Writing desk, huh? Somehow at this stage of his career, I picture Lucas at poolside stuffing Ding Dongs in his mouth and shouting garbled, half-intelligible instructions to a retinue of lackeys, who do their best to take it all down and then compare notes and piece it together later.
Man, I haven’t seen that film in forever and only half remember that bit. However, from memory, I think it illustrated a couple of things - Finney’s character’s inability to really consider the feelings of others except as extensions and reflections of himself. (I often think of the bit where he tells them all that the light near the window is for his exclusive use only and the rest must find what light they can elsewhere). I think he also is subconsciously aware that the old man’s plight is his own - just as the man’s home is crumbling around him, so is Finney’s mind and he suggests the theatre because that’s the thing that comforts him. But, as I say, the connection is one way. I think it’s a small example of the film’s bigger theme of failed emotional connections.
I must watch this again.
A few things from “Caddyshack”: what the hell was the deal with Spaulding “transforming” from an asshole little kid into a much older asshole with a better vocabulary, as in the “Ahoy, polloi” scene?
And why was “Tie” so upset about the money in the final tournament? During his night putting practice, he muttered something about the quantity of the stakes. For a man who has stacks of uncashed large checks lying around his apartment, why not play the game and not worry about it?
Great timing! I was just watching this yesterday evening, in honor of Peter Yates’ passing, and your interpretation sounds right. It was immediately after this that Sir started going off the rails, FTR.
Ocean’s Eleven. Rusty finds out that Tess is with Terry Benedict, and yells at Danny about it. Other members of the Eleven seem shocked that Tess is there. Rusty sets up Linus to trail Danny and make sure he doesn’t contact Tess.
But Tess is an important part of the caper actually happening! Danny has to pass her a cell phone so Rusty can call it after the blackout and reach Benedict. So one would think that the Eleven knew about Tess beforehand. Can anyone explain that one, or is it just a plot hole?
Ha, that’s a pretty good pick up Drain! I guess you could explain it away in that they only used her in that capacity because she was convenient. If she hadn’t been there they would have accomplished it another way.
Someone in the YouTube comments of Plinkett’s first Star Wars review suggested that Qui-Gon shouldn’t have existed, and I immediatetly thought: who would Obi Wan exposit to? But then I had an idea: Jar Jar. He’s perfect. He’s a fish (okay, horsey thing) out of water, and thus would be perfect. And, since he’s important, it might be easier to make him less annoying.
Then I thought about the arc, and realized that Obi Wan needs to rise in power throughout the three movies. Having him be an apprentice would work for that. So then I came up with the idea that Qui Gon does actually get separated from Obi Wan It would work well if Obi Wan is always bragging about Qui Gon to Jar Jar, so we’d feel it when he stumbles on him dead, perhaps killed by Darth Maul to actually make him menacing.
I recently watched *Salt *and that plot is horrible. I’ll spoiler tag my confusion regarding the plot in case nobody’s seen it.
Why didn’t Liev Schrieber just kill Salt and then kill the Russian president if he already suspected her of being disloyal?
OR…why not just do nothing?
Bringing in the Russian spy leader guy to “out” Salt in front of the CIA and then subsequently kill other agents on his way out was just…really stupid.
If he HAD to call out Salt, why not send an anonymous tip?
I just don’t understand it.
And that makes sense, but I’m still not sure I get it, because Eddie also says something to the effect of, “I was washed up, finished, and I’m getting back in the game. You bled that back into me.” Plus it convinces me even more how immature Vince is because sure, Eddie’s a father figure, but Vince should realize it’s time for him to fly on his own.
Agreed. I don’t think Eddie started out with the intention of getting back into it, because when he and Carmen are in the Caddy, and she says, “So this is liquor money,” he says, “Some of it,” which could mean a whole host of things. We know he was staking Julian, so to some extent, Eddie never left (I wonder if instead of being the new Fats from the first movie, he instead became Bert).
No argument there.
