The traditional greetings are congratulating the man for having won the fair lady’s hand, and wishing happiness (“felicitations”) to the bride. The bride is not congratulated because that suggests she was involved in the crass pursuit of trying to land a man, which does not put her in a particularly favorable light. This is sexist, as are the overwhelming majority of our traditions, but is not derogatory or oppressive. It’s actually complimentary to the woman, both in being a person worthy of being courted and wed (thus we congratulate the groom), and not being a person so undesirable she had to resort to husband-hunting (thus we don’t congratulate the bride). Say what you want to the bride, but getting one’s knickers in a twist over this strikes me as trying to hard too find offense.
“No worries” is adorable. “No problem” seems . . . lazy or not very sincere or something. Definitely isn’t comparable to someone saying “why of course dear, it was no trouble at all”. It’s not that big a deal but it does rankle a bit. Also, both have the same amount of syllables so it’s not like it rolls of the tongue easier or something. We had a server the other night who was just as pleasant as can be but she said “of course” instead of “you’re welcome” every time one of us thanked her. I don’t hold it against her or anything, but after awhile it just seemed strange.
Old, old joke:
Nosy: “Say, you’ve got a cast on your arm!”
Nice: “Yes.”
Nosy: “Break it?”
Nice: “Yes.”
Nosy: “How’d you do that?”
Nice: “Patting myself on the back.”
Nosy: “Uh… what for?”
Nice: “Minding my own business.”
While Vinyl Turnip’s response to you was great, I think you misunderstood him. He wrote
So he’s saying he’s confused by people who insist on “you’re welcome” (instead of being fine with “no problem” or “no worries” or “sure thing” or whatever other totally innocuous idiomatic response someone gives to “thanks”). That’s fine–he’s being more relaxed than the sourpusses.
Similarly, he congratulates people for getting engaged or married, a fine thing to do. If someone gets all weird about receiving congratulations, they can fuck right the hell off.
He’s cool with people unless they cop an attitude about social niceties, in other words. That’s a perfectly cromulent way to go through life. Did you read him as saying he’d cop the attitude?
I think it’s actually impolite to assume that something sincerely meant, in a good-hearted way, is rude.
I mean, honestly. A bride that takes offense at being congratulated rather than being wished the best is being rude, even thought that’s a stupid sexist distinction. It’s party day, anything positive should be assumed to be meant positively. A person who replies to “Merry Christmas” with “Hey, I’m Jewish” is being rude. Assume that most people mean well and are not trying to make you feel worse.
Also, when someone says “How are you?” that is just a polite question. Unless your house just burned down and you have a cast on your leg and bandages on your head, you’re fine, how are they?
I put this on you. Why are you thanking them to begin with, if you’re particular about feeling that they are just doing their job, and no favor to you?
Weddings are the kind of high events in life that deserve good taste and at least respectful behavior. Saying “Congratulations” to a bride is neither. If someone cannot conduct themselves at a wedding without insulting the participants, they should simply not attend the wedding or comment on it.
The problem is plenty of people don’t act this way out good-hearted miss intentions. They do it because its a passive-aggressive way of insulting someone. Or because they are too lazy to open an etiquette book which is rather insulting in its own way. It implies they view courtesy to those around them is not worth their time and effort.
Correct protocol, I believe, is to say, “Congratulations, you crazy bitch!” while grabbing her hand in yours and pumping vigorously–but I admit I can’t find the page in my Emily Post.
“Congratulations” has become the standard term of well-wishing for all happy events for everyone. For anyone to take this as being in bad taste or disrespectful is looking for a reason to fight.
The former distinction between congratulating a groom and well-wishing a bride is obsolete, both in terms of being offensively sexist and in terms of people just not being aware of this obsolete custom.
And if “congratulations” is in dad taste or disrespectful to a bride, then it must be for a groom as well. Modern society doesn’t make such sexist distinctions.
I have never in my life heard about the distinction between ‘‘congratulations’’ and ‘‘best wishes’’ and I can’t for the life of me figure out how such a distinction is in any way meaningful.
I heartily disagree it is the person that feels the need to insult the bride that is looking for a fight. It’s simply etiquette and ritual which is basically all a wedding is. Perhaps you find the fact that the bride often wears a dress at the wedding, while the groom rarely does sexism?
But, but, :eek: there might be Monsters out there! We’ve got to send the canary out first Just In Case!
The door-holding is … difficult. It’s fun being chivalrous, but I feel bad when it’s so awkward for both parties – I’m glad to hold it for anyone who needs it (e.g. hands full). But sometimes you have the woman dressed in heels and a nice outfit (i.e. they seem to dress traditionally), so maybe they expect the traditional etiquette.
[ul][li]So, I have to speed up (or pretend to slow…)[/li][li]pass her (or pretend not to be waiting…)[/li][li]grab open the door, [/li][li]and get out of the way, [/li][li]so she goes first.[/li][/ul]Then its probably an airlock entry (vestibule)!
[ul][li]So I would have to rush (politely) in and past her,[/li][li]while she notices and pretends not to slow as she allows it.[/li][li]So that I can get to the other door and grab it open, [/li][li]and step aside,[/li][li]and let her through first.[/li][/ul]But then, there might be monsters ahead, so, a win for me.
It’s just as awkward to step in first (because there isn’t room to step aside) and then leeeeeaaaaan over to hold the door open while also standing aside. I just think it makes it awkward for both of us - but then [Fiddler-on-The-Roof]Tradition![/Fiddler]
I also hate it when walking down the hall and your friend/coworker/acquaintance is walking toward you and as you pass they say “How’s it goin’?”. You are already past before it’s your turn. Do you say “Fine” to thin air? Turn and shout “Fine” in their general direction and scare the neighbors in their cubicles? Say, “Well I’ve got this pain in my…” :dubious: as they walk away? In my area at work we seem to at least have a Smile-And-Head-Nod that both parties can do while passing that serves well, doesn’t require shouting or turning-to-comment, and can be performed simultaneously as each is passing. But the concept of asking someone how they are doing as you pass by destroys any semblance that there is true interest in your well being.
Etiquette is what people actually do in the real world, not what some pearl-clutching biddy wrote in a book when everyone liked Ike and in certain neighborhoods it was just dandy to hang a negro from a tree at your wedding.
In the real world, people can be insulted by this breach of manners. I wrote off a few acquaintances for this insult and my last wedding was decades ago. Formal etiquette is what allows people (even absolute enemies) to interact with other in a sane manner. It’s an important tool for maintaining a civil society, not something to be thrown aside out of laziness.