Right. We’re talking about different incidents, Kyla. I also wish to make it clear that I did not intend to pass any kind of judgement on any posters or authority figures involved.
I think we need to note the difference between those who commit suicide because of emotional pain/clinical depression and those who choose to end their lives because of quality of life/chronic illness/deadly illness issues. I think that’s what happyheathen was trying to get at.
I’ve seen a declaration of suicidal intent that I was pretty sure was faked - that the poster only wanted to stir up people and get attention. Still, the other readers and I didn’t take a chance. I notified the board operator, and another reader tracked down the girl’s sister’s email address. A person claiming to be the poster’s sister signed on a week later to thank us and tell us the girl was under medical supervision.
My guess, though, is that a person who is truly bent on taking their life won’t bother posting it in a timely manner. That would leave room for intervention. Therefore, I believe a person posting that they intend to kill themselves really wants to be stopped.
This community being what it is, I have no doubt at all, that the posters and lurkers here would pull out every stop to find and help a suicidal member. I saw it happen during the frightening episode Kyla mentioned. I know it would happen again.
Well, they either want to be stopped, or they want to watch everyone get into a tizzy over it.
There’s no doubt it has happened and could happen here, but make no mistake - it’s pretty common for people to go on message boards and in chat rooms and declare that they’re despondent and will end it all, just to gauge people’s reactions.
I find it the most deplorable act when someone threatens to hurt themselves just for attention. It’s particularly juvenile when done on line.
Let me clarify:
I do NOT mean people who have legitimate mental health issues, depression or really are down. I’m talking about folks who know they are pulling at heart strings and do so to garner attention. These people have no intention of harming themselves but enjoy getting the outpourings of emotions (from people far more compassionate than I).
Blech.
Nothing really to add only that the thread made me think of The Suicide Journalist
Adolph Hitler did it in 1945. Seemed like a pretty good idea to me. If he had done it 10-15 years earlier, would that have been a tragedy? He did have some rather large head problems, but who would have cared to fix 'em.
When someone is feeling rotten enough to wish they were dead (seriously), one of the healthiest things they can do is express that to others. I would not characterize them all as people who “enjoy getting the outpourings of emotions” from others or as people who do it to “watch everyone get into a tizzy over it”.
The ones who go off by themselves, convinced that no one will ever understand, end up dead.
(This is not to say that there are not some people who don’t feel that way in the first place and who do just want to get everyone else upset. I’ve met them too).
I remember this Juniper. At the time I agreed with the poster.
About a month ago a friend of mine took his own life. He left a note in the form of his AOL instant messanger profile. He had gone through a bad breakup and had written some thoughts on his profile a few days before. They were full of dispair but didn’t mention suicide. Some saw these comments, I didn’t. He went through several drafts apparantly, with the last one being written the day before he killed himself. I read the AOLIM profile after the fact and it was obviously a suicide note. Unfortunately no one saw it in time.
I disagree with Anahita. Threatening to kill yourself is a cry for attention, but someone who’s in that situation is feeling pretty desperate and needs attention.
Does this question relate in any meaningful way to “How can we help our friends?”
It seems like the first thing to do would be to treat suicidal messages as serious, rather than treating them as bids for attention or egging them on, as people in the article were reported as doing. If some assholes out for attention get it because of this approach, BFD. I’d rather entertain some assholes on occassion than dismiss a genuine threat.
I know something about this issue on a personal and professional level.
At one time I had the job of gathering information about people who made death, suicide or other threats online. I would gather the info and then call the Opereration Security (OpSec) people and the lawyers. Opsec and the Lawyers, thankfully, would figure out what to do next. I didn’t want that on my shoulders (#1). During that time I found that there tended to be two types of suicide threats, those who meant to kill themselves and those looking for attention. The people who seemed serious, at least to me, tended to say “I just took some pills” or “I have a gun…”
while those who were looking for attention tended to say things like “At this time tomarrow I will have killed myself…”. We took all the threats as serious but after a bit it became obvious that some people were just looking for help in a twisted way. I always hated that part of the job. It was depressing.
