Maybe someone else could explain this to me better. I was reading the news over the weekend with Musharraf down playing Bin Laden’s role in the 9/11 air strikes. Maybe I missed something but I don’t ever remember anyone in the media actually saying that Bin Laden actually planned to “knock down the towers by stealing a bunch of planes and using them as missiles.” I mean I can understand that Laden tells his filth to kill everything that moves but even I, having never seen any intelligence, would expect that a guy at his level probably doesn’t plan in that sort of detail.
I don’t know but after reading that piece Musharraf sounds like a fool.(But I know the idiots that write into the newspapers and say “He did so plan it” are even bigger fools.)
I don’t know what happened in the US but immediately after the event, Tony Blair made a statement to parliament (in an effort to get support for attacking Afganistan) in which he said that there was indisputable evidence that Bin Laden had orchestrated the attacks. Obviously, he could not detail the evidence for security reasons. Remember too, that the CIA/FBI had amassed a fair bit of intelligence about him beforehand also…there was little doubt that he was directly involved, reading between the lines, as he was named immediately following the attacks.
Musharraf is the head of an Islamic nation which has a lot of sympathy for Bin Laden and believes that they are fighting for the Palestinian’s cause too.
No politician is going to try to enrage their population. Take his position into account and reread what he said. I don’t think he has much of a choice.
I seem to recall that the plan with the first WTC bomb was to actually knock down the towers.
The idea was that one tower would fall onto the other, knocking them both down and causing devastation along the whole length of the towers.
So, hard though it is to believe, the first bomb would have actually been worse than the 9/11 attack had it succeeded. It was a HUGE bomb and may well have achieved the desired result had they done it right.
Fortunately it didn’t succeed because they put the bomb in the wrong place, next to a main supporting pillar. This pillar absorbed most of the impact.
So knocking the towers down has long been a part of al qaeda’s gameplan.
But no, I don’t think Bin Laden thought the planes would knock down the towers. Maybe he hoped they would but he didn’t realistically expect it. He just got lucky. This time.
Sorry, Jojo, but once structural integrity has been violated, the skyscraper doesn’t tip over like a tree; it falls straight down. Hypothetically, the huge impact at the base of the collapsing tower may well have knocked the bottom out of the second tower and caused it to collapse as well, but the point is, tall buildings don’t hold their shape and fall sideways. So even if the '93 plan had worked, there’s no way one or both towers would have stretched themselves out across lower Manhattan.
Actually, a lot of people do know what would ahve happened had the WTC bomb worked. My uncle (well, actually he’s my ex-uncle-in-law, but whatever) is an engineer who specializes in earthquake-proofing buildings. Like Cervaise said, skyscrapers collapse straight down, not topple sideways, even when being shaken violently side-to-side. Although it seems perfectly likely that this fact would escape the notice of the sort of sub-human sumbitch who would plot murder on that sort of scale.
Well whatever the plan was I really don’t have a hard time believing that Bin Filth didn’t plot it in detail. I actually don’t remember major ever actually stating Laden did the plotting, just his band of thieves did the work. I also remember that reports that came out after Atef had been destroyed mentioned he was the animal responsible for planning their acts.
I mean hell, it’s not like I actually think Bush plans each and every military movement of US forces so it’s not like It’s news to me Bin Splattered doesn’t do that either. Of course it doesn’t make him any less culpable for 9/11.(Well ok, maybe if you were a scumbag attorney like Ron Kuby you’d think that he’s not responsible but for people like me just creating the infrastructure to do it makes him culpable.)
CRorex makes a good point. Musharraf is in a very tenuous position and is trying everything he can to not get assasinated. He was probably exploiting the technicality that Bin Laden wasn’t directly involved in the planning of this operation. That makes him no less guilty of course. Just as not dicussing the details of the murder with the hitman you hired doesn’t make you innocent.
Umm Balduran I don’t think that he was exploiting anything.
There is a huge segement of very angry youth in a lot of middle eastern countries. It’s easier for them to be controlled if they have their hatred focused on something far away from the ruling powers. After all, angry + disillusionment + large group of people = revolution.
Granted I’ve never understood that even among the college educated population of youth how effective the propaganda is working…
Musharraf is trying to say that the terrorist acts is less bin Laden’s doing than a whole structure of radical Islamic terror mindset that swept Osama bin Laden in. It almost got to Musharraf himself before he saw the light, and a couple of American warplanes heading his way. His fighting the terrorists in his country takes more balls than one realizes. Also, his situation is further complicated by India.
Balduran, CRorex, and capacitor I find myself agreeing with you guys. I mean that’s about the only reason that sounds like it’d make sense. I’m still surprised I haven’t heard any American nitwit (like O’Reilly) take this out of context and say something to the effect that of course Laden planned it. Balduran you do have a good point there. I mean I hope nobody really thinks if you tell a hitman you have a “problem” that you need solved that it would absolve you of all culpability.
I’m not sure that’s an accurate analogy. The POTUS has many other responsibilities besides military action. He’s the leader of government for an entire country, so responsibility has to be spread out among many other people. OBL is the leader of a faction with a very narrow agenda. As you and Balduran pointed out, he’s still culpable; his people had to get his approval before pulling off any strike, let alone something as monumental as 9/11.