Squealing? Are we at Disneyland, the beach, the play pit at McD’s, etc- then yes, it’s music to my ears (well, as long as I can move away or something to modulate the volume)… Are we on a airplane or in a restaurant with tablecloths and wait service? Then no, it’s incredibly irritating and puts my teeth on edge.
How do you stop your precious from squealing in delight at a upscale restaurant? By not bringing them there until they are old enough to not do it.
Don’t shake the baby, ever, under any circumstances.
I’m just kidding. Shake him all you want. It’s your baby!
So there are really people who haven’t spent enough time around black people to know what “ashy” means? I had a black teammate explain it to me in middle school when I asked him why he lotioned himself up after practice every day.
I suspect white people are perpetually ashy, but we just don’t have enough contrast for it to show.
Cat Whisperer:
Excuse me? Reproduction is a biological imperative of every living organism that has ever existed, and the people who go with it rather than fight it to are a “Cult”?
Heh, so “cult” is a bit much, but parents often pester people who don’t want children despite how clearly, forcefully or repeatedly we state we don’t want any. It’s progressed from “Oh, you’ll want them when you get older” to “You’ll want them when you get married” to “Oh, well stay married a little longer” to “Hey, daylight’s running out on your good babymaking years.” Soon it’ll be “You can still adopt!” Motherfuckers, no means no. I get that most folk want children, and that whole wanting of children thing has kept us from going extinct (that and lack of contraception), but for the love of Dog, if someone doesn’t want a child, shut the holy hell up about it!
Not accusing you or anyone here of doing this, but hot damn, do non-parents have to sit through this barrage with alarming frequency.
I’m not CatWhisperer and she can speak for herself, but it does get pretty tiresome having to deal with the mommy brigade who refuses to acknowledge your life’s choices. I complain on message boards about screaming kids on airplanes as much as the next person, but I’ve never grilled anyone about their decision to have children. Not what I would have done, but god for them. Yet for some reason entirely too many parents respond to “I don’t want kids” with shock, horror and bargaining (as if they’re going to talk a grown ass woman out of something she’s been certain of her entire life) rather than “Okay.”
This. Times 10,000.
I’m a 35 year old woman. The kind of age everyone keeps going on about how I should or will be wanting children. I don’t. Fuck the biological imperative.
That’d be me on two counts, not being around many black people, and prolly covered in flaky dry skin and not knowing it.
I wish I had occasion to be around more black people. I don’t know how to remedy that situation. According to the 2010 census, the city where I live is 46% Hispanic, 7% black, and the balance is other racial/ethnic backgrounds including non-Hispanic whites (or Anglos).
First time I’ve heard of the phenomenon, and the term.
As proof, I offer my own appendages. I am as white as the new-driven snow, and my skin is quite dry, and yep - often ashy. I don’t know if other people could tell much, but I can sure see it, especially along my forearms and shins.
I love seeing the benefits of school desegregation. 
I suspect so too.
It stings when people (esp. women) act as if liking babies and kids is a requirement for being a real woman. No one assumes guys want to hear about the travails of potty-training, but because I’m a woman, I’m naturally supposed to be into this kind of thing (in addition to weddings, cosmetics, and shoes).
Lately I’ve been getting the “Don’t you want to have children?!” questions at work, because now I’m the only person on my floor who doesn’t have kids or isn’t trying to have them. It’s awkward knowing that everyone thinks you’re “doing it wrong”, even if you know you’re just living life on your own terms.
That’s how I read it as well. That said, as a middle-aged guy I’ve come to realize most people my age are still children only with better jobs, more responsibilities, and slower metabolisms–we still have no clue what life is about or how to shape children into citizens. I’m totally open to weighing insights from people younger than me because I’ve got at least 7 more years to go with this parenting gig and I’m increasingly less aware of what the kids are going through with their peers.
Kids make you tired and surly. Pay it no mind, a parent is only as sane as their nuttiest kid.
Blow them off, that’s just a case of misery loves company. Parenting is hard and it’s ceaseless, and no one should take it on unless 100% certain. Ask them what they would do if the child free weren’t there to fill in when their kids are sick, remind them who picks up the slack at work and maybe they’ll cut it out.
Tell bitches who keep pestering you about kids that you know this lady on a message board who has 3 kids, so I took up your quota. Sorry, nothing you can do about it.