On a personal level, one woman I met online IM’d me that she was going to kill herself. She had been through a very bad time. She just got divorced and her brother died. When she IM’D me she had taken some pills and a bunch of whiskey. She said she was going to cut her wrists. I alerted her service provider and called the cops in my town. I knew her first and last name and the state she was in but not the town. The local cops didn’t do shit. It took about a half hour to get someone in her state police to give a damn. Thankfully they showed up in time to stop her from hurting herself. She was taken to a hospital. She is doing much better and we still talk. She actually thanked me for calling the cops on her.
In other words, if there is a threat alert everyone you can. They have procedures to deal with these situations. At the same time do what ever you can to help.
Slee
most profoundly - define “help” - does it always mean “prolong life”?
I don’t think it does, but given that the linked article concerns a teenaged suicide attempt and posters have referenced an attempt following a medication change, this thread isn’t about people considering suicide because they’re battling terminal illnesses. “Is suicide always a bad thing?” is better termed a Great Debate, as there are a variety of approaches to the question.
I personally took the “is it always bad” comment to refer specifically to terminally ill patients in a lot of pain, not “would we be better off without some depressed person”.
I’m afraid it could quite definitely happen here. Last January, after an unfortunate encounter with my employer’s Employee Assistance program, I found out that there are a lot of people on this board who suffer from clinical depression and set up an on-line support group, Cecil’s Place, as a result.
As things stand now, I’ve been laid off for nearly two months, two very close friends will be moving 600 miles away sometime during the next 6 months or so, and I’ve just had a rather nasty, major crisis of faith. I’ve been dealing with clinical depression for over 20 years, so I sincerely doubt I’ll post a “Good bye. I’ve just taken a bunch of pills and I’m waiting for them to kick in” thread over in MPSIMS. I’ve got too much respect for you. However, since I am short one lifeline thanks to the crisis of faith, I was reviewing alternatives with the friends I mentioned this weekend, and this board is one of my lifelines. I plan on using it strictly as a “My life is really lousy right now” resource, but it’s nice to know you people are here. It’s very nice, indeed. 
I also remember a flap some months ago where a teenager posted something in MPSIMS which had both me and others worried about the possibility of him committing suicide and, IIRC, one of the moderators did contact his ISP directly who called his home. The poster was not happy, but it did look realistic, and I’m glad the moderator did so.
mandielise, you asked “What if you think you’re loved by no one?” I spent a lot of time thinking that, and believing I was not capable of being loved. I found out I was wrong. At the moment of suicide, one’s thoughts become distorted to where one can sincerely believe that no one loves them and that they are just being a burden to their friends and family. To me, that’s what makes it truly insanity. If you think you’re loved by no one, get a reality check from friends or from family, if applicable. Heck, if nothing else, go out to MPSIMS and ask. Please do seek professional help. Finally, if I can switch to Christian mode for one moment, God does love you. [/Christian mode]
Bosda, what you can do to help is something you’ve already done for me once. Remind those of us who get down on our hopes that we are liked, loved, and even a lot of fun! Dopers can do what we’re best at – be a fine, curious, wonderful community who considers every member important and who’ll give anyone a chance!
CJ
My niece tried to kill herself this summer. At 17, she had decided that she was more of a burden to us than a joy. Tired of being “sick, stupid”, and feeling unloved", my epileptic niece downed an entire bottle of anti-seizure medication. We were lucky, instead of being dead, she was in a coma for a week.
My niece can be annoying, she has always been a little bit needier than most of the other kids, but until that moment, I hadn’t realized how much I love her. I always known that I love all my nieces and nephews, they are all a part of who I am. Every time I think about how sad and lonely and scared my niece must have been that day she tried to end her life, I cry.
Even though she felt like no one loved her, one of the saddest things for me to understand is that she didn’t love herself enought to want to live. She temporarily felt like no one loved her and tried to find a permanent solution to that problem. I don’t think she even really understood the magnitude of her decision.
She’s physically much better now. She came to spend the summer with me so she could get away from everything and just relax. She’s obviously still epileptic, which means she’s still sick, but now she is working towards understanding that she’s not stupid, not a burden and definately not unloved.
Don’t think it relates too directly, but I had someone nearly commit suicide on me over ICQ. Mercifully, I was able to talk him down, using a combination of some crisis line training I had had and using my dad’s cell phone to call Kids Help Phone and relay messages from him to the counsellor there. That was - tense.