I was thinking that, too. Are we really supposed to think someone of Hillary’s stature can’t get someone do her tax returns so that she can expedite the process of full disclosure?
Aside from flubbing the “reject” part, actually, I thought he did okay, and he never said anything that silly. He did a good job of saying he had championed good relations between the African-American and Jewish communities, and the ‘I would not be standing here if not for the efforts of the Jewish community during the civil rights movement’ was a particularly good idea.
And he did a pretty good job of defusing her attempt to stress the word “reject.”
There’s a Blazing Saddles joke here somewhere. 
"Is it twue what they say about your… polls?
“Oh, it’s twue, it’s twue!”
It’s funny that you say that, since he specifically used the word denounce in his first answer. It was only after Hillary “called him on it” that he agreed to reject it, too. Not vice versa. Since you weren’t able to keep the two words straight either, would you perhaps now agree with Obama’s claim that there’s really no meaningful difference between denouncing someone and rejecting them?
I was disappointed that neither of them condemned Farrakhan.
Perhaps you saw that I got the words straight in my post from earlier this morning. I crossed them up because I was trying to get to bed, and wrote hastily.
Strictly speaking - while I think this issue is irrelevant - there IS a difference between denouncing a person and rejecting their support. If there was no difference, Obama could have just said “I reject his support” and not given her an opening. But I think he was aware of that difference and he appeared to avoid the word reject for precisely that reason. (“Denounce” is “I don’t approve of what he says,” “Reject” is “I don’t want him to support me,” and implies he doesn’t want the support of Farrakhan’s followers either.) He did a clumsy job of that and she was right to pounce on that. He had an easy out and didn’t take it. He did do well to minimize the difference, since the Clintons are often rightly accused of nitpicking and shading their words.
On the other hand, her claim that she was putting herself at risk by alienating anti-Semites in New York is absurd. I don’t know how many committed Jew-hating Independence party voters there are in New York, but if they outnumber the Jewish voters, I’ll find a Lubavitscher and eat his hat. 
Nice handle, by the way.
Or repudiated him either.
Or abjure him.
But Farrakhan didn’t offer any support. He just said he liked Obama. He didn’t actually offer anything to him which could be accepted or rejected.
Whoa whoa whoa! Let’s not take this too far. Condemn, denounce, reject, repudiate…fine, but abjure! In America!?
Well I, personally, think he should have looked straight into the camera and said, “FUCK YOU, Farrakhan!” Anything less was simply not strong enough. I mean, really. Reject? Denounce? Those are pansy-ass words.
I dont often post.... ever, since I'm relatively new, but I especially havent posted in debates. So in the interest of making a good impression, I did try to read through the thread to make sure I wasnt just nitpicking. Apparently I missed your post earlier this morning where they were straight. Nitpicking certainly isnt what I meant to do though. I think it’s telling that it’s possible to switch and replace which of the two words Obama really didnt want to use. If there were a meaningful difference between them, they wouldnt be easily confused in haste.
Sure there’s a difference between rejecting someone’s support and denouncing their views, but Farrakhan didnt offer any real support to reject. I wouldnt argue there’s NO difference. From my perspective, it seemed that Obama made a clear statement of opposition to Farrakhan’s views, and Hillary’s response came off as nitpicking. The difference between reject and denounce just seemed irrelevant to the situation.
Thanks!
So nothing short of rabid political puffery is the only thing you will accept? That’s why most politicians behave as though they are on the Real World I suppose.
Whoooooooooooosh.
A Boeing 747 just passed five feet over your head.
…/
…|
…|
…|
…|
…|
…Really?
I mean,
Really?
-FrL-
Obama made the same point, and it’s valid, but I think public praise counts as support - certainly on the Dope, we see endorsements as a form of support. (One that is worthless without further activity, such as active advocacy.)
For the record, I think asking somebody to reject, denounce, or discombobulate their own supporters is a waste of time unless there is actually reason to believe the candidate and the supporter share the same view. Since there is no reason to believe Obama shares Farrakhan’s anti-Semitism, the question itself was pointless. It’s like telling the candidate “I will deliberately choose to believe the worst about you unless you utter some platitudes.”
That said, I’m looking at the transcript again. Russert didn’t ask Obama to reject Farrakhan’s support right away. He asked “Do you accept the support of Louis Farrakhan,” and Obama gave a good answer about how he never sought that support and has long been clear about not sharing Farrakhan’s views. The problem was that he failed to say “No,” just as he failed to say “Yes” when asked later if he rejected that support.
I’ll give Clinton a little less credit here because the question wasn’t about rejecting support in the first place. And Obama did not avoid the word “reject” as overtly as I felt he did last night, and I think his response was more adequate.
Incidentally, I am still less than convinced that Clinton was telling the truth about rejecting Independence Party support. I doubt that they were interested in supporting her in the first place, but it sounds like she supported an effort within that party to get rid of one party leader (a woman who has been criticized for anti-Semitic comments), so she could accept the support of the people who were left.
So, mswas, given Shayna’s other posts on Obama, do you really think she
What? Already covered?
Why, no – no, I hadn’t noticed. People really ought to be more explicit about such things.
Really? I needed a winking smilie in that post? I thought for sure it was so over-the-top that it couldn’t possibly be mistaken for a serious sentiment.
Live and learn.