NFC East 2006 - 2007 [NFL]

I know injuries are part of the game and a team has to work around them. However, I am afraid the Giants have now lost too key players and are going to have a tough time winning the division. It will be a major help if we could get Osi or Strahan back and I think Eli needs Luke back.

How weird would it be to start using #12 Jared Lorenzen a lot more often as an option back. He could go in place of Finn to run, block or throw the ball. It seems like we need to change the offense quickly and I am probably grasping at straws. I always liked when the Tuna had designed plays around Megget. Jared is huge with a good arm and he moves okay of a 285-pound QB.

Jim

Eli Manning is not throwing with confidence. Tim Carter is not stepping up, given a chance to be the number 2. The offensive plan doesn’t throw enough to Jeremy Shockey early in the game.

With Luke Pettigout out, they need to have more 2 TE or 2 RB sets. With Tiki Barber in your backfield and Bruisin’ Brandon Jacobs to spell him, you don’t go a whole game with only 13 carries, even if you’re only getting 3 per.

The Giants had a poor offensive plan which was then executed poorly, and are too hurt on defense. They can’t mount a pass rush, they can’t rotate in often enough to keep linemen fresh late in the game, and late in the game they can’t stop the run.

The Giants are treading water right now, and really need to get back Michael Strahan, Osi Umeniyora, and Sam Madison.

Nice.

Now, now, Ellis. The last thing we need around here is a “romophobe!” :wink:

Happy Thanksgiving everyone, and Go Cowboys! I’m liking how they played today against the Bucs, and now the Boys get 10 days to prepare for the Giants. Things are looking up for the Cowboys at the moment. I like where they are positioned in the NFC East! :slight_smile:

After yesterday’s performance, I’m a full-fledged, unapologetic romophobe.

How 'bout them Cowboys!! I’m so proud of Romo–tying Aikman’s record for TD’s in one game! Part of me was hoping he’d go for it and get another, and part of me wanted Aikman’s record to stand. But as far as dilemmas go, this one ain’t so bad–either way, we got lotsa TD’s! :smiley:

I’m really glad it didn’t take them long to learn to NOT leave Galloway wide open! A couple of long passes to him and Big D caught on! Usually it takes a lot longer and a lot more yardage given up before they realize, “Hey, if we leave this guy open, they’ll actually throw to him–every time!!”

And I’m just about ready to put Vanderjagt through the damn uprights myself. What is it with him? A 22 yard field goal, and he BARELY made it! Five yards back, and it would’ve missed by a mile! I tell you, they’re going to have to start lining up on the far left side of the field to keep him from going wide right with his kicks. It’s driving me crazy!!!

Oh, and D_Odds? :stuck_out_tongue: :stuck_out_tongue: :stuck_out_tongue:

:wink:

Chantuese–a full-fledged, unapologetic Romosexual! :smiley:

Ugh, I hate being right. I fired up the Giants boards just now out of morbid curiosity. What was the top thread titled?

Eli Manning IS NOT Ryan Leaf

Holy christ, reading that right off the bat was like a sucker punch. It was worse than last week’s Inside the NFL when Peter King compared the Eli trade to the Herschel Walker deal.

For the first time since his retirement became a given, I’m okay with Ernie Accorsi leaving the Giants. Hell, I’m actually happy about it. The Eli trade doesn’t bug me too much; that deal facilitated bringing in Kareem McKenzie, Antonio Pierce, Plaxico Burress, Jay Feely, and Kendrick Clancy. Four of those guys are still around, and (for better or worse) part of the nucleus of the team.

But that’s just it. Was Ernie – and I – fooled by some of these guys? I’m still a big fan of Pierce, and I’m okay with McKenzie, but my confidence has taken huge hits on Eli, Plaxico, and Feely.

Eric Mangini came in and cleaned house, letting HOF career Jets go without a second thought. (As I was reminded today watching Kevin Mawae knocking around Giants like bowling pins.) I was bummed at the time, and felt very disconnected with the Jets this past offseason. But now? Hell, the Jets rule, and my faith is definitely restored in them.

