Pitting the latest antidrug.com ad

The BBQ Pit
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sometimes i wonder why i subscribed to this board, i read all the posts i’m interested in everyday, but i rarely post because i rarely feel that i have anything to add, but i think i need to pu in my two cents here.

eustachian≠fallopian, where did you pick up all this misinformation? can’t you see that your argument is invalid? you sound like a government issue propaganda bot. you may think you are mature now, but maturity comes with age (for most) and experience (somthing you don’t have that much of yet, especially if you are limiting yourself the way you seem to be). you think the only reason to smoke is to get high? think again. infact, try rethinking all that misinformation that’s been rammed down your throat and start researching and thinking for yourself. i smoke weed to get high at times, but at other times it is medication to me. i work at ups, i work very hard. i hurt from all the nonstop heavy lifting, bruises, and the occasional cardboard cut. the job also wears me out mentally and emotionally and the only thing that gets me through it all is that i know that after i get home, shower and toke up, i will feel ok (or as ok as possible) again. you judge me for this? you think i am being irresponsible? it’s weed for christ’s sake! the arguments you are making would work against other drugs, but not for weed. that is not just my opinion, it is something i have learned while studying pharmacology. every teacher i have had in the pharmacology program (all of them PHARMACISTS) have stated that pot is a great drug because of its many uses, LACK OF SERIOUS SIDE EFFECTS, and the fact that it doesn’t have bad interactions with other drugs. i am going to join in with finn (a fellow james joyce fan?) and declare you an idiot (though i don’t think its too late for you or anything, i think most of us were idiots when we were your age). relax, and be patient. maturity and wisdom will come to you in their own sweet time.

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See, you’re missing it. Nothing to do with me whatsoever- I’m a sixteen-YO. I know that. FinnAgain, on the other hand, is a twenty-some-YO who still thinks that he needs to justify what he did as a teen. He needs to get over himself. We all make mistakes or do stupid stuff (and what he was describing did not go under “safe drug use”, regardless of what think of such a concept). We all learn from it… but not FinnAgain. Regardless of how many years my senior he is, or how much more experience he has, he took the low road, effectively, “We all did it and it never hurts anyone and you’re just a poopy-head.” Regardless of what you may think of me, his position (and more importantly, his way of defending his position) is infantile. It’s like whenever Pat Buchanan talks about certain politics as immature. His words carry weight, party because he’s not that great himself.

I’m afraid I have to run, but FinnAgain may consider that his response. This conversation (both sides) has been a complete waste of hamsters. I don’t object to posting again in this thread if other posters want me to defend my words or position to them. At some point, however, it’s time for one or both of us to try to keep our few remaining shreds of dignity.

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You’re going to have to elaborate if you want to make snippy remarks like that.

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Comrade, check my sig. I am indeed a fellow Joycean.

filmore yeah, the bait and switch was a real bitch. And yeah, that sounds about right re: the dynamics of prohibition if not the specifics in all cases.

No,you smug asshole. See, you’re the one who insists on being all holier-than-thou. Someone disagreeing with your ignorant arrogant condemnation is not trying to justify anything, just telling you to fuck off.

See, that’s part of the problem. Someone says “You have no right to judge me and the choices I make as I harm nobody, not even myself, and took risks and actions which I viewed as worth my time.” and your response is “Oh, I see you’re still trying to justify your horrible and immature behavior.”

Cram a porcupine sideways, chump.

Yes, it did. Again, stop speaking from ignorance. Getting a bit drunk with friends and not driving? No significant long term health risks, if any. Smoking pot and still handling your shit? The biggest danger is not anything having to do with the drug or how it works, but the cops.

And this is why you’re a rabid flaming asshole.
Even people who chose a different path than yours, and, miracle or miracles, find their own meaning and values in their own lives, aren’t somehow ‘deviants’. Your moral absolutism is idiotic, arrogant, and repugnant.

Again, asshole, responsible drug use is reeeeeeeeeeesponsible, it can be perfectly harmless. Your desire to be all growd up and look down upon your ‘lessers’ is somewhat surreal. My position is the truth, and you’re just an ignorant walking memetic infection. ~shrugs~ Fuck you.

