Questions About Ireland

My husband has been talking for a long time about wanting to move to Ireland. Now he’s starting to actually look at jobs, and saying “when” we move, instead of “if” we move.

So, I have some questions. Please forgive me for my public education.

[ul]
[li]The British are only in Northern Ireland, right? And all of the fighting that goes on happens in the north? Is Southern Ireland a sovereign country? And is the name of that country Southern Ireland or Republic of Ireland? [/li][li]What are the laws like in Ireland (the south)? What are a person’s rights like compared to the US? Do you have the same freedom of speech? Right to bare arms? What about educational rights? Can I continue to homeschool?[/li][li]A friend of mine has both United States and French citizenship. She tells me that technically, the US does not allow dual citizenship, but that no one seems to care. When she is in the US, she is American and cannot claim the rights of a French citizen. When she is in France, she is French and cannot claim the rights of an American. Is this about right? If we became Irish citizens, could we retain our American citizenship in this way? If we can’t, how difficult would it be to return to the US for visits to our family, etc.?[/li][li]What are adoption laws like in Ireland? I have wanted for some time to adopt my step-kids, but the laws in Texas make it difficult and expensive. Would it be easier in Ireland? (Their bio-mom still has rights to them, but I wouldn’t be surprised if she willingly gave those up. We just haven’t tried because I would have to adopt them right away, and we can’t afford it.)[/li][li]My dh is a Unix SysAdmin. He has been looking for jobs in Ireland. The way he explains it to me, a company has to hire an Irish citizen first, and after that a citizen of an EU country. They can only hire Americans if neither of those are available. So what are his chances of getting a job based on wanting to become an Irish citizen? What are his chances of a company being willing/able to pay for us to move?[/li][li]Just exactly how cold is it in Ireland? How is it compared to central France? I spent a summer in the mountains in central France, and it was cool even in July. Warm enough in the day for the beach, but cool enough at night to need a shawl. Is Ireland like that? Is it really, really, really cold in the winter?[/li][li]How do people in the south feel about the IRA? My husband is very supportive of them. Would that make us unpopular?[/li][li]Is there anything else that an American moving to Ireland might be surprised to know? [/li][/ul]
Thanks for your help!

Oh!!

[ul]
[li]I live online. We have a cable modem, and I keep in contact with my dh all day while he is at work. Is that feasible in Ireland?[/li][/ul]

Before the specialists come along to answer your more technical questions I’ll try the first one:

[ul][li]The British are only in Northern Ireland, right? And all of the fighting that goes on happens in the north? Is Southern Ireland a sovereign country? And is the name of that country Southern Ireland or Republic of Ireland?[/ul][/li]When you say “The British are only in Northern Ireland, right?” you’re already making a politically-charged remark, but yes, only Northern Ireland is part of the UK.

Fortunately there’s not much fighting going on at all at the moment. Long may that continue. Isolated incidents do occur, especially at certain times of the year, but yes they tend to be in the north.

Yes, the southern part of the island is a sovereign country. Technically it’s called Ireland, but Republic of Ireland is commonly used too.

**
[list]
[li]The British are only in Northern Ireland, right? And all of the fighting that goes on happens in the north? Is Southern Ireland a sovereign country? And is the name of that country Southern Ireland or Republic of Ireland? **[/li]
The Republic of Ireland, consisting of 26 counties, has been a free, independent nation for 80 years.
**What are the laws like in Ireland (the south)? What are a person’s rights like compared to the US? Do you have the same freedom of speech? Right to bare arms? **

It’s a modern, democratic nation, and your freedom of speech is secure. If, by “bare arms,” you mean the right to wear t-shirts, you’re fine. If you mean the right to own handguns, you won’t like it- like most European nations, Ireland has much stricter gun control laws than the U.S.

Just exactly how cold is it in Ireland? How is it compared to central France? I spent a summer in the mountains in central France, and it was cool even in July. Warm enough in the day for the beach, but cool enough at night to need a shawl. Is Ireland like that? Is it really, really, really cold in the winter?