True, Mangini isn’t the GM. I forget his name, but he’s new as well. Then again, EA’s replacement will be a promotion from within, so if the problem is endemic in the organization, it ain’t gonna get fixed anytime soon. But still, I’ve felt for years that the team was in good hands with Accorsi at the reins. Not anymore.

Can a Giants fan please answer a question for me? I’m wracking my brain to try and remember one single instance of Eli hitting a receiver in stride, which is all Tony Romo seems to do. I have every one of his games on tape; please cite an example so I can go watch it and live in the past.

That was one of the worst losses by the Giants in my memory. Pisarcik and the San Fran playoff debacle were worse, but I cannot think of many others as bad.

It took a large effort with many contributors to lose that game. I heard the familiar refrain of the whistle of a runaway train after the Burress surrender. That was the ugliest play of the day. The failed sack I cannot even comprehend except to say that it is time to take the quarterbacks out of their damn dresses and let defenders hit them again.

Eli looked like he was making progress early in the year; he has now taken a large step backwards.

Jim

Ellis, I share your pain. My friend and I have disagreed since draft day whether trading for Eli or ‘settling’ for Rivers would have been better. I’ve always said the Gints should have kept their draft picks. He says if you have an opportunity for a franchise QB, you take it, and Rivers didn’t look as good at that time.

That said, so much went wrong in the 4th quarter that Eli can only take 1/3rd of the blame. We had the Titans stopped twice on defense, yet boneheaded plays killed us. I understand Kiwanuka being afraid of a Roughing-the-Passer. So, instead of driving Young to the ground, just hold him. Instead, he let him go. Walker - that was inexcusable. That’s the reason he plays behind Corey Webster, who also has his problems. Our offense needs to give our defense more rest, as the Gints don’t have the depth to keep fresh legs in for four quarters.

This week, there will be no Tiki or Jeremy blaming the coaching. This loss was on the players and their mental errors late in the game. I am sad and disgusted at the Gints play in the 4th quarter.

I shudder to think of just how good the Cowboys could be if we had any other owner. Man hugs for Bill Parcells, DeMarcus Ware, Tony Romo and Terry Glenn.

Walks up with empty bowl

“Please Sir… may I have more?”

[Yeah, it’s cheating, but I’m just going to copy-and-paste an e-mail I sent to a friend on the subject]

Ok…I’ve had a day to settle down and patch up the holes in the plaster. Here are my thoughts:

I’ve known for a few weeks now that the Giants are in no way a Super Bowl team. All I wanted was a chance to get disappointed during the playoffs, and that possibility is still on the table. It all comes down to next weekend. Please, please, please, for the love of all that is good in this world, please let Strahan and/or Osi be back for that game. Preferably both, but I’ll take one. If they beat the Cowboys (again) they’ll have a pretty good hold on the division, and perhaps I’ll have a happy January (or rather, a happy end-of-December, and a pissed-off January after they blow their Wild Card game)

To address your points [the non-sack and Coughlin having a conniption] – my jaw dropped when Kiwanuka broke the cuddle hug he was giving Young, but as soon as it happened, I knew why – the pussifcation of the NFL. He had Young d-e-a-d. No escape possible. The guy was as good as sacked. And when you have a QB in that situation, and you have the gall to, you know, do your fricking job, then the laundry flies and you get 15 for roughing. It was utter crap – he did exactly what the NFL wants pass rushers to do, and he got fucked for it. His only real mistake (and it was a biggie) was turning his back as soon as he let Young go.

Of course, I just now heard that he says he thought Young threw the ball, so that kind of wipes out a lot of the last paragraph. Eh…not really…the idea still stands.

There are two things that are keeping my head screwed on about this. One I already covered – next week is the important game. The other is that I’m looking at this as fair trade for the Eagles game. The Giants had a ridiculous comeback in a game they should have lost there, so the two cancel each other out. The good thing is, if they lost the one they should have lost and won the one they should have won, they wouldn’t still be perfect in the division. All’s well.

As for Coughlin, fuck you very much for airing dirty laundry to the media about Eli a week after getting on Tiki’s case about airing dirty laundry to the media. The man better pray the Giants make the playoffs, or at least come close. If they finish with anything less than an .500 record, he’ll be out on his ass faster than you can say “Sorry, Ernie Acorsi retired”.

