MSNBC Edits Mitt Romney Speech To Make Him Look Silly

[UltraVires]

@brickbacon

Well, I can see why someone might say that, but it’s worth noting that, even in context, Mitt comes off as out of touch and robotic.

I agree, but out of context it makes him look like an absolute fool. Like your grandfather staring blankly at a smartphone in wonderment of all it can do. It’s a hatchet piece that could have been legitimately used to slam Romney without creative editing. Touch tone keypad. Hehe.

[brickbacon]

@jtgain

I agree, but out of context it makes him look like an absolute fool. Like your grandfather staring blankly at a smartphone in wonderment of all it can do. It’s a hatchet piece that could have been legitimately used to slam Romney without creative editing. Touch tone keypad. Hehe.

I am not so sure I agree, but I think reasonable people could. The, “it’s amazing” comment, while somewhat out of context, was not the focus IMO. The focus is this exasperated multimillionaire, trying his best to come of as a man of the people. It’s when he tries to get folksy, asking people, “where they get their hoagies”, and describing how he, “went to a place called Wawa’s”, and how you, “press the touch tone keypad”, and mispronouncing the store several times, that the MSNBC people were reacting to.

[UltraVires]

@brickbacon

I am not so sure I agree, but I think reasonable people could. The, “it’s amazing” comment, while somewhat out of context, was not the focus IMO. The focus is this exasperated multimillionaire, trying his best to come of as a man of the people. It’s when he tries to get folksy, asking people, “where they get their hoagies”, and describing how he, “went to a place called Wawa’s”, and how you, “press the touch tone keypad”, and mispronouncing the store several times, that the MSNBC people were reacting to.

But without the lead in about allegedly federal inefficiency, the story makes it look like that was Romney’s sole point: That a local convenience store has a touch display that lets you order food! And look at how stupidly I describe the process! Boy am I an idiot!

The real point was that the feds require a lengthy form, but private enterprise lets you push a button. Others have pointed out that the analogy is flawed, and that could be the debate (alongside his stilted language and obvious attempt at pandering) But his story, without the lead in, makes a viewer think that Romney just found out about this technology and was sharing it with the unwashed masses.

[septimus]

Regarding the allegedly excessive red-tape for change of address, it’s important to note that much of the Federal government’s obstructive red-tape requirements were deliberately imposed by Republicans, or at the behest of regulated businesses.

Lewis Lapham has written eloquently on how Republicans impose superficially plausible rules on regulators but for the purposes of hamstringing the regulations and encouraging citizens to perceive the government as incompetent, but I can’t find his articles with Google. However here is a 2011 article (pdf) on the topic:

3. Insufficient Funding

… with the exception of FDA, none of the [five largest health and safety] agencies had received significant increases in their budgets since 1980. FDA has received moderate funding increases, but only to accelerate its process for approving new drugs, leaving its other functions, such as protecting the food supply, short of money. Second, the regulatory responsibilities of the agencies has substantially increased, putting greater strain on existing resources. Finally, all of the agencies have floundered in addressing pressing regulatory problems, a symptom that is attributable in large part to a lack of funding.

The idea of using budget cuts to slow down agency enforcement and rulemaking efforts in administrations hostile to regulation dates back to the Reagan administration, and this tactic was also popular in the George W. Bush administration. While budget cuts are not normally mentioned as a tool of regulatory capture, they have this impact. Legislators friendly to business interests support the budget cuts, and regulated entities get the benefit of reduced enforcement, or even non-enforcement of the health, safety, and environmental laws.

4. Rulemaking Ossification
   Budget cuts reduce regulatory effectiveness, in part, because agencies have been hobbled by a series of procedural hurdles, found both in legislation and a series of presidential orders. With smaller staffs and less money, agencies find it more difficult to finish regulations because there are more procedural hurdles to overcome, a phenomenon known as “rulemaking ossification.” Nowadays it regularly takes five years or more to finish important regulations. Procedures are important to ensuring accountability and fairness in the administrative process, but there has to be a reasonable balance between accountability, fairness, and administrative efficiency. For regulatory opponents, however, the goal is to support additional procedures in the name of accountability and fairness, regardless of the impact of additional procedural burdens on regulatory output. [my underlining] Congress’ failure to account for administrative efficiency can be attributed to the superior influence that corporations and their allies have in Congress as compared to public interest groups, another outcome of public choice dynamics.

I have previously described this effort to monkey wrench the administrative process as “sophisticated sabotage.” Adding procedures is a politically appealing way to capture regulatory agencies because additional procedures can be sold to the public as important to ensuring accountability and fairness. Moreover, as I will discuss later, the business community has paved the way for this argument by an extensive and expensive campaign to delegitimize government…

[IceQube]

I want to see Romney flexing his muscles, that’s what.