It depends what you’re used to. If you’re a sun lover, Ireland isn’t for you. The winters aren’t nearly as cold as the winters I was used to in New York, but the summers aren’t very warm. I recall seeing people swimming at the beaches of Ballybunion when it was 55 or 65 degrees Farenheit and raining (you can’t blame them- in Ireland, if you wait for a balmy day to go to the beach, you may NEVER go!)! Rarely frigid, but usually cool and often rainy. I happen to LOVE that kind of weather (I can barely stand the hot summers of Texas), but it’s not for everyone.
** How do people in the south feel about the IRA? My husband is very supportive of them. Would that make us unpopular?**

Opinions vary, of course, but in my experience, Irish Americans are far more likely to romanticize the IRA than people living in the Republic of Ireland. Most of my friends and relatives in Ireland think the modern IRA is more like the Mafia (a bunch of drug dealing thugs and extortionists) than an admirable band of freedom fighters.

Is there anything else that an American moving to Ireland might be surprised to know?

Well, many Americans still think of Ireland as a rural nation, filled with good-natured rubes and yokels. They’re often surprised by:

  1. How modern Ireland has become in a relatively short time
  2. How YOUNG the population is
  3. How much ethnic diversity there is (you now have many Africans, Asians, et al.)
  4. How well-informed and knowledgeable the Irish are about what’s going on in the world. They know a lot more about what’s going on in the U.S. government than most Americans do!

I’ve heard that writers, artists and arts professionals pay no taxes in Ireland. True, or a gross oversimplification?

The master has spoketh

Maybe you should talk to Anahita.
(recent MPSIMS thread about being an expat in Ireland)

As for the climate, palm trees grow in most parts of the island. It never gets very cold (almost never below freezing, from what I understand), but then again, it never gets particularly warm, either. There’s a reason that heavy wool sweaters are associated with Ireland. And in the two weeks we were there, it rained every single day. Not continually, but at least some every day.

I’ll take a stab at some of these right now and try to make it back for the others later.

Though I can’t offer professional legal opinion on this topic, from a practical point of view, you probably won’t notice the difference (gun thing aside).

[quote]
[li]A friend of mine has both United States and French citizenship. She tells me that technically, the US does not allow dual citizenship, but that no one seems to care. When she is in the US, she is American and cannot claim the rights of a French citizen. When she is in France, she is French and cannot claim the rights of an American. Is this about right? If we became Irish citizens, could we retain our American citizenship in this way? If we can’t, how difficult would it be to return to the US for visits to our family, etc.?[/li][/quote]

Ireland does not require American nationals (and perhaps all others too) to relinquish US citizenship when applying for dual. In the US, the requirement to renounce citizenship is dependent on which country you’re applying to. As far as I know, there is no problem holding dual citizenship twixt US and Irl. This info was first given to me by the Irish Embasy in DC. In discussion with the citizenship office in Dublin, no one’s mentioned that there would be problems holding dual US/Irish citizenship.

Worth noting, an application for Irish citizenship is a lengthy, time consuming, and bureaucratic process. The Minister for Justice Equality and Law Reform has been inundated with request and it takes between one and two years to process an application. And that doesn’t include the time you put intro getting everything together (ballpark, 6mos-1 year). Also keep in mind that you and hubby will have to live there for 3-5 years before you can apply. Point being, this is a fuck of a long process. If you’re seriously considering it you’ll want to view websites from the Irish embassy in the US, the Department of Justice, Equality and Law Reform in Dublin, and Office for Employment (or something like that) in Ireland. You’ll also want to start getting everything in order now. It’s a pain in the ass to be looking for stuff in the Sates whilst living in Ireland.

Regarding the rights issue, I’m not sure if I understand you’re question so I’ll just offer a bit of common sense advice. If you’re in another country you are, regardless of your citizenship, subject to their rules and laws. If you’re in the position to be concerned with this, you might want to re-think your departure.