Oh dear, I hope there’s no dissention in the Giants locker this week before the Boys arrive.

That would be terrible.

Cowboys kick Vanderjagt to curb, sign Gramatica

Holy Crap. I know he’s sucked, but this seems pretty drastic when your backup plan is Martin Gramatica. $2.5 million down the pisser, eh?

This is Bill Parcells we’re talking about. How many kickers did he go through last season? Didn’t he fire kickers two weeks in a row last year? That’s why bringing in the liquored up idiot was such a story.

I’m seriously pissed that I missed PTI today, because I really wanted to hear what their take on the game was. (If anyone saw it, a recap would be appreciated.) At least I got Mike & Mike’s take on it, as it was the lead story they focused on all day. sigh

As Greeney put it, “it was a loss for the ages.” He claims to have never seen such a bad loss. On thinking about it, I have to agree. Most comebacks are usually a sign of the other team snatching victory, but this was about utter implosion.

4th & 10, top draft choice end has the QB dead to rights for a sack, game over. But no! Wait! Ugh. Both Mikes railed against the pussification of the QB as demonstrated by this play. Golic noted that Kiwanuka immediately turning around was clear and unmistakable evidence that he thought the ball was thrown. Watching the play 1000 times in loving slow-motion, I’m pretty sure that the pump fake is what got him. Just as Kiwanuka was lowering his head to make the hit, Young did a pump fake. But that motion didn’t end until Kiwi’s head was buried in the guy’s chest, so he must have been faked out by the pump fake.

Hard to blame a rule or standard in officiating when you get faked out by a pump fake, y’know? Golic also mentioned that when the ball is thrown, guys on the defense yell “BALL! BALL!” to let everyone know the ball is in the air. I guess Kiwi was so traumatized by being yelled at by Coughlin for roughing the passer penalties (didn’t he get one last week?) that he was gunshy.

Also, it was 4th and friggin’ 10. You CANNOT get a 15 yard personal foul in that spot; hold them on downs and you win the game, period. The real embarassment on that play wasn’t Kiwanuka, it was Will Demps, who pulled a Brian Urlacher and got juked out of his jock well short of the first down line. Can anyone make an open-field tackle anymore?

Anyway, I’m sympathetic to Titans fans, who have to be seriously annoyed at how little press their great comeback win is being given. The story is all about the Giants, none about the Titans. In fairness to them, though, the main reason they won is directly attributable to bonehead mistakes by the Giants.

How the hell did the G-Men go 1-3 against the AFC South? That’s fucking pathetic.

I watched PTI and they didn’t really spend too much time on how historic the loss was. They focused mostly on the Kiwanuka play and largely gave him a pass and instead railed at the NFLs rules. They were a lot tougher on Eli for making that bad pick. But the detail they gave the most time was how Coughlin threw Eli under the bus to the media about it right on the heels of calling out his players for doing the same thing. They essentially gave Coughlin up for dead at the end of the season.

I hear ya, but Martin Gramatica?!?!? This guy was missing PATs last we saw him.

Cool, thanks for the recap.

Mike & Mike also killed Coughlin for throwing Eli under the bus, and then tossed in some jabs at Tiki for good measure. (In a nutshell: You got the carries you whined for now shut the fuck up.)

The NFL is so wacky I wouldn’t be stunned to see the Giants win next week and retake the division. But then again I see that as equally likely as another one of the patented 8-game skids the Giants are famous for. (Two years in a row before last season.)

I wouldn’t mind a complete retooling of the front office; new GM, new scouts, new coaches, and every player having to re-earn their spot. It worked out okay for the Jets.

Okay, at this point I’m pissed off, and am going to vent my frustration in full-on Giants apologist mode. It seems that the entire sports world media has some form of collective amnesia, ignorance, or both.

This morning on Mike & Mike In The Morning, one of their “5 things you need to know” was the stat that the Giants have gone 6-18 in the second half of the season since 2003. Greeney commented that this spans multiple coaching staffs and huge player turnover, so it’s remarkable and inexplicable. No, Greeney, it’s really not.

