I don’t like anyone who throws a fit when they don’t always get their way, requires me to babysit/micromanage them in order for them to keep their promises or get their tasks done, or otherwise can’t/won’t behave appropriately in mixed company.
A lot of the time these people are under the age of 15. And a lot of the time these people are 25, 35, 55, or older.
What I dislike about children isn’t exclusive to children, even though it’s pretty universal among children. I don’t discriminate by age, I am irritated by bad choices and behavior that negatively affect my life. I just severed ties with a “child” who was 25 years old. His age was less a factor than the fact that he was an idiot whose slacking off and blame shifting and incompetence has pretty much derailed a major project I’ve been working on for more than six months.
You may be surprised to know that I agree with you for the most part. But what you and I both object to has nothing to do with the children themselves. They are only the symptoms of the problem. The cause is bad parenting.
I thought of another effect today (sorry I haven’t read the whole thread so someone may have mentioned this already).
I’m 61, but I don’t feel that old most of the time. But I was thinking how much older it would make me feel to have grown children pushing 40 and starting to get gray hairs. I think that would be worse in that regard than having grandchildren.
I’m not sure if this is a benefit or a detriment to my personality and character. For one thing, there isn’t much personal point in making sure I have an estate to leave behind me (as my parents did, thank you again, folks) because I have no-one personally meaningful to leave it to except my partner, who probably won’t outlive me by much if at all. So I just have to try to make sure I slide into the grave on my last nickel.
Roddy
Agreed, and bad parents annoy me way more than children do.
But regardless, I don’t love kids. I don’t enjoy them for the same reason I don’t enjoy old people or stupid people. They tend, through no fault of their own, to be a pain in the ass.
Uh, don’t most people do a cost/benefit for every relationship they engage in? I know I do. In my experience just assuming that everything’s going to work out somehow just doesn’t… work out at all.
No idea what you’re trying to imply here. Are you saying that children don’t throw fits when they don’t get their way? Or that no adults do? Or that for some reason I have “no right” to get annoyed at someone else’s bad behavior when it negatively affects me?
I don’t like children. As a whole. Like I said, I do love individual children.
I don’t like people. As a whole. but I do love individual people.
So there. Not liking children is not villifying them. And besides, why do you even care if I don’t like them? I swear I have never kicked anyone off a Big Wheel.
As for childfree, I always protest at the negative connotations of the word. I am childfree. This is not to make some dramatic point about my freedom from the little ogres. It is to signify that I have voluntarily made a choice not to have them, as opposed to people who desperately want children but can’t have them - childless. Their lives are diminished by what they can’t have, and I feel for them. My life is not diminished to me at all. YM does and will vary of course.
And actually, I think it’s far, far worse when people don’t do a cost/benefit analysis before having children. If you’re going to be fully responsible for someone during their formative years, you damn well better be sure you’re up to the task. A parent has a choice about having a kid. A kid has no choice about having a parent. If an honest analysis determines that you’d make a lousy parent, don’t go having kids and screwing them up. THAT makes me angry. No kid deserves to get screwed over like that.
So you didn’t do a cost-benefit analysis to have children? Emotionally, financially, psychologically? You just had kids, cause, what, it was the “next” thing to do? Well, I happen to think that is not the wisest idea in the world.
Or did you think about it? Did you go “Well, now is a good time to have kids.” Or did you maybe get pregnant and go “well it’ll be tough but this is how we can handle it. We’ll have to budget…but I really want children so it’ll be worth it.”
See what I mean? Everything in life is a cost benefit analysis.
Some people do simply use children as a ploy. Not just to get stuff, but to get attention, love, status, whatever. Lots of people don’t…but that doesn’t negate the other part of it.
It’s amazing to me how many people go from “I don’t like children” to “I hate and despise children.” That to me, speaks of the hangups of the hearer (if you don’t like what I like, you must HATE it and be EVIL and unable to function in SOCIETY).
The phrase “I don’t like children,” means… I don’t like them. Not-like can encompass dislike, as well as indifference, and ambivalence.
Babies are something I am indifferent to. I don’t care about your baby, or my bosses baby, I don’t care about your breastfeeding (or not-breastfeeding) plans, your birth plan, your in-home water birth, what your midwife thinks of your cervical mucus, or anything else. I just don’t care. I only care about my friends’ babies, because they came out of my friends. Otherwise, I wouldn’t care at all. No, I do not think your baby is cute – but I am not so gauche as to say so. Please do not pressure me to hold your baby – I promise you I do not wish to. I just don’t feel anything different, about looking at a newborn baby, than when I look at someone’s… I don’t know, new pet chicken? They are objects of brief interest but no fascination.
So when I say “I don’t like babies,” you can feel free to read that as "babies are one of many things I do not care about. Please do not continue to bore me with this topic we do not share an interest in. I will do my part by politely mouthing the platitudes you wish to hear. Please meet me halfway by shutting up about it every now and then. "
And quite a lot of people do not like, or are indifferent to, the elderly. In fact, by far most people are.
I like children, personally. Once they ae old enough to stand upright you can have amusing conversations with them, much akin to those you have with your very stoned friends.
I quite fail to see where I said that if you don’t like children, you must hate and despise them.
What I said, was that disliking children is a personal choice, that there is nothing wrong with it, but that it is limiting and must make social interactions difficult.
Actually, it’s children that make social interaction difficult, as anyone who’s ever tried to have a conversation in the presence of a child but not actually with the child can attest.
Because children are an integral part of our society, and raising them, taking care of them, educating them and entertaining them are significant concerns in our society, and shared by the majority of its members.
These things are unlikely to change, and those who dislike children will find themselves, inevitably, confronted by that which they dislike repeatedly.
I don’t see much here I disagree with except your assertion that I care whether or not you like children. I don’t - unless you actually do kick kids of a Big Wheel. I’m just trying to digest what’s being posted. As matter of fact, I tend to think that the posters who choose not to have children made the right choice for them. However, I strongly disagree with them promoting their reasons for that choice on to everyone else.
That depends on your perspective. If you dislike children and view them as an imposition on an otherwise-childfree normalicy, I suppose that can be true; however, that is a minority position, and for good reason.
Because if you are visiting with a parent, there is the ever-present possibility that the parent will start talking about his/her kids, which you have no interest in, leaving you in the uncomfortable position of either listening politely and feigning interest, which just encourages them to continue, trying to change the subject, which sometimes works, but not always, or telling the parent you have no interest in talking about that subject and causing a bitter dispute full of anger and resentment. Social interactions with people who do not share your interests and who have one overriding interest that trumps all other interests I find are inherently difficult or entirely impossible, which is why I tend not to associate with people who do not share my interests and why I rarely look forward to family get-togethers where the topics include a) what my nieces’ and nephews’ latest activities are, b) what my nieces and nephews are going to be doing in the near future, or c) what have I been… Logan – put that down! It is not a toy! Excuse me for 15 minutes while I go tend to my kid.
More or less (though I would dispute that all parents want to talk about is kids, and this trumps all other topics - depending on the setting, I could go years without discussing mine with certain people).
Having some dislike that alienates you from your entire family or from even the possibility of associating with a majority of the population would be, I would think, a crippling social problem.