The likelihood of getting a job based on your desire to become an Irish citizen is nil. But like any job, if he mentions that he plans to be in the area for a while, it’s a good thing

This hiring scenario you describe is pretty much par for the course in much of Europe. However, I’ve noticed-anecdotally, that an American has a pretty good shot of getting a job in Ireland. This is particularly true for computer jobs. As the tech industry started to grow, there weren’t enough techies in Irl to go around. They needed people from somewhere and if you’re a native speaker of the language, with experience, you’re in pretty good shape. Having said that, I can’t comment on the present state of affairs.

**

Temperature ranges from slightly above freezing in the winter (think 40’s) to mid seventies (on a hot day, or better yet the hot day) in the “summer.” It does however rain a lot. I mean a real freakin lot.

**

The tax rates might surprise you. It is, I think, 42%. The VAT’s 22%.

Oh and the internet connection. Cable lines aren’t nearly as common in Irl. Most folks I knew, if they had a net connection at home (a very small percentage) had a dial-up.

Your husband would be wise to keep that to himself. Imagine if a young Saudi couple moved to America and decided to proclaim their support for Al-Qaida.

Sorry to tell you, but your dh (husband?) has only a very small chance of getting a job in Ireland. There is a very large amount of technology companies in Ireland, particularly Dublin but they are feeling the effects of the slowdown just as much as in the US. There is currently a large amount of Irish Tech workers who are looking for work including many grads who have yet to find a job since graduating in 2002, so it is unlikely that an American could find a job unless he has very specialized skills. Also I am not sure how your standard of living is given that your husband is a unix sysadmin, but I know that I as a software developer have a much lower standard of living than my American counterparts. I work for an American technology company and the Irish starting wage for a SW graduate is aprox $26,000 in the US for the same position it is $60,000 and the cost of living in Dublin is comparable to the cost of living in many US cities.

You probably can, however if your children wish to go to Irish University it is a very good idea if they complete the Irish final exams called the Leaving Certificate, similar to the French Baccelaurate (sp) or British A Levels. So the syllabus for those exams may be quite different to what you were used to teaching them. More importantly though I have moved around a lot as a child, and when moving to a new area I made almost all of my friends through school, Ireland (particularly Dublin) doesn’t really have so much of a friendly neighbor culture anymore so your children could end up with very few friends.

It is common knowledge in Ireland that many American people are supportive of the IRA, so were he to voice his support he would probably just be politely ignored. But I would certainly not recommend it it is a topic close to many people’s hearts and certain people would not appreciate a person who has not been affected by the troubles to be shooting his mouth off about it.

Sorry about the length, and the general pessimism of this reply

This last question depends on what you means by ‘supportive’. I don’t think you would turn too many heads by polite fully proclaiming you believe the IRA have good reason for their specific cause, or if you advocate the desire for a United Ireland.
But f you run around saying “kill all Brits” and the like, don’t expect to make many friends. (Read “The Dirty War” for a decent introduction to the complexity of the Troubles, although it is a little out of date now)

Ireland is also, AFAIK, the second largest (behind the US) producer of computer code in the world. That said, lots of computer companies are laying people off at an alarming rate. The best way to get a job in Ireland would be to get a transfer on a yearly contract from a local company (if possible), and try to extend or have the contract made permanent from the inside.

If you go to Dublin, you will be surprised by the costs of living - it is one of (if not * the*) most expensive cities in Europe - especially for food & drink. No cheap eating out like you have at home.

Ireland is generally colder than France, but rain and wind are certainly more common than severe cold or snow. The width of the roads outside of cities may also surprise you.

**The British are only in Northern Ireland, right? And all of the fighting that goes on happens in the north? Is Southern Ireland a sovereign country? And is the name of that country Southern Ireland or Republic of Ireland? **

Only Northern Ireland is part of the UK, and about two-thirds of the population there self-identifies as “British”. There are a signficant number of persons living in the south who are British (in the sense of having been born and brought up in Britain, and having migrated to Ireland). The south is a sovereign independent republic. The name of the state is “Ireland”; the official description is the “Republic of Ireland”. You generally refer to the state as “Ireland” unless you particularly want to distinguish the state from the geographical entity called Ireland, which is the whole island.

