotional abuse. I won’t go through my background beyond I’m a math teacher and she can barely do basic algebra. Her reason for not asking me was that her daughter will hate her for not helping her with math homework. It didn’t help that in 10 minutes I taught her the section that 30 minutes of yelling and crying didn’t. After that, SIL has her daycare tutor her.
Ignore her to be on Facebook hours at a time.
Do you really think that given that situation that SIL would agree to let her daughter live with us away from her? I’ve heard her tell people on the phone how her daughter is lucky she’s such an awesome mom.
Because it’s NOT coming from me, it’s coming from the psychologist. Do you have kids? If so have you ever been a coach, scout leader, tutor, whatever for them? It is nearly impossible because you’re mom or dad. Same thing here. That’s why it took me so long to play the master’s gambit knowing it wouldn’t work because I was so frustrated. But you know what, the doctor will say the exact same thing I have, MC will listen and I will agree as if I never had thought of it myself.
I read through all the posts and agree with those who are wondering why the dad doesn’t step up?
The OP’s niece is definitely his responsibility as well.
I sympathize with your position but I think you’re being optimistic bordering on delusional if you think appealing to external authority is going to fundamentally change your wife’s position re SIL hanging out. Her position is based on her feelings and will not change regardless of what the doctor says. This will still come to loggerheads between you two.
Of for fucks sake, just leave with your kid already. Tell the wife she can come if she want to.
All I can say is, “I’m sorry” Saint Cad. You’re stuck between a rock and an even bigger rock, and I don’t see any way out that isn’t going to hurt, you especially.
I’ve opened my house to various freeloaders over time and have been burned financially and emotionally for most of those. My rule now is that I will provide help for my children ONLY, and only because I know that it would have to be something devastating for them to consider moving back in with me…and they’d be out again within weeks. Love my kids madly, but we all know it would have to be freakin’ Armageddon for us to live together longer term. 
I do hope Missus Cad will take the time to truly listen to what you have to say. Would it help to show her this thread perhaps?
But all the best for you mate. Take care.
I just saw in the Cafe Society thread that she’s left you at home with her friend for 10 weeks. You are a more forgiving man than I, Saint Cad.
Use this 10 weeks as time to do some house-cleaning? Get rid of some unwanted household pests?
Besides the extremely bizarre (and uncomfortable) event where SIL came home at lunch to get her phone and it was a rare day I was not at my second job so I was home (not having sex which strangely is part of the story) and she told me that’s the sort of day she would walk in and her (hypothetical) boyfriend would be cheating on her but she emphasized she was not talking about me because:
Oh wait, the OTHER story.
SIL has a second job. She got tired of never having money so she’s getting a second job and keeping the one with benefits. And get this, she said that she moved in with us hoping her life would get moving in a positive direction. You know more money, her place for the kid and dog, making professional contacts, etc. and she admitted that hadn’t been happening so she’s looking at this as the beginning of life improvement.
I’m still :eek: and I am so willing to listen to Mrs Cad give me the “I told you so speech.” Hey, it may not last but to hear SIL at least acknowledge it …
I call that progress!
Hope thing keep rolling in the right direction.
Second job fell through but she’s pretty sure that her and her new non-sugar daddy boyfriend will be moving out to a $1000-$1500 a month home (Remember that $500 for rent and ALL utilities is a hardship for her). They’ll rent only if their current plan of:
Sounds like the ideal time to make that move you were talking about earlier before SIL and friend figure out that they can’t make it on their own.
:dubious:
You think she is an undiagnosed autistic but she loves facebook?
I don’t understand your :dubious:. I know a few people with high-functioning autism diagnoses who love Facebook. It’s not like there is one presentation of Autism and it precludes using Facebook.
Sure I know that, but he seemed to think she was so severe she had never had gainful employment and would never be able to gain it. It just seemed odd.
And I didn’t read the update yet where she is working two jobs.
I never said she didn’t have gainful employment. It’s just that she works at WallyWorld and has for 8 years and is still below the poverty level and can’t afford to take care of herself and her daughter but still refuses to look for a better job because