More questions about HD and digital TV

Factual Questions
1

As some of you may know from my earlier thread, my 88 year old mother just bought one of those new thin screen HD digital TVs. She still very much has all her marbles, but she’s not terribly technical and she is fairly easily intimidated by new vocabulary, so I’m trying to help her out as much as possible. Unfortunately, I’m pretty ignorant about this whole thing myself.

We both live, although not together, in Trenton, New Jersey. We have Comcast Cablevision. Currently we both have basic cable, although I gather in February that’s being mandatorily changed over to digital, but Comcast will re-translate the broadcast back to analog for its subscribers. Price is very much an issue.

Anyway, per x-ray’s excellent suggestion in the original thread, I checked out Comcast’s digital cable packages, and discovered that they did indeed have a digital “starter” package for a dollar and a quarter less than Mom is paying for her basic analog. Not only that, but it included a few more channels, including about 8 HDTV channels and the National Geographic Channel (I was psyched about that!). But I was concerned, because Mom’s cable comes through her VCR, which isn’t digital, and I don’t see how she could record one channel and watch a different one if we have a digital converter box. So I phoned and asked.

Oh yes, they said. You can do that. Oh no, they said. You won’t get any channels that you don’t get now with the Digital Starter package. See that fine print about change without notice? Well apparently, in this case, it never was true - the change was instantaneous! Oh, but if you also get an HD converter box for $6/month, you’ll get the roughly 8 HD channels we have at that price range (basically the network channels).

So, the questions I have are:

Can Mom record one channel and watch another with a single digital converter box?

Does anyone have Comcast’s Digital Starter Package, and if so, what channels does it include?

Does Mom need an HD box on top of a Digital converter box to get HD channels?

I thank you all in advance for your answers.

2

Nope. The VCR will require the digital tuner to decode the signals for it and pass them to the VCR. Also, there is no way your VCR can record or even watch HD channels.

What you need is a DVR (digital video recorder). Basically a fancy VCR except it records to an internal hard drive instead of tape. Also has lots of other nifty benefits. The DVR offered by Comcast will allow you to record one show and watch another. Looks like they charge extra for this ($14/month…ripping you off but no choice as I think you are stuck with their equipment). Still, DVRs are very nice.

She needs an HD capable tuner. Either she needs a separate box from Comcast to get it with her older, dumber tuner or they should have one where it is all contained in one box. The DVR above should be an all-in-one system with no extra boxes. I do not know this for sure but it should be that way.
Personally I despise the cable companies for crap like the above. I have DirecTV and they recently called me telling me my old equipment was out-dated for their new HD content. I have a DVR/HD receiver in one I bought and was not pleased to hear this. I called them and they are giving me the new system, new dish and professional installation totally for free.

I desperately hope I never have to deal with cable again.

3

Hmmm. I don’t think my mom wants to go through all of that; she’s happier just sticking with her VCR. I, on the other hand, may very well go to Direct TV now that you’ve gotten me to look at it! Does it come in on co-ax cable?

4

Whack-a-Mole,

With satellite TV, is your reception always excellent?

Long ago we tried the dish, had a perfect signal, but the picture
quality degenerated in windy conditions and went to hell during
rain and snow falls.

This doesn’t happen to you?

Just wondering.

5

I live in Chicago so bad weather is hardly unheard of (just had a whopper of a storm swing through last night).

I’d say in a year I maybe lose 20 minutes of programming to bad weather…total. The rain/snow storm needs to be very strong to cut it out completely and usually those bad spots are short-lived and it goes back to more normal, lighter raining). In normal rain almost never a problem with maybe a minor hiccup (seen as artifacting on the screen) occasionally. Wind never seems to be a problem. I have a three-pickup dish though (used for the HD signal although DirecTV tells me they will be replacing that too with some newer, slimmer dish…will have to see how that goes).

My cable (also Comcast), when I had it, cut out for various issues FAR more often. Additionally the picture from cable was decidedly worse (although then it was an analog signal…digital may be better but I do not know).

That said my dish is on top of a 4-story apartment building with a completely unobstructed view to the satellite. It is anchored into a brick wall so very firmly mounted against wind.

The DVR setup for DirecTV is far superior to the cable version. The features and ability to do things like make a Wish list are really nice. Cable DVR is fine but distinctly not as refined. Also, the on-screen TV guide on DirecTV is tons nicer to cope with (no ads taking up parts of the screen).

I swear wherever I live again I’ll erect a 100-foot flag pole to mount a satellite dish if I have to rather than go back to cable.

That said the issue for most people is getting an unobstructed line-of-sight to the satellite. I have seen some dishes in Chicago setup in places I would think could in no way get a signal but apparently manage so perhaps there is some leeway here but mostly you need that clear line.

EDIT: I should also add that you can mount a specially made antenna to the satellite dish (special in that it fits cleanly to the dish) to pull over-the-air broadcast signals and some of their tuners can switch to play that signal in case the satellite cuts out or you want local programming the satellite does not provide.

6

Yes. The signal from the dish to the tuner travels via coax so will happily use your existing wiring. Double check however for multiple TV setups. I forget the issues here but something to be aware of (apparently the dish itself tunes to a signal so it needs to be capable of handling multiple channels). It can be done fine…had three receivers in my apartment going at one point…just something to pay a little attention to. You of course need a satellite tuner for each TV (same as for cable) but for the basic tuner they are not expensive at all.

7

And your apartment complex has no problem with putting the dish on the roof?

