[QUOTE=gravitycrash]
For Fucks sake. Can Europe maybe just step up for once? Look at a damn map. Blaming Bush for this is almost childish.
[/QUOTE]
Almost?
We’re not responsible for stopping every bad thing in the world. In fact, the idea that we are is what got us into Iraq. This reminds me of when some folks were blaming the US for not having a tsunami warning system in the India ocean back when the big one hit Indonesia.
This is going to backfire on Russia. If you border on Russia, you’re going to want more than ever to be part of NATO.
[QUOTE=Siam Sam]
And although it could arguably be an overreaction on Russia’s part, wasn’t Georgia’s fresh offensive on South Ossetian rebels what sparked the Russian action? If Georgia had not attacked in South Ossetia, Russia would not have invaded. It doesn’t seem like the timing of Bush’s trip to Beijing was in Russia’s calculations.
[/QUOTE]
Georgia definitely started firing major artillery at South Ossetia, and that was definitely an overreaction. However, the official Georgian line is that the Georgian villages of Tamarasheni and Prisi started getting shelled a few hours after there was an agreement for talks the next day, and the artillery was just return fire. Now, I am assuming nobody will believe Georgia that “the other guys started it”.
Regardless, this thing would be trivial to organize for Russia, within their line of thinking, and aligns itself with general behavior of my fellow Russian school bullies “He kept hitting himself so I had to take his wallet to stop him”
[QUOTE=Spartydog]
Does anybody with a functioning brain think that it is coincidence that Russia invaded Georgia while Dub was on his much publicized trip to Beijing?
Russia makes their statement that they intend to make the USA the number 3 superpower while our lame duck “Idiot in Chief” is looking at volleyball asses.
We’re locked down in Iraq while the real powers that want to bring us down are exploiting the idiocy of the Bush administration, thumbing their nose at us and telling us to bend over. Georgia was the hope for Western style government in the area and now the crooks in Moscow are rubbing our nose in shit because we can’t challenge them.
So Dub returns to Washington and makes a meaningless speech. The only thing he’s really pissed off about is that he couldn’t go directly to Crawford, TX and go to sleep for the month of August like he has in the past.
[/QUOTE]
To answer the OP - Yes, those of us with a functioning brain think it is a coincidence.
Like other posters have mentioned : Georgia started hostilities because their president is a megalomaniac who thought he could get away with it during the Olympics.
Georgian soldiers have thrown grenades inside buildings where citizens were hiding.
I can’t blame Russia for their reaction.
If they let this go every little bit of Russia will start fighting for independence.
[QUOTE=Telemark]
I think it was much more likely to coincide with the opening ceremonies of the Olympics, regardless of whether Bush was there or not. Do you think Bush being in China would have changed the US response?
[/QUOTE]
Wrong way round. Georgia launched a massive shelling of towns and villages to coincide with the Olympics. It was Georgia who thought they could get away with a quick strike but they played into Russian hands, who were just waiting for an excuse.
Never start a fight you can’t finish and there was never a chance they could finish this.
[QUOTE=Siam Sam]
And although it could arguably be an overreaction on Russia’s part, wasn’t Georgia’s fresh offensive on South Ossetian rebels what sparked the Russian action? If Georgia had not attacked in South Ossetia, Russia would not have invaded. It doesn’t seem like the timing of Bush’s trip to Beijing was in Russia’s calculations.
[/QUOTE]
If anything, Putin’s trip might have been in Georgia’s calculations. Not that that matters much in the grand scheme of things.
[QUOTE=John Mace]
This is going to backfire on Russia. If you border on Russia, you’re going to want more than ever to be part of NATO.
[/QUOTE]
If Georgia had been part of NATO when this shit went down we’d be looking at either (a) World War III, when NATO honoured its treaty obligations, or, far more likely, (b) the end of NATO as a believable political force when it didn’t. Yeah, if you border on Russia, you’re going to want more than ever to be part of NATO…but you’re not going to get in, because NATO isn’t going to write any checks that it can’t cash, not for each and every little breakaway Soviet Republic in Asia. Russia knows this perfectly well.
[QUOTE=Scoundrel Swanswater]
I can’t blame Russia for their reaction.
