So you’re bound to have heard about Ivanka Trump visiting a beauty salon in Iowa, and the outraged, outrage I tell you! that the salon would serve her. Not only serve, but tweet a photo of her and the governor of Iowa. Apparently this was somehow an offense to LGBTQ people everywhere. The salon owner had this to say:
Another explosion of tweets. People are never buying Sarris candies again, how could they, traitors, yadda yadda. They conveniently overlooked this:
They also forgot, assuming they knew, about the numerousgoodworks Sarris has done. (And in that last link, with a sense of humor as well.) No, they went right to this:
So it seems that these slacktivists, these social justice warriors, think the salon should have refused service to Ivanka, and Sarris should have refused entry to Donald Jr. and Saccone, together or separately. IOW, excluded them. So exclusion is a good thing, when it’s directed towards someone you don’t like or support. And if Sarris really does lose business over this, what’s that going to help?
What I’m about to say will be Dope suicide, if this thread in itself isn’t that already. If I worked in a service industry and Trump came into my place of business, I would serve him with a smile and shake his hand. Same goes for anyone in his family. I honestly don’t see what he’s done that is so horrible. I wouldn’t have shaken hands with George W. Bush, because his had (metaphorical) blood on it. But I don’t see any blood on Trump’s hands. I didn’t vote for him, I don’t love him, I don’t think he’s our best president. But I think people who have this reflexive hatred of him are showing that they have just as poor a character as they claim he has.
It sort of reminds me from the 2012 election where people were outraged that Paul Ryan took photos of himself “working” in a soup kitchen. People perceived he was invited to do so, claiming the soup kitchen was biased. He wasn’t invited. They stormed in last minute, took some campaign photos and left.
The topic as a whole is an interesting and complicated one about which reasonable people can probably disagree. That said, this last sentence is just nonsense.
There’s no universe in which “refusing service to a public figure whose views you disagree with” is even in the same universe of poor character that Trump has too-frequently demonstrated himself to occupy. It’s not grabbing 'em by the pussy. It’s not firing people via tweet. It’s not painting all of his opponents as enemies of the people. It’s not even remotely comparable.
The extreme hatred for Trump is based, in part, on what his election reveals about our nation. That so many were willing to vote for such an incompetent,obnoxious and dangerous semi-literate shakes us to our very core. I hate him not just because of who he is, but for what he has revealed about so many of my fellow countrymen. It’s not “reflexive hatred,” but something much more primal. He’s a constant reminder that we’re no longer an exceptional nation, but about 40% full of deplorables.
I hate that. I hate him.
I can understand a salon willing to accept his daughter. I’m not outraged by that. But anyone who willingly associates professionally or personally with the big man himself is dead to me.
Candyman:
“Norm Candelore, a Sarris manager, added support for the Republicans by saying the new tax bill prompted Sarris recently to hire permanent workers where they would have hired seasonal temps in the past.”
I suppose it’s possible he’s telling the truth, but this sounds like Trump supporting Republican businessman bullshit to me.
I have done work in the homes of several members of the Trump Administration. I provide ongoing service when needed. When Trump was elected, I had some friends that thought I should refuse to service these clients. It was tempting. There aren’t a lot of people who can service the obsolete equipment in these homes. And if it fails completely they don’t have lights ( though most of my service work is for less serious issues ). So it kind of made me feel good to think about the “hold” I had over these assholes.
I thought it would feel really good to turn these people away. In reality, when push came to shove and I got that first call — not so much -in fact, I couldn’t do it. It would’ve looked horrible professionally. It felt like it would be dishonorable and petty and small.
So I just make sure I bill them for every second and I don’t do them any favors. If it’s a minor problem I might make them wait a while for an appointment ( and if they request a specific date and time I’m always booked.) but that’s the extent of my rebellion.
But my point is that it’s one of those things that’s easy to talk talk talk about how you woulda done it and they shoulda done it, but when you are actually in the situation you see it differently. I don’t think my friends would’ve done it either, even though one of them still gives me a hard time.
I got the following e-mail from the President of the United States just today:
"Why are they [Pelosi/Dems] launching a witch hunt?
Because they don’t want to Make America Great Again for YOU.
They don’t want a wall. They don’t want to stop the endless flow of illegal immigrants. They don’t want Americans’ wages to rise. They don’t want to stop nation-building abroad. They don’t want to help hardworking Americans. They don’t want a fair economy that works for ALL Americans.