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Befoerm you compare these highs, you might want to try them. You sound really ignorant when you make these claims.

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Fair enough. However, let me point something out. Regardless of how it feels, the change in perspective from getting high is a completely chemical occurence in your brain. There’s nothing mystical about it, just your body doing what your body does. It may be one hundredfold better-feeling than meditation. But it’s just a temporary feeling.

No, I will not break the laws of the country in which I reside just so that I know what it feels like. I’m not about to cut off my leg so that I better understand the haunting feeling of thinking I have a leg yet not having one when I look down*. Secondhand accounts will be fine; refusal to learn in the best manner is not automatic ignorance. If you want to tell us all about exactly how it feels and exactly why it’s better than meditation or natural highs, then by all means do so. If you think there is ignorance to be fought, then fight it.
*A common report of amputees.

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You really are a smug, condescending asshole, aren’t you? Is there anything more annoying than a reasonably bright teenager who thinks he’s a genius?

It’s pretty normal for a teenager to experiment with drugs (including alcohol). That you don’t want to doesn’t make you smarter and superior to those who choose to experiment.

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Ummmm…so? When I eat a hamburger, my hunger is satisfied…but it’s only a temporary feeling. I’m pretty fucking glad that an acid trip isn’t a permanent state. Rollercoasters are fun, but I’s to spend 24 hours a day on one.

Actually, it really is.

:rolleyes: The only way to really understand what getting high is like is to get high. All the reading in the world won’t help in this area.

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I suspect these posts are just going to provide more fodder for e?f to gloat about his maturity. Can’t we all just pat him (her?) on the head and talk about how cute teenage self-righteousness is?

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Incidentally, I think my original point was that teenagers should not be using drugs. I would make the same argument for adults, but in this case, that really is their business. Because they’re adults. Teenagers are not adults; they have legal guardians. Also, the idea that if they get drugs at home they won’t do them elsewhere just doesn’t stand. Why would you assume that? Isn’t setting a precidence of behavior likely to make that behavior happen elsewhere (and possibly with nastier drugs)? It doesn’t always work to say, “Just don’t do it.” It’s worse to say, “Just don’t do it here.” There still is a point where a parent is going to have to say, “that drug may hurt you something awful. Bad idea.” Or should we abolish that point?

Why should a guest have to point out to THREE different members that they actually need to point out the misinformation and show why it’s false before calling it that? This is becoming a dogpile; I might feel bad for being dogpiled if you people felt a need to justify what you said. See, I put in a nice little point-by-point argument for you guys to debunk if you wanted to. Instead, you just said, “that’s stupid”. Well guess what, saying “that’s stupid” without justifying it is, well, STUPID.

No and yes, respectively. (A) you shouldn’t need a medication to feel well, unless you have a diagnosable illness (psychological or physical). If such an illness exists, talk to a doctor. Regardless, you have not made a good argument for why you must have drugs. (B) Commiting a crime to feel good is rarely responsible. Yeah, I know, the laws against marajuana suck. I’m not convinced about them either. But risking serious punishment isn’t a good idea. If you want to, I guess there’s nothing I can do about it.

Yeah, I know, marajuana isn’t that bad for you. Inhaling smoke is in and of itself not good for you, but certainly it can’t be much worse than tobacco, and I’m aware than a marajuana high is better than getting drunk. Nonetheless, this thread covered all drugs used by teenagers, not just marajuana.

I never said that. I never even thought it. I just happen to think that hurting yourself is immature. What maturity I have will be judged by the people I live, learn, and work with every day, not by my stance on any topic. Should I or have I at any point shown maturity, I’ll be the last to know about it.

To the law? Gimme a break. It would be one thing to be adament about jay-walking or concerned about the nitty-gritties of copyright law. It’s quite another with drug laws. Ever since Reagan, it’s been an awfully big deal to be caught with drugs. All the worry just to have a new experience? Trial is a new experience. Fines are a new experience. Prison’s a new experience. Parole’s a new experience. But I don’t want any of them.

Sure, you probably won’t get caught. But is it really worth it? Do you have to deal with your life that way?