[Hentor_the_Barbarian]

@jtgain

But without the lead in about allegedly federal inefficiency, the story makes it look like that was Romney’s sole point: That a local convenience store has a touch display that lets you order food! And look at how stupidly I describe the process! Boy am I an idiot!

The real point was that the feds require a lengthy form, but private enterprise lets you push a button. Others have pointed out that the analogy is flawed, and that could be the debate (alongside his stilted language and obvious attempt at pandering) But his story, without the lead in, makes a viewer think that Romney just found out about this technology and was sharing it with the unwashed masses.

The government doesn’t make you fill out a form for a sandwich. Romney has no point, and he’s engaging in deceit whike trying to make one.

Moving a practice is not just a matter of pressing a button that says “I’m over here now.” Was the guy just changing his mailing address or his billing address? Was he adding a new practice location to an existing one or changing practice locations altogether?

Romney made himself look stupid and out of touch here, just not for the reason everyone seems to have jumped on.

Anyway, I prefer the video of him struggling to identify a chocolate doughnut myself. Makes him seem just as effete and out of touch. Have you seen that one yet?

[Gyrate]

@kaylasdad99

Oh, bullcrap. See post #55.

Yes, but Shodan will swear up and down that it doesn’t happen, and then, occasionally, slips up and admits what he really thinks - it is real, it does happen, but it doesn’t count because it would negate his point.

Anyhoo, I’ve never seen the point of watching MSNBC. While not remotely in FoxNews’ league, the smug levels are still well into the toxic range.

[brickbacon]

@jtgain

But without the lead in about allegedly federal inefficiency, the story makes it look like that was Romney’s sole point: That a local convenience store has a touch display that lets you order food! And look at how stupidly I describe the process! Boy am I an idiot!

Eh. I don’t think they were attempting to address Romney’s point at all. The purpose for them of showing the clip was to reinforce the narrative that Romney is out of touch, and is bad at pandering to everyday folks. Again, it’s somewhat of a cheap shot, but one that does not hinge on the public/private comparison he was making. It was more about the mispronunciation and difficulty he has describing a sandwich ordering process.

@jtgain

The real point was that the feds require a lengthy form, but private enterprise lets you push a button. Others have pointed out that the analogy is flawed, and that could be the debate (alongside his stilted language and obvious attempt at pandering) But his story, without the lead in, makes a viewer think that Romney just found out about this technology and was sharing it with the unwashed masses.

Well, I think that probably was one of his first exposures to the store and that technology in that context. But as I said before, I see where you are coming from, but I think most are overthinking this. In the clip I saw, Mitchell didn’t elaborate on the video to underscore the point you are making, which makes me think it was more about him using terms like “touch tone keypad” and looking incredible uncomfortable.

[VinylTurnip]

@Gyrate

Anyhoo, I’ve never seen the point of watching MSNBC. While not remotely in FoxNews’ league, the smug levels are still well into the toxic range.

I can’t stand watching either of them, or CNN. Leaving aside questions of bias, they assume all viewers are complete idiots and then take great pains to make it so.

[Marley23]

@brickbacon

I don’t think they were attempting to address Romney’s point at all. The purpose for them of showing the clip was to reinforce the narrative that Romney is out of touch, and is bad at pandering to everyday folks.

No, they weren’t addressing the argument - and that’s fine, it’s been a pretty standard claim for Republicans for a long time and campaign coverage was probably not the place to start reviewing it. And Romney is pretty bad with the everyday folks stuff. But that doesn’t mean it’s OK to manipulate video to create “evidence” for that view.

[Gyrate]

@VinylTurnip

I can’t stand watching either of them, or CNN. Leaving aside questions of bias, they assume all viewers are complete idiots and then take great pains to make it so.

I entirely concur.

[John_Mace]

@Gyrate

Anyhoo, I’ve never seen the point of watching MSNBC. While not remotely in FoxNews’ league, the smug levels are still well into the toxic range.

Amen. That’s exactly the way I feel! MSNBC used to be my “go to” network when I wanted to have the news on. But the smugness level has become nauseating in the past few years. And those self-promoting commercials with the “Lean Forward” message is :rolleyes: dumb. Worst is that blow-hard who thinks his ideas are so great that he needs “two shows”. Between Fox and MSNBC, they are driving me to CNN or nothing at all.

Actually, I’m pretty happy to just stream the audio for NPR on my laptop.

[brickbacon]

@Marley23

No, they weren’t addressing the argument - and that’s fine, it’s been a pretty standard claim for Republicans for a long time and campaign coverage was probably not the place to start reviewing it. And Romney is pretty bad with the everyday folks stuff. But that doesn’t mean it’s OK to manipulate video to create “evidence” for that view.