In 2003, the Giants placed 17 guys on IR, and unsurprisingly were unable to win any of their final eight games. (Six of those eight losses saw Jesse “The Bachelor” Palmer as the starting quarterback.) In 2004, I don’t remember the exact number but recall it reported that the Giants either led the league or were near the top in number of guys on IR, and as a result went an unsurprising 1-7 in the final eight games. (Anyone remember that game when both defensive ends were lost for the season? It was week 9, IIRC.) That’s a collective 1-15. The way the stat was presented this morning implied that 2005 was included in the “second half swoon” stat, despite the respectable 5-3 record in the final half of last season. (Which also involved losing five linebackers: all three starters plus two of the primary backups.)

This year? Let’s see, for last week’s game the defense was missing both starting defensive ends (Strahan & Osi), both starting oustide linebackers (Arrington & Short), and both starting cornerbacks (Madison and Webster). Toss in a primary backup end (Tuck), the starting left tackle (Petitgout), a starting reciever (Toomer), and surprise surprise, the defense fell apart in the fourth quarter. What a stunner that exhausted second stringers fell apart.

I wouldn’t have bothered posting except I made the mistake of tuning in for a few minutes of the hot-stove horse-racing & tennis show known as Mike & The Mad Dog just now. Here’s the stupidity I heard on that show in a single ten minute span:

The Giants have been way overhyped for a team that hasn’t won a playoff game.
Yeah, and San Diego sucks too, right? One loss to the Jets is hardly more impressive than two losses to the 49ers and Panthers, but apparently this overhyped bar only applies to the Giants. For that matter, how many playoff games have the Colts won recently? Peyton Manning took six years to win his first playoff game, but Eli is already a bust in his third.

The Giants were supposed to be so great this season; they were 11-5 last year and brought in guys like LaVar Arrington, Brandon Short and Sam Madison, so they should be even better.
First off, the preseason over-under on the Giants was 8½, so they were hardly a preseason favorite. Second, I notice all those names mentioned are guys that haven’t been on the field in weeks. What an amazing coincidence that the current losing streak just happened to start when those guys (among many, many others) went down, isn’t it?

The Giants defense hasn’t been good in 15 years. They haven’t stepped up in a big game since 1990.
Yeah, pitching a shutout against the high powered offense of the Vikings in the Conference Championship was neither stepping up nor a big spot.

Tom Coughlin stands behind his players, so they should do the same for him.
As I recall, he made a big speech to the team last week about not throwing each other under the bus in the media. The very next game, his first comments in the postgame conference were throwing both Eli and Kiwanuka under the bus. Real standup guy there, eh?

I am so sick of the bullshit. Place the blame where it belongs: coaching and injuries. As Ron Jaworski pointed out, in the game last week the situation was 13 minutes left in the game, up by 21 points, you just ran for 6 yards, now 2nd & 4. So what play did they call? Empty set. Empty set! So the defense blitzes and Eli throws a pick. How much of that is Eli’s fault, (quite a bit,) and how much of that is the coaching staff’s fault? (Even more.) You don’t call a friggin’ empty set in that spot; you’re killing the clock with a huge lead for chrissakes. The only thing an empty set is going to give you is pressure on your QB and a potential hit to his psyche if he throws an unsurprising pick there.

The game before? Tiki Barber got 10 whole carries. Nice gameplan, coach! And why did it take Toomer going down for the season before Shockey got put into the gameplan? WTF?! Are these coaches incompetent or what?

Next year is the final year on Coughlin’s contract. The Giants as an organization never let a coach play out his final year; it’s either extended or terminated before that. So this offseason is decision time on the current staff. I think we can all guess which way I’m leaning.

Some good news for this week’s matchup:

  1. Brandon Short, Osi Umenyiora and Sam Madison will all be back.

  2. The media isn’t giving the Giants a chance, which is a sure sign that they’ll play well. May not be enough to win, but I’d be stunned if they didn’t at least play well.

Great rant and I hope you are right about the Giants playing well this week.

I am really burnt out on Mike & The Mad Dog and at this time of the year I cannot get ESPN radio in the evening. The signal degrades as soon as it gets dark. I still enjoy Mike & Mike in the morning.

Jim