Just straight off the bat I’d like to assure theists that I’m not trying to have a cheap shot at the almighty or an atheist circlejerk - rather pointing out what arguments shouldn’t be made to convert non-believers to the fold as they are ineffective. If anyone’s interested I might play advocatus deus and start an annoying atheist argument thread to provide the same purpose the other way.
Moving on - if you don’t believe in God, there’s a very high probability that someone who does has tried to convince you that you’re wrong and has provided various points to establish their position that a God or gods exist, or simply that atheism is wrong. Some are more annoying that others. Let’s hash out what they are.
I’ve heard many of the popular arguments and have Googled a few more; there’s also the other button to cover my lacking imagination. I know what mine is but I’ll keep it to myself for now.
Quoting bible verses has to be way up there on the list. If I considered the bible to be authoritative/persuasive I’d already be a christian. Double bonus points if the quote is of Psalm 14:1, “The fool hath said in his heart, There is no God.”
Ha, there’s a fella I know who holds a placard with that downtown to convert passers by. Although I imagine John 3:16 is the more popular one. That’s in the poll, just search out the Simpsons ref.
“Something happened to make you hate God”. Do believers not realize how incredibly stupid that statement is when said to an atheist?! Someone who hates God is a believer, not an atheist! They may have an unusual belief in God, but regardless if they hate it they obviously believe in it.
I voted for “complexity,” “personal,” “morals,” “desire,” and “numbers”, because those are the ones that have specifically annoyed me the most, but then I read the OP and saw that he was interested in which arguments would be least effective when trying to persuade non-theists to change sides. For THAT, I’d add a few more: “You haven’t read…holy text properly,” “…Bible verse,” and “Hitler/Stalin,” for starters.
I am an agnostic polytheist. That is, I think that if there are any gods, there are many, but I’m prepared to be wrong about the whole thing and awaiting solid evidence.
The theist position that riles me is that there is no middle ground between Judeo-Christian God and atheist. You either believe in the One God, or you’re some sort of Satanist.
That said, I voted for both “I am a theist” and “Bible verse,” because appealing to the authority of the Bible covers a multitude of logical sins in a very annoying way.
Oh, you were right in your reading - I’m after ineffectual arguments for you personally, what has failed to convert you rather than a wider application of what you reckon annoys all atheists.
I’ve always had an animosity toward the, “I have a personal relationship with Christ,” argument. It’s the weakest and yet most non-dentable argument out there. First off, it’s impossible, secondly, “Oh, yeah? You don’t know,” is a perfectly acceptable retort.
My parents still believe this and I’ll be 31 at the end of the week.
Hating God, Bible verses, and “what if you’re wrong” are the most obnoxious to me. Combine “what if you’re wrong” with “faith is free/there’s no harm in it so why not?” arguments for double douchebag points.
At least Pascal’s Wager has some semblance of logic to it, I’ll give it that. Assuming you’re referring to the argument I think you are, which I’ve seen attributed to Leibniz rather than Pascal. Did Leibniz say something similar?
I’m not to familiar with Leibniz, as far as I know he made a variant on the cosmological argument as well as getting into the metaphysics of it. Thinking about it I could have included fuzzy language/buzzwords trying to convince you, oh well.
Of the options I’d wager that the ‘what if you’re wrong’ argument was possibly the most annoying to the late Christopher Hitchens, who calls it “…hucksterism of the cheapest, vulgarest, nastiest kind it’s possible to imagine.”
As for me I spent many a frustrating hour arguing with a co-worker that Hitler was not an atheist; having read My Struggle I eventually convinced him that he was a Christian in the no true Scotsman variety. Unfortunately he then went on to say “Well what about Stalin who killed even more?” - he was almost certainly an atheist but I failed to convince him that it made no difference.
They aren’t duplicates, one is the diametric opposite of the other in the interests of fairness and exploring the topic from the other side of the bench. I started the two threads in the same forum because IMHO is the place for polls.
Could have gone in GD I guess but I was just looking for opinions on the arguments themselves rather than debating the actual issue (which has been done to death in GD).