Wait, I think I’m reading this a new way. You’re actually recommending that I intentionally do stupid things now so that I learn from them. Yeah, that’s a good idea. :rolleyes:

True—kind of. The FDA is mandated to make sure everybody knows about the side effects of RX drugs. This is why their lack of honesty from time to time is such a big deal: it’s vital to consumers that they get it right. However, people using RX generally have an underlying BIOLOGICAL need for the drug, and take it to fix their problem. The doctor and pharmacist (and usually the consumer) must look at the drugs and weigh benefits and risks. Usually, the benefits win out. On the other hand, the benefits from a banned substance (illegal drug) are not medical; they’re to feel good or have an experience or be popular, etc. Since there are options to accomplish the same task that don’t involve illegality and nasty little side effects, it makes no sense to go with banned substance. FWIW, the majority of these banned drugs have much nastier side effects than any medication that I would be willing to take.

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OK, let me rephrase. I have nothing against getting drunk. I wrote what I wrote in a moment of pro-marijuana rage. I was just trying to say that between alcohol and pot, alcohol is probably worse for you. But both can be used responsibly.

There is a difference between substance use and substance abuse. I think that’s what this boils down to.

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(My text editor does not handle the special character you use in your username, so I have changed it to a two-character equivalent string.)

If you don’t want to use drugs, that’s fine. However, conlcuding that no teenager (including 18 and 19 year-old adults) should not because you bought into the misinformation thrown at you from programs like DARE and the ‘antidrug’ commercials and then acting smug to everyone else, including those who would give their own kids different advice that is based on fact makes you look like an immature know-it-all.

You’re being an ass.

They have done that. Or do you think a pharmacologist (someone who studies drugs) is not a qualified quote?

The problem here is that you cannot recognize what other people are saying. Nobody’s said they ‘must have’ drugs. They have said they choose to use them on occasion because they enjoy them.

And the fact that the anti-drug programs (such as DARE) are doing a gigantic disservice to kids by spitting out the same message on every drug, only to have those kids later find out that they were lied to about the effects and risks of pot. It then calls into question the veracity of all their statements about all drugs.

Kind of like when a witness in court lies during one part of their testimony, it casts doubt upon the truth of all their testimony.

Not all of them have ‘nasty little side effects,’ and quite honestly, the law is not my primary concern.

Which is why so many people take anti-biotics for the flu. And let’s not get into the debate over whether things like Ritalin and Adderall are over-prescribed to kids.

And this makes it OK for DARE and antidrug.com to lie about pot?

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**Eustachian =!%$@ Fallopian, ** you keep talking about nasty side effects. What is the nasty side effect of pot that you are referring to?

Again, no offense, but I have to question your understanding of the “side effects” if you’ve never used it.

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Actually, the olympic committee is split on just how to score that one.

Good attempt at defining the individual nervous sytems of all of humanity, though.

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Don’t underestimate the benefit of feeling good or having an experience. You dismiss these reasond out of hand. I like feeling good.

You don’t seem to realize that feeling good via massage and feeling good via Ecstasy are very different things (although a massage + exstasy = heaven). And not every drug have “nasty little side effects”. Every substance has different effects. Sometimes the side effects are nasty (for some people), sometimes there’s almost no nasty side effects at all (pot). A little research + a little experimentation will tell you whether the positives outweigh the negatives for a given substance. Until you know what it’s like, you can’t make definitive statements about all the “nasty little side effects” etc. And even if you’ve tried it, your experiences may only be true for you.

For you. Other very intelligent people have weighed the risks and decided the risk was worth it. Even teenagers. The only way to make sure they can make intelligent decisions about this is to give them honest information.

Punk teenagers always think they have the on right answer. The world is a much more complicated place than you seem to think it is.

Are you sure?

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I’d really like to make this a somewhat pleasant post, though I cannot promise this.

Now, i’m a teenager. A young, female teenager at that. Being only 17 and all, I’m not even legal in my own country yet. I drink. A fair bit. I’ve been drunk a couple of times. I also smoke pot. I giggle, eat copious amounts of Pringles and other delicious tasting things, the carpet and bubble wrap feel great under my feet, i gain the ability to focus on only one thing at a time, such as a funny movie or the comedy stylings of David Strassman, I stare at the roof thinking about life and sorting through things with a new perspective and music takes on a whole new sound where instruments can be heard induvidually and the sound is quite intoxicating AND :eek: my friends do it for the same reason.