If they let this go every little bit of Russia will start fighting for independence.
[/QUOTE]
Why does Russia have an entitlement to rule regions that don’t want to be part of it?
[QUOTE=Princhester]
Why does Russia have an entitlement to rule regions that don’t want to be part of it?
[/QUOTE]
The same entitlement that allows the USA to act like it does. Because the reality is - it can and no-one is going to start WW3 to stop either party doing what the fuck it likes when it believes its fundamental interests are at stake.
[QUOTE=ivan astikov]
I didn’t think it possible, but I like him even less now.
[/QUOTE]
What an odd reaction. I was just mentioning last night that his behavior at the Olympics reminded me just how likeable he can be when he’s not being “THE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES”. I tend to forget that since he’s such a dick most of the time.
While I personally would’t give a hoot (I think), it’s clear that a lot of the athletes are really excited to have the President around watching their games and I think he’s been a pretty good sports fan (even when we don’t win).
[QUOTE=Scoundrel Swanswater]
Do you think the US government would allow Texas to declare itself independend?
I seriously doubt it.
[/QUOTE]
It was a little different. Had the US annexed Texas in a naked display of power as a cruel totalitarian dictatorship which spread horrific memories and corrupted and polluted the land, twisting all its dominion into a nightmarish realm of fear and oppression, then I couldn’t blame them.
[QUOTE=tagos]
Wrong way round. Georgia launched a massive shelling of towns and villages to coincide with the Olympics. It was Georgia who thought they could get away with a quick strike but they played into Russian hands, who were just waiting for an excuse.
[/QUOTE]
Sorry for not being clear; that’s what I meant. It wasn’t Russians counting on the Olympics to distract the world, it was the Georgians.
[QUOTE=tagos]
Wrong way round. Georgia launched a massive shelling of towns and villages to coincide with the Olympics. It was Georgia who thought they could get away with a quick strike but they played into Russian hands, who were just waiting for an excuse.
Never start a fight you can’t finish and there was never a chance they could finish this.
[/QUOTE]
This is it exactly. Russia, even post-cold war Russia, is not a force to be trifled with. There was only one way for this to end, the way it did.
[QUOTE=smiling bandit]
It was a little different. Had the US annexed Texas in a naked display of power as a cruel totalitarian dictatorship which spread horrific memories and corrupted and polluted the land, twisting all its dominion into a nightmarish realm of fear and oppression, then I couldn’t blame them.
[/QUOTE]
It might be different how it got annexed, but the result is the same : Texas is part of the States and is generating income (I don’t know if that is actually true, how much oil is left in Texas?).
Of course Russia is going to do their damnedest best to keep all remaining parts of it in check, otherwise there won’t be a Russia in a few years.
I am not saying this is a good thing, it is just very understandable.
[QUOTE=Scoundrel Swanswater]
Do you think the US government would allow Texas to declare itself independend?
I seriously doubt it.
[/QUOTE]
Oh, PLEASE, PLEASE let that happen. Pretty please? With sugar on top? Could we get rid of a few more states while we’re at it? I’m not overly fond of North Dakota–surely Canada would want it…
No comment on “the international situation” but I agree with Jon Stewart re Bush’s back slap on Misty May: surely the wisest move of his Presidency.
Jon’s right. Bush shouldn’t be our President; he should be our mascot. He makes a good cheerleader–he’s had practice.
[QUOTE=smiling bandit]
It was a little different. Had the US annexed Texas in a naked display of power as a cruel totalitarian dictatorship which spread horrific memories and corrupted and polluted the land, twisting all its dominion into a nightmarish realm of fear and oppression, then I couldn’t blame them.
[/QUOTE]
Or if Texas had remained Mexican and its largely white ethnic American population declared itself independent in 1992, was de facto independent for 16 years, and if Mexico and the US had a peace agreement that put US ‘peace-keepers’ in place and then Mexico started shelling them (even after years of the US shooting down their drones and encouraging/arming separatists) how do we think the USA would act?
I doubt they’d stop until they reached Mexico’s southern border. Georgia has got off lightly under the circumstances.
“He kept hitting himself so I had to take his wallet to stop him”