Could be ballsy, and I like your take on it, but for me, it’s still jarring.
I think I disagree — oh, Eddie’s a legend of course, but I don’t think Orvis is so shocked at Eddie managing/stakehorsing for Vince. I think Orvis is showing contempt for Vince, because while he (Vince) is smiling, he’s being ballsy and overly familiar…almost disrespectful in his greeting. IOW, if he’s flippant (albeit polite) to Orvis, Orvis is wondering how he acts toward Eddie.
I thought about starting a thread comparing/contrasting the book and film, and may still do it. Suffice to say they’re worlds apart. In the book, Eddie is much darker (not evil or bad, just more on the ropes of life–divorced, running a small poolroom that he loses in the divorce, emotionally lost, etc.). He’s not the winner he is in the movie.
One other thing I didn’t address before: Eddie has a vanity plate on the Caddy, which reads “TK 6”. What the hell does that mean? Standard Illinois plates don’t have two letters and one number as far as I know, or am I wrong? If it’s a vanity plate, and I think it is, who or what does the TK stand for? Tony Kanaan? Tommy Kendall?
That was all part of Linus’ test and a setup by Danny and Rusty. The 11 weren’t sure they could trust him, so they gave him all these little assignments where he’d have a chance to rat the rest of the team out to Benedict (or fuck it up and get caught), But because he stayed loyal, he proved he was part of the team.
My guess, TK = The Kid (a homage to The Hustler film). Not sure what the 6 means. I love this move and have watched it dozens of times, but not recently.
[QUOTE=Prelude to Fascination]
The Color of Money (spoilers): <snip>
And what’s with Amos’s line at the end of the bit when Eddie gets hustled? “Do you think I need to lose some weight?” Huh? I don’t get that…it just comes out of the blue. Sure, he was a subject in psych experiments (and so maybe a bit mentally unzipped because of it), but that line just doesn’t fit in my mind.
[/QUOTE]
If I recall, some of the strategy portrayed in the movie was to lull the opponent into thinking you suck as a pool player (possibly by losing a few games at first, for example), and get the opponent to raise the stakes in a rematch (I assume in a way that more than makes up for the money you lost in the first game or two).
I think that particular player (Amos) was using a disarming approach to lull his “marks” into underestimating him and possibly not playing their best game. All throughout their game, Amos is engaging in small talk, and playing a false humility.
The last line is all part of the act, and as such, is still played out, even though both players (by this time) know that the other knows it’s all just an act.
I haven’t seen the movie in a while but I had the impression that besides Rusty and Danny the crew mainly knew each other by reputation. If they’d worked together in the past they didn’t share many personal details.
They knew Danny had an ex-wife, but either hadn’t met her or had no reason to keep tabs on her after the divorce. They didn’t realize Benedict’s girlfriend was the former Mrs. Ocean. Even if some members knew Tess, slipping a cell into a coat pocket only requires one person, so there was no need for everyone to check her out ahead of time.
No, Justin_Bailley answered this one at the end of the previous page. They all knew each other, all except new guy Matt Damon. (IIRC they knew his father, which is how he got on the team in the first place.) They were all in on the ruse to test the character of Matt Damon.
OK, you’re making me think about this movie way more than I should. 
But…
Well, Eddie was washed up at that stage. He’d made an ass of himself, several times (if you count the first movie). So what Eddie says is true. When he says “you bled that back into me” ( a good line actually) he means your love and talent for the game made me feel it again too.
As to your next comment, yeah Vince was immature, but that’s kind of the point.
Just like rookie Vincent, when Eddie was young, winning the game was paramount. And that’s a rookie’s way of thinking; the best guy makes the money because he always wins, right? If I win, I take your $20. And that’s what we see on TV - Tiger Woods makes the money because he wins.
But in Eddies world, in the grifter’s world, things don’t work that way. Eddie alludes to this concept early in the movie when Carmen and Vince question Eddie as to which guy on the circuit is currently the best player, and Eddie, as if to show that this is the wrong question to even be asking says “the best is the guy with the most”.