8

Hmmm…looks like you can use a VCR to record one show while watching another with Comcast but the setup in a bit kludgy. Still…if you want to go there here is their page on it.

http://www.comcast.com/customers/faq/FaqDetails.ashx?ID=62&fss=vcr

9

Yes, but that’s not with digital cable. That’s with what she has right now. Or if it’s with digital, it involves a splitter and two converter boxes. If that’s the case, she’s better off as she is right now, I think. She’s pretty contented as she is. I’m the one looking for improvements on her behalf, given this new toy she has.

ETA: I’m still hoping that someone with Comcast Digital Starter package will weigh in here.

10

In my case it is actually a condo and I rent. It was a new construction and the developer explicitly wired for satellite on the roof as well as cable so owners could choose. My roof is loaded with satellite dishes such that you’d think the NSA setup in our building.

That said landlords have little say in the matter. They cannot prevent you from installing a satellite dish in most cases as the law specifically prohibits them from stopping you. In my experience though most landlords, at least in Chicago, are used to it an allow it. You see them all over the place.

11

Pretty sure that is still the same setup you would require since the VCR will need the cable converter box to handle things. In the old days the VCR could tune the analog signal on its own. The digital signal it cannot handle at all so needs a box before it to convert it to an analog signal. Further, I am not sure the VCR could automatically change channels on the cable box dedicated to it (some VCRs could…depends what you have).

So yeah, to make it work with the VCR I think you are stuck with that mess linked above.

12

Not an answer to your question, Oy!…

Just in passing, we had the cable guy here for a problem a few weeks ago, and appropos to nothing in particular, he tuned to Channel 76 or 77 - a kid’s Channel - to show me what a digital picture looked like. Pretty sharp!

But the bad news is that anything below that (2 through 75, say) is still analogue, even though I have a digital box.

I didn’t think to ask him why a kid’s channel is digital and not, say NBC, CBS, etc.

13

Right now, through your basic cable you are getting three signals (assuming they are also your ISP).

  1. First is the analog channels. These are NOT going to go away in 2009, they will remain at least until 2012.

  2. QAM Channels. These are unencrypted digital channels. In all likelihood, your new HD TV can already see these channels, as most new TV’s with a tuner are QAM capable. Give this a try. Go into your TV settings and change the antenna setup to QAM and see if you get the digital channels. Local HD channels should be included in here as well. The only problem with QAM is that (unless you’re running it through say a Home Theater PC or you are using a digital cable box from Comcast) the channel numbers are not what you are used to. You’ll have to go through each one of them and possibly label them so you know what channel you are watching. You might also want to delete the non HD version of channels that offer HD.

  3. Is your internet traffic.

So in all likelihood you can watch digital channels through the QAM tuner on your TV right now, including local HD broadcasts without a cable box from Comcast and without needing to change to a digital lineup.

In order to see encrypted digital channels however, you’ll need a comcast cable box (or a some other cablecard ready device). Unfortunately, it’s likely that Comcast will continue to decrease the number of channels they pipe through as clear (unencrypted) QAM in the future, but local channels must be offered through QAM by law, atleast for now.

Assuming you do get QAM in your TV and want to use that, what you can do is get yourself a cable splitter and hook up one wire to the VCR, and another to your TV. This way you can record the analog version of a channel on the VCR and watch the digital version (or another digital channel) on the TV.

14

nevermind.

15

OK, the TV set itself up as far as channels go, so I’ll have to check this out the next time I’m there. Right now it’s set to CATV. I don’t remember seeing a QAM setting on the menu, just antenna and CATV. She is not using a PC or a digital cable box at this point.

Right now the cable goes to the VCR and then through to the television. Is there any reason why I’d need to split it?

16

Missed edit window…

Try the cable TV option. That might be the QAM setup. It might also be called “digital” or something like that. If you know the model and brand of the TV off-hand I can try and find out for you as well.

My personal setup:

I use comcast and I’m in Jersey City, NJ. I have a Home Theater PC at home hooked up to a basic cable line up. I have three tuners on my HTPC an analog tuner and two QAM digital tuners. Through the analog tuner I get all my analog channels. The only reason I use this tuner is to get the analog channels Comcast no longer offers through clear QAM (as far as I know this is only a handful including Sci-Fi). Through my QAM tuners I get my local HD plus 13 (pbs) HD, and the basic cable lineup in digital (except for sci-fi and a couple of thers).

This setup should suit me fine for the next few years when I will likely switch to Fios and get myself a cablecard ready home theater PC.

17

Her TV is an Element, but I don’t know the model, just that it was cheap because it had just been discontinued.

Back to your setup. I have Windows Media Center on my PC, and Comcast feeding into it. I can record and/or watch two things at a time, so I guess I have two tuners, but I don’t know anything about QAM. I do get the sci-fi channel though. (btw, did you watch Bush’s War on 13 on Sunday?) I don’t think my set-up is HD, is it?

18

If this is her TV: http://www.elementelectronics.com/pages/products/flx_3210.asp Then you’re golden. You should be able to pick up clear QAM channels through it.

If you get the Sci-Fi Channel you might be on analog. The QAM lineup appears to be different from region to region. I don’t think Media center XP directly supports QAM tuners, vista media center does though. If you are not in vista, they are probably analog tuners. In fact, if they are older than a couple of years, they probably are analog tuners. you won’t be able to see HD or digital programming if they are not QAM capable tuners. you might find this out through the manufacturer’s website.

I missed bush’s war damn it! I knew I forgot to record something this weekend. :frowning: I’ll do a search tonight and see if they’re showing it again and put it on my record que.

19

It’s an FLX 3220F. I’m looking now. THanks, Kinthalis!

20

OK, Kinthalis, I can’t find it right now. What is it about the spec that is telling you that she’s golden?