You seem to presume that we either don’t care or don’t know. You are wrong on both accounts. We know exactly whats going into our bodies. And we do care. I’m sure you know about chemicals emitted from motor vehicles into the atmosphere. Does this mean that you breathe from an oxygen tank to as not to inhale possibly harmful chemicals? I think not.

With all this in mind, I’d now like to add that I hold down a full time job as a trainee financial advisor, own my own car, half on a steady long-term relationship, in exactly 2 weeks and 1 day, be completely responsible for my own residence and dont have a single health problem that couldnt be rectified with an asprin or cold & flu tablet.
DON’T under any circumstances make an arguement out of something when you only know one side of the story. It makes you look a tad foolish.

As the saying goes, “Don’t knock it 'til you try it”.

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Let me point something out. All feelings are chemical occurrences in your brain, and save perhaps for a few psychological disorders, they’re all temporary. So what you’re saying here is irrelevant, I think.

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…and I just noticed that I’ve been consistantly misspelling marijuana as “marajuana”. :smack: :smack: :smack: Thought I’d point it out before one of the dogpilers did.

All right, here’s a National Institue of Drug Abuse article on the effects of marijuana. No, they aren’t that bad compared to other drugs. They’re more than I would accept from a perscription drug in a situation where it was not either necessary for survival or irrelevant (because I wasn’t going to last long anyway). So yes, I’m sure. In medical usage, marijuana’s benefits often outweigh the costs. Fine. But we’re not talking about medical usage.

AtheistPrincess, I can only encourage you to stop what you’re doing, for the reasons listed in what you quoted. There truly are other ways of gaining new perspective. Use one of them, for your own good. The side effects of long-term (and you still have quite a few years in front of you) alcohol overuse or alcoholism can get nasty: liver failure, damage to the brain, emotional damage to yourself and those around you.If you get offended that I don’t agree with what you are doing and that I don’t think it’s smart, so be it. That won’t change my advice.

Of course very intelligent. Intelligent people are more often bored than unintelligent people, making them more likely to take drugs, IMHO. They’re also more likely to want an “alternate reality”. Immortality complexes are not restricted to unintelligent people.

My point, Marley, is that this different perspective or alternate reality is merely a figment of the user’s imagination. And of course, most feelings are temporary. While the high feeling is temporary, the consequences often are not.

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[QUOTE=eustachian≠fallopian]

AtheistPrincess, I can only encourage you to stop what you’re doing, for the reasons listed in what you quoted. There truly are other ways of gaining new perspective. Use one of them, for your own good. The side effects of long-term (and you still have quite a few years in front of you) alcohol overuse or alcoholism can get nasty: liver failure, damage to the brain, emotional damage to yourself and those around you.If you get offended that I don’t agree with what you are doing and that I don’t think it’s smart, so be it. That won’t change my advice.[\QUOTE]

Meh.

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That information seems pretty obvious to me. I’d describe the gist of it as “If you use it to excess, it can be very harmful.”

Can you not even tell the difference between drinking and alcoholism? Atheist Princess ought to be careful, I agree, and 17 is younger than I’d want to hear about someone drinking “a fair bit.” But she’s copped to neither overuse nor alcoholism.
The only thing keeping this discussion going at this point seems to be your lack of knowledge.

So is reality, arguably. Since this isn’t GD I won’t go there. The point is that I don’t understand why you think this matters. If you look at a great piece of art, it only alters your brain chemically and temporarily, but it can contribute to your perspective. Granted you may be more likely to forget the “insights” you attain while stoned, and they will probably turn out to be dumb, but so what?

And then again, sometimes they are. If all you have to go on are worst-case scenarios - “you’ll become an addict,” “the cops will get you,” “you’ll abuse it and get brain damage” - your argument isn’t very good. There are good reasons not to smoke marijuana and I’ve got my own reasons for not doing it. But you seem unable to apply any finesse in your thinking.