We have to infer that in the interim between the two films, Eddie learned that sometimes the payoff is better when you lose. And making money is better than beating someone at 9-ball. And to do that, you need work the confidence game. And, incidentally, you can do that in all types of businesses - now he’s selling false-labeled liquor (among other things).
Yes, I agree, Vince is immature and inexperienced. But that’s why it’s so cool that the next time we see him, after he and Carmen have been on the circuit by themselves for a while, we’re suddenly introduced to a completely new streetwise Vincent who knows all the con angles. He’s set himself up as a credible contender, for a final match that he’s going to throw, just because he can make more money that way. That’s kind of a main plotline for the whole movie. We’ve made a kind of full circle: Eddie wants to play 9-ball for the pure challenge of the game (like Vince used to) and Vince wants to take down as many whales as he can (like Eddie used to).
We don’t see any part of the final game between the two of them, because, well, we’re left with the feeling that it’s not even important.
There are thousands of those droids wandering around. The only really distinguishing characteristic I can think of is C3PO’s silver leg.
I’m pretty sure that Rusty knew about Tess all along. They played it that way because I don’t think they were totally confident in Linus’ ability to play his part if he knew, though it isn’t spelled out. I’m not sure if any of the other 11 knew or not.
I can see that, and you’re right. I’d just like to have more exposition between the two films though, as in what Eddie’s done, because there’s very little, really, that ties the two films together.
F’rinstance, in the original, Eddie did want to take down whales (like Fats), but in the picnic scene with Sarah, he tells about his overarching love for the game, when he talks about how the pool cue is an extension of his arm; how it’s got nerves in it. So sure, Eddie (in the original) was immature to an extent, but the story had more soul than TCoM, because he hit bottom (getting his thumbs broken, finally losing Sarah in such a way that she’ll never be back), and he learned from it.
Vince, on the other hand, learned how to be street smart, but he still was a completely unsympathetic character. Whether that was by design or not, I don’t know. But I hated his smarmy (“Snooty…” “Snooty?” “Snotty”) attitude.
It’s not as though I expected the sequel to be a rehash/remake of the original, and Vince should’ve had his thumbs broken as well, but to me, Vince just added…nothing.
And I’ve always thought of the film as a (supposed) passing of the torch between Newman and Cruise, because Vince isn’t even in the book. Cruise had made Risky business about 3 years before, and was obviously the hot new thang in Hollywood (I’d have to check release dates for the months, but TCoM and Top Gun were both released in 1986). So he was definitely on the rise when this film was released, hence my thought about the torch passing, although Newman would be around for a long time, he wasn’t in his mid-20s like Cruise.
But this proves that even though one has seen a movie anywhere from 30-50 times over the years, it’s still possible to get a fresh view.
I know I’m coming in pretty late here, but just in case Jaledin (or someone else) still cares: The real answer is that, hey, it was the sixties (yes, I know the movie came out in '71, but it still had the sixties mentality), movies weren’t meant to be nitpicked and fully self-consistent.
But in the context of the movie: If I remember correctly (it’s been decades since I’ve seen it), the beginning of the movie actually spelled out why he was in such a hurry. I believe his boss (or whoever that was when he picked up the car) said that he had just a couple of days to make the delivery.
And why crash into the dozers at the end? Because he know he was done. There was no way out, no way that he could continue to elude the law. And if he gave himself up, he’d spend a long, long time in prison. Not what a “free spirit” like him could handle. Interestingly, I would actually say that his motivation for killing himself at the end by ramming his car into the dozers was very similar to the motivation for Thelma and Louise to kill themselves at the end by running their car off a cliff.
In theory, they couldn’t have killed him. Most cars produced in the last 20 years have trunk release mechanisms.
But they would have been charged with resisting arrest, false imprisonment, assault with a deadly weapon and kidnapping, which when combined with a manslaughter charge would add up to life imprisonment under a 3 strikes law state.