The bulk of political violence happens in Northern Ireland, but some does happen in the Republic (bank robberies to finance political movements, or disputes between various republican movements, for example). Levels of violence are much, much lower than they were a few years ago.

**What are the laws like in Ireland (the south)? What are a person’s rights like compared to the US? Do you have the same freedom of speech? Right to bare arms? What about educational rights? Can I continue to homeschool? **

Ireland is a democracy in which the rule of law generally prevails and human rights are reasonably well-protected. Freedom of speech is not quite as wide as in the United States – there are stricter laws on obscenity, for example, but you can express any cultural, political or religious opinion you like (except racial hatred). Firearms are very strictly regulated and, apart from shotguns, (legal) private ownership of firearms is rare. If you own any firearms other than a shotgun you will not be allowed to import them to Ireland. Yes, you can homeschool. You may not be as well-supported in doing that as you would be in at least some school districts in the United States. I don’t know how rigorously you will be inspected. Homeschooling is rare in Ireland, and I think pretty well unheard-of after elementary school age.

**A friend of mine has both United States and French citizenship. She tells me that technically, the US does not allow dual citizenship, but that no one seems to care. When she is in the US, she is American and cannot claim the rights of a French citizen. When she is in France, she is French and cannot claim the rights of an American. Is this about right? If we became Irish citizens, could we retain our American citizenship in this way? If we can’t, how difficult would it be to return to the US for visits to our family, etc.? **

Ireland has no restrictions on dual citizenship. If you have any problems, they will be from the US government, but I don’t think you will have any problems. If you become an Irish citizen then (as with your friend in France) when in Ireland you will be treated like any other Irish citizen; your US citizenship will count for nothing.

**What are adoption laws like in Ireland? I have wanted for some time to adopt my step-kids, but the laws in Texas make it difficult and expensive. Would it be easier in Ireland? (Their bio-mom still has rights to them, but I wouldn’t be surprised if she willingly gave those up. We just haven’t tried because I would have to adopt them right away, and we can’t afford it.) **

Adoption laws are strict and involve rigorous assessment of the adopter and his or her spouse. I frankly do not know where you would stand trying to adopt you stepchildren, but this is certainly not common in Ireland. At a minimum, you would require the consent of both their natural parents.

**My dh is a Unix SysAdmin. He has been looking for jobs in Ireland. The way he explains it to me, a company has to hire an Irish citizen first, and after that a citizen of an EU country. They can only hire Americans if neither of those are available. So what are his chances of getting a job based on wanting to become an Irish citizen? What are his chances of a company being willing/able to pay for us to move? **

And employer cannot discriminate between Irish and other EU citizens, so the Irish do not enjoy “first preference”. Your partner is, however, right in saying that an employer should only get a visa for him if they can demonstrate that they cannot find a suitably qualified and experienced EU national to fill the vacancy.

Having said that, this rule is not applied excessively strictly. Ireland seeks to encourage foreign investment and makes it relatively easy for employers to import staff to Ireland. Many of the IT multinationals have significant operations in Ireland and, if one of them were to want to hire him, it probably wouldn’t be difficult to organise the visa. The problem will be getting the job offer.

**Just exactly how cold is it in Ireland? How is it compared to central France? I spent a summer in the mountains in central France, and it was cool even in July. Warm enough in the day for the beach, but cool enough at night to need a shawl. Is Ireland like that? Is it really, really, really cold in the winter? **

The climate is mild and damp all the year round. The summers are not very hot; the winters are not very cold. It can rain at any time. In winter it will be warmer than central France, in summer cooler. The ocean is colder than anything you can possibly imagine, all year round.

**How do people in the south feel about the IRA? My husband is very supportive of them. Would that make us unpopular? **

In most circles it would make you very unpopular, yes. This is an extremely sensitive issue and, unless you really like being in a passionate argument with people who know a great deal more about the topic than you do, it would be wise to tread carefully here. If your husband’s understanding of the conflict in Ireland comes from the US media then it is certainly woefully inadequate.