As for non-parents offering parenting advice: Eh, whatever. Yes, it’s pretty much stuff I already know, but if it makes people feel better to offer advice, then they should go right ahead. It’s no skin off my back. One thing I’ve learned as a parent is that you can’t let stupid bullshit get under your skin or you’ll be perpetually angry, because the world in general and parenting specifically are full of a lot of stupid bullshit.
You think your kid is awesome and your smart phone is awesome. Only one of them is going to attempt to grow up to be a productive member of society. Choose which to pay attention to and which to neglect carefully. Me, I’d pick the one that’s not going to shame me by climbing into a claw machine while I’m absorbed with the other.
More than once, I told people who asked me why I didn’t want to have children, “What for? So I can be as miserable as you?”
My apologies; I thought it was understood that my opinions in this thread were just that, my opinions.
There are multiple aspects to the Cult of the Child attitude; one is marketing to parents which is the easiest sell ever - everything everywhere is geared to families/children/parents. We are bombarded daily with ads, articles, movies, tv shows, marketing campaigns, special deals, everything aimed at parents and children. “Family friendly” and “Child friendly” are a very common marketing strategy.
A second aspect is called symbolic annihilation. Childless and childfree people are almost completely absent from media - tv, movies, magazines, articles, etc. When childless and childfree people aren’t completely absent, they’re trivialized - for example, a woman thinks she doesn’t want kids, but is “fixed” by finally meeting the right guy and changes her mind. Choosing not to have children is not a valid life choice in this trivialized version of womanhood. People who don’t have kids are actually a fairly large group to be almost completely ignored by the media - roughly 20% of Americans aged 40-44 don’t have kids.
A third aspect of it is the lack of freedom to be your true self when you aren’t doing what the common biological imperative prompts other people to do. This takes on multiple forms - one is as discussed here, the pressure from outsiders to attempt to pressure you about a very personal decision that is truly none of their business. Another form it takes is not feeling free to talk about your lack of having reproduced, and not feeling free to talk about how you really feel about children and parents.
Maybe “Cult of the Child” is too strong a term; maybe we could call it, “People Who Think Reproducing Is The Only Valid Choice” (PWTRITOVC for short).
It’s *always *women. I’ve had men be surprised, or when dating in the past, have at times seen the light turn red in his eyes when it comes out that children ain’t happenin’, but I’ve never gotten the “Shit out babies or turn in your uterus” bit from a man. I suppose there are Tucker Carlson types who think women who don’t want children are too busy going to the gym, or whatever his idiotic criticism was, but thankfully those people are trapped in talk radio and I’ve never encountered one in the wild. Now to be fair, it’s not like I can’t go outside without being hounded into reproducing; for one, it’s not like I introduce myself with “Hey, I’m MOL and I don’t want babies,” and for another, when it does come up a lot of folks are decent about it, but a disturbing many feel the need to badger me about my choices, and those who do have always, *always *been women.
Only Valid Alternative, or OVA? Hmm, we’ll work on that acronym. I’ll put it on the agenda for next week’s meeting.
I appreciate the summery of the reason for this thread. This is what I wanted to know when I posted “I am unsure as to why we are asking folks with NO experience about child rearing.” Thanks for addressing this.
You were once a child and as such interacted with other children (I hope). You at least know what you think of your childhood. Thus, you are qualified to comment on that!
I for one am NOT the least bit offended nor do I feel insulted at anything posted thus far on this thread. As far as showing respect, I hope that my respect for you-all is coming across strongly. I lurked for a long time before posting, partly to see if this was a group that I could relate to and that I could learn from. I hope that I have things that I can share that helps others on this site. I am unsure what I posted you took as “threadshitting”. I am sorry that it offended you.
My aunt Margaret (aged 94) is one of those that chose to be childless. We have had some discussions about how society as a whole does not understand, nor respect her choice to not have children. I can see what she (and perhaps, you) experience as an outsider in a child-centric society.
This is a great thread. There are many points that I agree fully with. There are some I do not understand. These give me something to ponder on. I will gain insight from them.
Thanks all, 48.
They never interfered or offered opinions one way or the other. My parenting style is a lot like theirs was: leave the kids with enough room to make their own mistakes and learn from them.