I was married once. My gf was married once. So, we’ve both experienced “marriage” and the craziness of divorce (she and I were each on the short end of divorce).
We’ve been together 15 or so years now and we both believe we’ll be a couple until one of us dies.
We are very happy, why marry?
After reading the replies I reread the OP and have another take.
For those people interested in marriage and perhaps children, long dating relationships are not what they want.
The OP specifically uses the phrase “demanded a firm commitment towards marriage.” My interpretation of this was that person A wanted to know if person B was willing to get married, not “pick our wedding date.” I think the first aspect is valid to ask early on in the dating process, the second aspect is not.
My bro and his SO have been mostly together for decades. Both are divorced. He made it clear to her early on that he wouldn’t get married again. Apparently she’s OK with the way things are. It works for them, and since they’re in their 60, children certainly isn’t a consideration.
It’s been my observation that couples who live together for years, the man often gives the woman a ring to shut her up, and he is thereafter referred to as ‘my fiance’. They stay ‘engaged’ for quite a while, until they break up because he drags his feet on popping the question (yes, I’ve seen a grown ass woman of 40 living with Bubba for 12 years who is waiting for him to propose! Like they do on the teevee! Like on the Hallmark Movie Channel!). … and then the ex runs into her ex-‘fiance’ who has within a year married and impregnated another woman!..He didn’t mind getting married, just not to his ex!
Mr. Salinqmind and I ‘went together’ for 6 years. We bought a house and I said I didn’t want to be a live-in, so he said ‘make whatever wedding arrangements you want, just tell me when and where to show up’. Three months later, we went to the justice of the peace and got married in her living room (that had an entire wall of decorative plates - Elvis was our witness, lol.). Romantic, huh?.. It worked out OK, but both of us have…issues. I don’t know if it was a good idea after all, but too late now.
Were you in a position to know exactly when the couples decided to get married or just when they announced their engagement or sent out the wedding invitations? Because for plenty of couples, these things are not so close together for various reasons - people may decide to get married after six months or a year, but not announce the engagement until the 2nd year, or send out the wedding invitations until third year.
And the marriage question you felt pressure to answer very soon- was it a specific " do you want to marry me" question or a more generic "what are you looking for" question? My SIL was in a long-term relationship, and at some point, I asked her if she knew what she wanted and what he wanted- did either of them want to spend the rest of their lives together, did either want to get married, did he want children ( she had a child but he didn't ), did they just want to be together for however long it lasted, whatever. She didn't know what she wanted, much less what he did. I told her to figure it out , lest she wake up one day and realize that she had spent her whole life in an relationship with him without meaning to. She didn't bring the subject up to him, until after about 12 years she told him she thought it was time they got married. And he said he had no intention of getting married. She then ended the relationship. Nothing wrong with him being opposed to marriage- but she would have been better off knowing that after 6 months or a year rather than 12 years.
I’m an asexual who prefers living alone. Why would I want to be married? I’vr had some very long term relationships (one for 12 years) with the upfront understanding that we’re not going to have sex, live together or get married.
OTOH, my sister lived with her wife for 16 years before being legally wed.
When I got divorced, I was ordered to pay alimony for X years or until my ex-spouse remarried or died. Some marriages that lasted longer may not have the “for X years” part and the alimony lasts until death or receiving party remarries.
My wife and I were together for a long-ass time before we finally got married. We met when we were young and at first we spent a few years doing the long distance thing while she finished school then I went to grad school then she went to grad school. Then we lived together for a decade. Basically it just got to a point where for for all intents and purposes we were a married couple. So we got married and now have two kids and are probably about as happy as most married couples.
I don’t know if it’s a “good” way to do things. I kind of feel like you know pretty much within a year if you want to marry someone. Also there is a tendency to look at those years together as an “investment” as opposed to a “sunk cost”. For me it was more about overcoming the fact that I kind of like doing what I want, when I want, with no one to answer to. Something that’s hard to do in ANY marriage with two kids.
Some people want to talk about marriage way before actually proposing. Those guys who explained to me in our first dates that once they made it rich I’d be able to quit my job and dedicate myself to taking care of their children were talking about marriage, but weren’t proposing. The Bestest Boyfriend and I had been part of several multi-party conversations about marriage in general terms for the two years our relationship lasted; he only proposed when I was already coming back to Spain. Middlebro and his now-wife knew pretty early on that they agreed that, if things went well, they would at some point get married; “at some point” was seven years after they started dating (they met at 18, married at 25).