Well, I don’t think they manipulated video to create evidence. The evidence for the claim I think they intended to make was clear, and on display. Romney can’t even get the name of the place right, or comfortably describe a sandwich ordering process without becoming hurried or using stilted language. That said, the “crime” here is that they were using innuendo (which leads to ambiguity) to make the claim that he is out of touch instead of just saying it outright, or discussing the supposition with substantive debate. I agree they erred, but not in the way some are saying.

[Buck_Godot]

@brickbacon

Well, I don’t think they manipulated video to create evidence. The evidence for the claim I think they intended to make was clear, and on display. Romney can’t even get the name of the place right, or comfortably describe a sandwich ordering process without becoming hurried or using stilted language. That said, the “crime” here is that they were using innuendo (which leads to ambiguity) to make the claim that he is out of touch instead of just saying it outright, or discussing the supposition with substantive debate. I agree they erred, but not in the way some are saying.

I agree completely. Even in context Romney’s Wawa quotes sound fake folksy and rather tone deaf. To my mind this is largely irrelevant I care much more about Romeny’s tax policy than I do about his understanding of Wawa’s, but because the viewing audience likes blooper reels, MSNBC wanted to put it out there. From a programming standpoint it makes no sense to include 3 minutes of boring campaign speech just to just to put a 15 second awkward moment in context. Can anyone here horrified by the editing honestly say that if they were the story editors at MSNBC they would have played to whole thing in its entirety just to give context to a throw away gaffe.

[magellan01]

@Hentor_the_Barbarian

The government doesn’t make you fill out a form for a sandwich. Romney has no point, and he’s engaging in deceit whike trying to make one.

While I commend you on your observation that “the government doesn’t make you fill out a form for a sandwich”, I think you miss the point. Perhaps you’ve never heard of something called an analogy. Here, let me parse it out for you. An example of the private sector is sandwich selling. And due to the competitive pressures of so many people wanting to sell sandwiches, some will look for ways to make it easier for those buying sandwiches to do so.

The federal government has no similar competitive set. So, it lacks the pressure to make things easier and easier for the people who have to interact with it. THAT was the point he was making.

Hope that helps.

[Really_Not_All_That_Bright]

@neuroman

Haha, a very apt analogy, since GWB’s “grocery store” moment was also a complete and utter fraud, fabricated by an NYTimes reporter.

That doesn’t say it was a complete and utter fraud or a fabrication. It essentially says it was a piece of sloppy journalism.

[pseudotriton_ruber_ruber]

@magellan01

While I commend you on your observation that “the government doesn’t make you fill out a form for a sandwich”, I think you miss the point. Perhaps you’ve never heard of something called an analogy. Here, let me parse it out for you. An example of the private sector is sandwich selling. And due to the competitive pressures of so many people wanting to sell sandwiches, some will look for ways to make it easier for those buying sandwiches to do so.

The federal government has no similar competitive set. So, it lacks the pressure to make things easier and easier for the people who have to interact with it. THAT was the point he was making.

Hope that helps.

So if you draw an analogy between a scary scary thing that doesn’t actually exist and one that does, and claim that the government can do both things to you, then you’re good?

[DMark]

Maybe because Nevada is a swing state, but we have been getting the Obama quote “the private sector is doing fine” slam ad from Romney “I approve this message” non-stop. So it is not only MSNBC or Fox who likes to take a sentence and run it into the ground,

And although it is no secret I am a huge Obama fan, I do wonder how in touch Romney is with the average guy on the street. Not that having a beer with Mitt is a huge factor, but he does seem to live in an entirely different world. Obama at least had some creds for doing street work in his community, even though he was not exactly gangsta. I can see where Romney would be fascinated with the pretty buttons and high-tech of Wawa.

[BobLibDem]

@John_Mace

Not really. I think most people around here, left and right, recognize that MSNBC moved from news to advocacy over the last few years, even if they aren’t quite in the same league with Fox.

Which is why they gave Joe Scarborough his own show? Pray tell, who is the Democrat on Fox with his own show?

[John_Mace]

@BobLibDem

Which is why they gave Joe Scarborough his own show? Pray tell, who is the Democrat on Fox with his own show?

Is it your contention that MSNBC doesn’t lean left? I don’t care if they lean left less than FOX leans right. That was never the claim. In fact, it was already noted that they aren’t quite up to the Fox standard yet. There is nothing to “pray tell” about, other than your insistence on dodging the issue at hand.

Go and open an hundred threads about Fox if you want to discuss that network.