**Is there anything else that an American moving to Ireland might be surprised to know? **

Income taxes are high, as are sales taxes, but there are next to no property taxes. Health insurance is much cheaper than in the US, but is generally not provided by employers. Land is expensive, with the result that roads are narrow, and houses and yards small. Most of the state schools have a religious or denominational affiliation, but politicians rarely invoke God in public. People enjoy arguing and, in a social context, will often adopt a position adverse to yours purely for the purpose of arguing with you; this is not considered to be hostile behaviour. The candidate who gets the most votes wins the election. :wink:

Lots of other things also, but if I tell you about them you won’t be surprised, will you? :wink:

I live online. We have a cable modem, and I keep in contact with my dh all day while he is at work. Is that feasible in Ireland?

Yes, but expensive. Broadband is not available. Cable internet is available in some areas, but is expensive. Dial-up is the usual home connection and, for prolonged usage it will be more expensive than you are used to – local calls are timed in Ireland.

Cable has just been cut to €20-30 a month which IMO isn’t that bad.

Most of your points have been covered but I’d definitely take UDS’s advice on the IRA thing. While many people hold nationalistic views(United Ireland) and people may romanticise people like Michael Collins, the Provisional IRA is a whole different ball game. We’re had 30 years(+100’s of conflict) of bombs, hatred, prejudice and fear on this Island and people are more and more sick and tired of it.

One big difference to the States is our pub culture. The pub and alcohol in general are way way more central to Irish life than in the US. Our attitude to drink is more lax than a lot of Americans. We do have problems related to drink no question but a lot of it is just accepted as normal. I know a lot of people who drink almost every night(4-6+ pints ) for example and do not consider them as having any problem whatsoever, other than the bastards having more money than me :wink:

Anahita and ruadh could give a US perspective on Ireland but get ruadh quick and she’s becoming more Irish that the Irish :wink:
I’d try a holiday over here first BTW

what everyone else said.

your kids might have to learn irish, even if you homeschool.

people here dress differently to the states, subtley so, but still differently. get to love men in boot-cut cords and boat shoes.

veggies, milk, bread and staples are cheaper than processed food, it’s more cost effective to make things from scratch. you can probably budget 20 to 30 euros per person for a week’s groceries.

you will need to heat your home all year, and although it doesn’t often freeze or snow the windchill and rain can make life miserable. expect to spend a large portion of your household budget on oil, coal or gas (which is not the same as petrol).

irish homes do not have air con. we open windows.

try the Guinness, it’s a different animal to the sludge in the US.

irish people read, go to the theatre and cinema and are more cultured than you might think.

learn to decipher and differentiate between cork, galway, kerry and limerick accents.

pubs are smoky, and it’s fine to bring kids into the nicer ones (lounges) during the day.

irish people only see doctors when they’re ill, rarely admit to emotional problems, and don’t see shrinks unless they’re forced to. suggesting counselling won’t usually go down well.

in the winter we have only 8 hours of sunlight.

things that would mortally offend many americans are laughed off by the average irish person. you’ll all need to grow thick skins.

Like what, just out of curiousity?

mmm…

One other thing.

I don’t know what size your house is in Texas, but I could almost assure you that whatever you sell it for will struggle to buy you one half the size in Ireland. Land & house prices are pretty steep.

For a standard house think approx. $150 / Sq Ft to buy a new-build house. So you would perhaps have to get used to living in a much smaller space.
(I know I am making assumptions here about your lifestyle in the US, but think generally)

I am apparently an idiot. My husband read this thread, and I totally misunderstood the whole Ireland political situation, and his views of it, etc. He wants me to let y’all know that he does NOT support the IRA. I thought he did, because he listens to this music about them, but apparently the songs were all written like 80 years ago. Thank you, and thanks to him, for enlightening me a little bit about what the modern IRA is. Sorry for being an idiot.

Also, thank you for the rest of the information you provided, especially about immigration laws, etc. Very helpful!

Cessandra: You mentioned that the children’s biological mother still “has rights to them.” IIRC, that alone can put a stopper to relocating out of the country unless she gives consent to such a move for the children.

She will, Monty. She’s moving to Germany to live with her other kid’s dad.