Knowing where does the other person stand on the general subject of marriage is very different from planning a wedding. I’d certainly want to know about the first a long time before I even want to consider the second. Much as I disliked being told that I was expected to always earn less than my husband and even reject job offers that would mean I’d earn more, I do appreciate that those warnings came straightaway and allowed me to move on quickly.
My now-husband and I were together for 11 years before being married. I kind of wish that I’d added a few more years in there, and that was almost 30 years ago.
Curious, why do you wish that? What would be the benefit? Are you glad you eventually got married or do you think everything would have worked out the same if you hadn’t?
Could you explain what you mean by this ‘marriage ultimatum (firm commitment towards marriage)’?
Because there’s a (somewhat old-fashioned, but still frequently used) term for a 'firm commitment towards marriage: it’s called ‘engagement.’ When two people aren’t married yet, but have agreed that they will get married, they are ‘engaged.’
But I don’t think that’s what you’re referring to here. I’ve got a WAG about what their ultimata really mean, but it’s just that. But you’re the one who’s received these ultimata, so what was it that they really meant? Because I assume they weren’t asking you to propose at that early stage.
Love, marriage, and children are three completely separate things which an overly nosey society has tried to intertwine. Moving toward one in the presence of another doesn’t make sense to everybody.
My first marriage came after roughly 10 years of dating. If you count the final 4 years of mutual hell, and the 8 mutually unsatisfying years leading up to that it lasted 16.
My second marriage came after 5 months of dating (we both knew it was right within a week but neither said anything out of fear of being thought a clingy psycho), it’s been great for over 11 years.
This, IME, the longer the unmarried bit of the relationship, the more doomed the marriage will be.
That’s a very old fashioned term. Well, not so much the term itself , but the use of it to mean a firm commitment. At some point, ( and I’m not sure when, just that it was before I got married 33 years ago ) it started to mean “bought an engagement ring” to a lot of people. People would talk about “planning to get engaged”. Which made no sense to me- how could you plan to decide to get married? Seems to me you’ve already decided to get married if both are “planning to get engaged” and if only one person is planning , it’s not “planning to gt engaged” it’s “planning to propose”.
Interestingly, the OP hasn’t returned to his own thread. He’s active elsewhere on the board, which leads me to suspect that either (a) he forgot about this thread, (b) he read the responses and felt no need to reply to anything, or © he read the responses and didn’t like what he saw.
I got married 29 years ago, and many of my friends got married in the 1980s when they were in their late 20s to mid 30s.
At least among the people I knew, the engagement ring was secondary. Usually it was proposal first, and shop for a ring either later or not at all.
Yeah, I didn’t run into any of that, but it doesn’t make much sense.
Unless one thinks the rock is what’s necessary for engagement, in which case, for a lot of young couples, some planning would be necessary.
Same with the people I know/knew- but they didn’t consider/call themselves engaged for the months/years between the proposal/decision to get married and the ring. They would talk about "We’re getting engaged in three months ( when we’ve saved up enough for the ring)
That’s what I was getting at- an awful lot of people seem to think you’re not engaged until the rock has been given.
That’s weird - for everyone I know (including my wife and me), ‘engagement’ meant we’d said the words, we’d made the decision. After I proposed to her and she accepted, we called up everyone to tell them we were engaged. The first flicker of the merest thought about a ring hadn’t yet crossed my mind.
This was a long time ago when most people didn’t live together unmarried. I met my wife in late August 1963 (the year is significant) and dated every weekend after that (she lived about 30 miles away in another state) until the weekend of Nov. 22 when we seriously bonded. We got engaged New Year’s Eve and married in March. We are about to celebrate our 56th anniversary. In truth, I was really looking for a mate and I think she was too. On the other hand each of my kids lived with their spouse for at least a year before getting married. When my daughter’s boyfriend moved in with her, she said to us, “Now don’t expect us to get married.” Okay. Two years later they did marry and she said, “Now don’t expect us to have children.” They did, just one.
I think they mean that while they’ve decided, maybe tacitly and long ago, that they’d get married someday, “getting engaged” means the phase where they start actively planning the wedding. The ring is the symbol that signifying that phase has started. It’s not the definition I’d use, but there it is.