Good Lord, Meeko, why would you think Kelly has any less chance of being scum in this game?
He has the same chance anyone else did and is equally eligible to be scum.
If this is the only game that I am pinging NAF in, then it would stand to reason that I am doing something differently.
Doing something differently doesn’t wash with being predictable.
It does speak to my predictability - inversely.
If this is the only game you’re pinging NAF in, couldn’t it just as easily be construed in the opposite manner? That is, it’s not complimentary because you’re pinging NAF because you genuinely are scum? OK, OK, I know, this is where you cite that for you it’s a compliment because you know you’re town and thus it must mean you’re doing something right by not playing as a townie, or whatever. I’m just saying that’s not really how it comes across to me is all.
No, your subsequent post, after 11 other claims, WAS a claim. The youtube clip was not a claim. In no way did it look like a claim. Taken by itself, it was not a claim. When combined with your actual claim, then yes, there’s a claim in there.
But if you combine your claim with any other post by any player or non-player, or even if you combine your claim with a jar of stale salsa, it is a claim. Is that what you are saying?
OK, peeker, I think I get it.
You’re saying the video was a breadcrumb and then your claim exposed the breadcrumb.
That I can get on board with.
Of course, why would you feel the need to breadcrumb your name claim?
Goodness, I’m so hesitant to vote for you because it seems like I always vote for you, but then, you always act so odd on Day 1. But right now, you’re my most suspect player.
storyteller (0): [del]peekercpa 116 201[/del]
peekercpa (4): [del]Zeriel 151 190[/del], [del]TexCat 314 356[/del], Chronos 360, Meeko 383, Freudian Slit 478, Mahaloth 482
NAF1138 (0): [del]One And Only Wanderers 179 288[/del], [del]KellyCriterion 242 244[/del]
One And Only Wanderers (0): [del]Chronos 180 360[/del], [del]Jimmy Chitwood 184[/del], [del]Meeko 220 291[/del]
Mahaloth (0): [del]Meeko 291 298[/del]
KellyCriterion (2): NAF1138 313, Jimmy Chitwood 484
TexCat (2): Red Skeezix 316, Tom Scud 328, [del]peekercpa 346 450[/del]
Oredigger77 (1): Drain Bead 347
Red Skeezix (1): TexCat 356, [del]Freudian Slit 364 478[/del]
Chronos (2): storyteller0910 416, peekercpa 450
A little less than a Day to go. I need to put a vote up soon because I won’t have much time tomorrow – only about an hour after I get home. I also need to go through the Day again before voting; I usually need to read everything twice to make sense of things, and so far I haven’t started Second Read.
So I’m off to do that.
Back soon.
For what it’s worth Kelly had fairly low activity in the last game, too. This is at least partly caused by time zone issues: IIRC he’s in the British Isles. Of course, last game, he was Scum, so maybe he just lays low when he’s Scum: Insufficient data, as of yet. On the matter of him jumping onto and then off of the NAF case so quickly, that looked to me like an overeager (relative) newbie who wasn’t paying as close attention as he should have on the first read, and then realizing his error. It’s not commendable, but it seems fairly consistent with either Town or Scum, and I certainly don’t think it’s the Scummiest thing toDay.
Quoth Freudian Slit:
I think he said that he’s played face-to-face before, but that Cecil Pond was his first online game. The formats are different enough that I would feel comfortable calling him a newbie on that basis. Still, I’d rather have it from the horse’s mouth: KellyCriterion, how much experience do you actually have?
I hope I am clear enough to be understood here. I had another brain melt moment somewhere in the middle. The longer I sat with this post, the more and more pinged I got by Jimmy.
I do find it interesting, that no two Mafia jobs are the same, yet the game demands the use of past expereience. Seems like all of my experience is just going fttttttttp for this game.
Jimmy, I think I got to all of your points, and they read fine by me, Hopefully I covered everything, one way or another. I might have things a bit out of place. – A LOT of revisions on this one. I wasn’t timing, but, this one took me a while.
Seems like my Outline kinda shatters upon my “hour long” posts.
Drain slipped because she was a Mason. She was not scum. But she slipped. Different Roles allow for different types of slip. If the slip is on PIS, and PIS is perfect information, you can only slip based on the PIS you know. Scum of different roles could slip on different PIS.
In my experience, past games have averaged four scum. One Goon is nearly a given. An alpha and a role blocker, sure. A Cop or Doc? Not out of the question.
I don’t see how scum as a team can work, or what the balance would look like, if scum can have multiple goons.