But I will keep fighting for you. This is what you voted for – and this is what you deserve after so many years of broken promises by lying politicians.
So please, make a contribution of $1 to help FIGHT BACK.
Thank you,
President Trump Signature Headshot
Donald J. Trump
President of the United States of America"
. . . I don’t know what I’d do if I was in a position to grant or refuse him service, but it is clear that he himself is not playing by the “we’re all in this together” social contract. Dems are liars. Give me money to fight them. They don’t like hardworking Americans. Whatever. You can’t go around saying shit like that and also expect to be treated with respect.
Procrustus: Okay, you found out that 40% of registered voters see things differently from you. You know who a lot of those 40% are? Working class, blue collar people who have been getting poorer while the left gets richer. There’s been a shift over the last couple of generations. Used to be, Democrats were struggling and Republicans were wealthy. As the Dems gained power, they gained wealth, and started caring more about their own well-to-do, well-connected friends. Now a lot of people who are struggling are Republicans, and they’re the ones who voted for Trump. Yes, there’s a lot more to it than that. But it wasn’t just the 1% who got Trump elected. A lot of it was the Rust Belt.
Ravenman and manson, don’t be absurd. Boycotting South Africa was a reasonable; it put pressure on the country’s leaders to end a reprehensible nationwide policy. Boycotting individual companies because they were polite to members of the Trump family is just spiteful. Having an abrasive personality != apartheid. Yeah, I know: he’s terrible, he did this, he said that. He has not, so far, sent troops overseas to die for oil.
Exclusion is a good thing when it’s done towards racists, authoritarians, thieves, and bigots. It’s a bad thing when it’s done arbitrarily on the basis of neutral characteristics, such as race, gender, or sexuality. I’m… kind of surprised that this is a thing you needed explained to you?
And I’d stop patronizing your store.
See, the thing is, Trump hates people like me. And he’s actively using the state as a weapon against us. He’s removing federal protections that Obama put into place through executive order. He’s backing legislation that undercuts laws guaranteeing us legal equality. He’s appointing judges with demonstrated histories of anti-gay prejudice. For fuck’s sake, he made Mike Pence Vice President! Trump hates gay people. Or at the very least, he’s willing to throw us under the bus to curry favor with people who do, which is effectively the same thing.
The fact that you’re willing to smile and shake hands with that? Yeah, you can go right to hell. My rights as an American citizen, my dignity as a human being, aren’t a “agree to disagree” kind of thing. And there’s a lot of people from at least two other protected classes who feel the same way.
Well, it’s great that you draw the line at actual murder. Not great that you’re so sanguine about racism, homophobia, and religious bigotry, though.
When did I say I would refuse service to him or those in his family?
Like I said, it’s a complicated topic. If someone says “he has demonstrated so much vile hatred for me and the people I love that I could not in good conscience interact with him”, I’m not going to tell that person they’re wrong. If someone else, even someone who hates him as much as I do, says “I despise everything he stands for, but I feel that by refusing him service I would just be letting him win, letting the hatred win, contributing to the divisions in this country”, I’m not going to tell that person they’re wrong either.
But why in the world is how you feel about something relevant to whether something is the right thing to do or not? Very often the right thing to do is hard and difficult and you don’t want to do it. And very often the wrong thing to do is what feels better and is easier.
If you have a moral argument for why this is okay, fine. The main one is that it would suck if people started doing the same thing to you and your beliefs. There’s an argument that services should be open to all, even the most heinous. There’ are also Christian ideas of loving your enemies and paying back evil with kindness and compassion*.
But merely feeling bad to do otherwise? That seems a lousy reason. If I just went by how I felt, I’d have done a lot of things I know are wrong, and not done a lot of things I know I needed to do. I’m not saying I never let my feelings call the shots, but I try not to when it comes to morality.
*As a Christian myself, I do feel the need to clarify that the Bible also draws lines, and never actually says you must serve everyone equally. And there are rules to Biblical hospitality. The above is a Christian argument, not “the” Christian argument.
I’m sorry, but this just isn’t true. You can actually look it up. Trump lost people making less than $50,000 per year by 12 points. In fairness, he made massive gains in that group over Romney in 2012, but this election was not “The poor turned up in favor of Trump”. I’d question this entire narrative if I were you.
