Well, considering that the type of love that’s being talked about is not an emotion but actions (I think), then charity fits too. I like it better with love just because nowadays charity is thought of as something you give money to, and not something you do yourself.
You all convinced me. I guess maybe he does have some problems.
Theologically, I think that inflicting suffering on yourself (unless it’s really to accomplish something) is wrong, and Paul did a good job of explaining that with the “body of Christ” metaphor. If one part suffers, so does the rest.
In Flannery O’Connor, characters who devote their lives to charity do it incidentally, not piously. They just do what they need to about whatever happens in front of them. And they’re often destroyed by their own acts of charity, even after being warned against it. There’s something about that, merely doing what’s right because that’s what people do, and disregarding the consequences to yourself, that is my, for lack of a better way of putting it, model of what’s holy.
Another frequent O’Connor character is the god-haunted; the reluctant prophet. In Wise Blood, Haze Motes feels the call to god, but he’s angry at god and wants nothing to do with it. To show who’s boss, he defiantly founds a church called the Church of Christ Without Christ, and puts sharp pebbles in his shoes and wraps barbed wire around his waist as a way to mortify these urges toward god.
Gothic, OK. But the whole idea of self mortification is purty dang gothic. This Fortunato seems to be doing it as a lark, in comparison. He’s not haunted enough for it to make sense to me; he’s just too businesslike about it. Or something. He does not convince me.
That was my impression too. It’s not like he just dropped in out of the clear blue sky yelling, “LOOK AT ME!!” No, the Da Vinci Crap stuff has been getting metric assloads of media coverage lately, and he wanted to present his side of the picture. You could almost say that he was, oh, I don’t know, fighting ignorance?
So THAT’S what what she died of! Damn, I saw that movie twice in grade school-once when I was six, and again when I was 10. Huh. I wondered why she died so damned young. (Hey, I was ten, what did I know?) Oh, and she had tuberculosis according to Wiki, not cancer.
Yeah, prideful or spiritual masturbation would be a good term for it. Dude, you don’t have to go out of your way to be uncomfortable. Just live a simple life-a plain, hard army cot, basic clothes, no fancy meals, etc. Why go out of your way to torture yourself? It accomplishes absolutely nothing.
Why not just hang a sign around your neck that says “I’m a nice guy who gives to charities and cuddles puppies and helps old ladies across the street?”
After all, Jesus said it wasn’t the self-martyrs who made a big display of their suffering and piety who got to Heaven. It was the people who went out and helped others, comforting the sick and dying, feeding the hungry, taking care of the poor and down trodden, who were invited in.
Thanks for the quotes. I think I’ll remember the name Flannery O’Connor and buy one of her books sometime.
The literary reference that comes to my mind is some of Louise Erdrich’s books, where she has a character who is nun who tortures herself as much as possible, to the extent of only allowing herself to use the bathroom once a day, never bathing, and all kinds of crazy stuff.
For a while I had this romantic notion of joining some monastery and giving a vow of poverty, but I think this thread has shattered that.
Also, self-inflicted suffering isn’t always just about looking good to others, but is also a way to assuage the guilt from living in a self-centered society.
Fasting shouldn’t be lumped in with some of the other stuff though. Fasting isn’t supposed to be about wallowing in your suffering, but about allowing God to sustain you. It probably doesn’t make sense to someone who’s not religious.
Another problem with the cilice-couldn’t it end up being dangerous, or at least, a health hazard? I can’t see wearing that over time would be good for one’s circulation, and over a long period of time, those little spikes, even if they don’t break the skin, would probably cause permanent groves in your skin, which would be ideal for injury and possibly infection.
And what if you’re in an accident, while you’re wearing it, and it cuts into your skin even deeper? What about diabetics in the order? Surely they don’t have to wear it! What about older members, who have poor circulation?
Dude, take cold showers if you’re that hard up. Much easier, probably better for you, and in the summer time, very refreshing.
(However, I’m probably not alone in thinking-if it didn’t have the little prongs, and was made out of silver with little beads, it’d make a purdy piece of jewelry!)