Obi-Wan: Hero of the Galactic Empire. (spoilers, TV-permissible words)

Cafe Society
1

The Galactic Empire is only as powerful as it is because of Obi-Wan Kenobi.

[spoiler]You’re Obi-Wan. You’re locked in battle with your best friend, your brother, your pupil, someone closer to you than family. He’s just choked the hell out of his wife- his PREGNANT wife, and, earlier in the day, he slaughtered a whole bunch of CHILDREN, not to mention the head of your religious order. Your ex-pal has established himself as one pretty bad dude. He’s admitted to being a member of an organization whose existence you’re sworn to frickin’ DESTROY. So what do you do? You fight him. I’m with you so far.

So you’re fighting, and he’s ranting, and he’s pretty much reaffirming the whole evilness thing he established, oh, by choking his frickin’ pregnant wife right in front of you. So you fight him to the point where you’ve got the high ground, he can’t win, and you, in all your Jedi sportsmanship, give him the chance to surrender. Mighty big of ya. He, of course, does not. You know what he’s gonna do, you warn him not to, he does it anyway…

and you cut off his LEGS and leave him in a heap next to a river of LAVA. He then catches on frickin’ FIRE, and still he screams his hatred for you. So what do you do? You speechify and then walk away.

Whiskey. Tango. Foxtrot.

He’s a frickin’ Sith! He’s wicked powerful! Plus, he was your best friend YESTERDAY! If anybody deserves a quick death, it’s him. And what do you do, Jedi jerk? Leave your pal there to burn horribly to death. Or, turn your back on your greatest enemy, without finally defeating him.[/spoiler]

It’s either a jerk move or poor strategy.

Vader went nuts on the galaxy for the next tweny-odd years, choking people, quashing rebellion, and just being a telekinetic jackass on a respirator. And you could have stopped it either by being a good friend or by being pragmatic and finishing what you started.

But you did neither. Nice work… jerk.

2

I think Obi-Wan realized this, and lived the life of a hermit in the desert of Tattooine out of an overwhelming sense of guilt that he could have stopped him or done more to help.

3

You’re absolutely right, H. S. H. Pup. And what’s worse, is what he does next: Nothing. He’s got the child and could train him to be a serious bad-ass super-jedi, but what does he do? Hands off the kid to a couple of Tatooine rednecks and proceeds to hide for the next twenty years, without interacting with Luke at all.

Sherlock Holmes, he ain’t.

4

Yes, but then Vader goes on to kill the Emperor and bring and permanent end to the Sith line, thereby restoring the Republic and the Jedi to power. Prophecy fullfilled. QED

5

As much as I agree with you, H. S. H. Pup, I do have to cut Obi-Wan a little slack. Remember his speech to Yoda about how he couldn’t kill Anakin? I think he meant that - under no circumstances could he bring himself to kill this boy in whom he had invested so much time and emotion, no matter what he had done. Yes, he should have provided a merciful ending to Anakin’s suffering, but (a) that would have necessitated walking down a rocky ridge to the edge of a lava flow to reach someone trying to kill him, with a very real danger of falling or being pulled into a river of molten rock, or being hit by spraying lava, and (b) there’s every reason to believe Anakin’s going to expire any second.

Personally, I’d think prefer the nightmares of killing my best friend to the nightmares of imagining his moments of being burnt alive, but I can understand why others wouldn’t.

It’s been many, many years since I’ve seen the original movie, but I seem to recall it was Luke’s aunt and uncle who worked hard to prevent contact between them. As they were his family, I can see him respecting their wishes to a point, at least until such time as he saw no other choice. He was wracked with guilt after “failing” Anakin, and in no hurry to take on another kid. There would also have been every reason to hope that Leia would prove to be the next hotshot Jedi.

6

No, he didn’t. He went to watch over Luke. Which he did by not going anywhere near him or teaching him a damn thing. Anakin was nine years old and “too old” to begin Jedi Training. So how do we rectify our mistake with Luke? By doubling it, of course. Ponder has the right of it here.

Sure, but Obi-Wan didn’t know this at the time. He thought Yoda had misread the prophecy and Anakin had doomed them all. Based on the information he had, still a dick.

7

Besides, Old Ben has Qui-Gon to keep him company. I suppose I can fan wank that Qui-Gon is keeping Old Ben aprised of when it will be time to come out of the woodwork. So, when the super-special edition directors cut of Episode VI comes out, is Lucas going to digitally insert old Qui-Gon into the final scene?

8

Now that we have Qui-Gon directing things from beyond the grave, who can say who knows what when now?

The Qui-Gon bullshit is right up there with the fuckin’ midichlorians on the craptastic scale if you ask me.

9

No, because Luke never knew Qui Gon.

10

this is the results of having fate pre-determined by ‘someone up there’ coughgeorgecough. there is nothing obiwan can do to change history, short of divine intervention. coughhan shot firstcough

11

Don’t forget, it is against the Jedi code to kill a vanquished/unarmed opponent. (see Count Dooku scene in Act I) Not that a small exception to this rule might have made for a better 20 years for the trillions of folks in the galaxy…but Obi-Wan doesn’t even want to get his toes wet in the waters of the Dark Side.

12

Oh, but it’s fine to let him burn to death? Obi-wan wasn’t going to bring him anywhere to stand trial, like Anakin was agonizing over whether to do with Dooku. Obi-Wan left him there to die, which is more of a dick move than decapitating Dooku.

And besides, Anakin was Obi-Wan’s closest friend. I know that if I were in Anakin’s position, I’d want it over quick.

13

Heh, but it wouldn’t just be Qui Gon, would it? It’ll have to be fairly huge class photo style shot that includes Kit, Aayla, et. al.

14

So would I. However, if one thinks of the Jedi as a religious order as well as a military one, it’s not that far-fetched to consider that they’d prefer Anakin to die a “natural” death as a result of his wounds than for a member of the Jedi order to actively bring about his death when he no longer poses a meaningful threat.

(Hopefully I have phrased the forgoing paragraph in such a way as to adhere to the moderator’s orders with regard to keeping real world politics out of Star Wars discussions. If I violated the edict, I’m sorry - I tried.)

15

Anakin was on fire. I don’t think Obi Wan had any reason to suspect that he would survive.

Of course he should have bled to death out of his three severed limbs…

16

I believe the thought is that the lightsaber cauterizes. There was little blood in the several amputations depicted.

17

WHy does everyone presume everything would be hunky-dory if he killed Vader? The Emperor is still alive and there are only two Jedi left (not inlcuding Luke).

18

Exactly. Palpatine would have found another apprentice.

Count me as one of those who thinks that walking down a rocky slope towards a river of lava to dispatch a guy who wants you dead is not a smart idea.

Also, Anakin is a child-killer. Why should Obi-wan break the Jedi code to give him a quick death?

19

If he had tried to train Luke, the Disturbances in the Force ™ would have attracted the attention of the Emperor and Vader. Obi Wan and Yoda weren’t just sitting in the desert and swamp commiserating with holo Qui Gon. They were using the Force to cloud the Emperor’s vision and protect the twins, just like the Emperor had used the Force to cloud the Jedi council’s vision during while his plans came to fruition.

20

The surviving Jedi had better find something more interesting to do than meditate over the twins’ secrecy if Lucas plans to churn out 48 hours or more of live action Star Wars television.