You’re talking about OaOW’s vote as if he should have made a distinction between a vanilla scum and a power role scum. Why is that relevant to what actually happened, which was that he saw a typo, voted on it, and then realized there was another typo and unvoted?
NO, I’m Not.
Is this the Third or Fourth time at this?
I am asking OaOW to make a distinction in his vote. FULL STOP. I am not saying he has to distinguish between goon and power scum. [I wonder how Town could do that.]
It is because there was no distinction, of ANY kind, that I got on OaOW’s case.
If you can’t make a distinction with your vote – if you can’t marry your vote for a player EXCLUSIVELY to a unique list of reasons to vote for that player, you probably should not vote for that player.
Thus, the vote was not Justified at all. [[Why did you want me to say that an OaOW vote on NAF Was justified? Why are you trying to smudge?]]
OaOW’s vote on NAF could have been transferred to me 100%.
The fact that there wasn’t a vote on me doesn’t change anything.
A product is still defective, even if it doesn’t hurt anyone.
[Sorry, I only took one semester of Law, and it was Business Law at that, hopefully someone knows what I’m talking about.]
I believe that most [if not all] Mafia games would not have two scum acting in an identical manner. Therefore, you shouldn’t use the “same” vote over multiple players. Since Scum CAN’T [Note I said CAN’T and not WON’T] play that identical to each other, it is probably a good bet at least one of the two players is town.
If you believe that you can spread the same vote (and reasons) over more than one person, then you are probably looking at two players with the same alignment and role. And, I believe at that point, you are looking at Two town players, who both happen to be mason or both happen to be vanilla. [Dare I speak of Odds and probability, but I would put money down on the latter.]
You guys know what I mean to say here, I just put another definition on to “weak vote”.
So, because one vote can’t be transfered to another player you need to look for additional or Unique reasons if you want to change a vote.
So, If town needs Unique reasons to vote on additional scum, where would those reasons come from ?
Different scum roles would have different slips. See Drain as Mason, in my opener. Hence, voting for them SHOULD use these bring these slips in as reasons for voting them.
There is no way a town player can know what role they are voting for when they switch votes. I am just saying their would be, different reasons to vote different people. Those reasons, for any given player should appear in a post where you make a vote for that same given player.
Mafia isn’t Baseball.
Thankfully, we don’t have to be Babe Ruth, and have a called shot when ever we vote.
**
Jimmy, how do suggest we would have called shots? How is that possible for town?**
Ok. So. Let me get this straight
- Meeko brain-farts and falls for Gambler’s fallacy. [Which, I was familiar with.]
- Everyone and their brother points it out.
**3. Therefore Kelly MUST be Scum. **
I KNOW it doesn’t work that way.
Gambler’s Fallacy states that one event has NO memory of past events. I don’t understand all the heat on me from merely suggesting Kelly is Town. I mean, you guys all cite examples of past events, that Kelly wasn’t even a player in. If my statement on Kelly was Gambler’s, then all the examples that came after it, also fall victim.
I find it interesting that my reason to not vote Kelly on Day 1 apparently means that I am Scum Protecting Scum. I said I would give him a Pass on Day 1. But no, apparently, any and all “protection” ((I’m not sure how much protecting I can do by simply stating that I wont vote for him on day 1.)) is scum motivation.
Or are you guys going to tell me that Town “protecting” Town never happens?
OR, does everyone except Meeko forget how historically bad Day 1 Votes are?
**
FOS Jimmy**
For having me rehash a entire discourse on a Vote that has been unvoted.
For suggesting that Town have “called shots” in their votes. I’m not sure that can ever happen.
holy crap. I read that twice and it just got worse.
Never mind.
Meeko, can you point out where exactly someone suggested that you were a cum protecting another Scum?
I don’t see it anywhere, and yet you brought it up in defense of yourself.
in fact, I think most people were only pointing out the fallacy of your thinking without accusing you of anything.
I put the FOS and Protecting together.
What should we make of our dead Mayor?
gotcha
I’m sorry, Meeko, but I don’t see much there to respond to. I didn’t say we could call our shots, in fact I said the opposite. My question was why you introduced the distinction between vanilla scum and power scum at all. It seems irrelevant to your ultimate point – one which you’re being very rude about, considering that I’ve manifested no misunderstanding of it. Sure, you should have exactly one reason to vote for a person if you vote for that person, and I take your point about how if it could be applied to you as well, it probably wasn’t likely to be a big scum tell. I get that. I promise you that you don’t have to explain that any further.
I’m asking what is the nexus between that point and your introducing this:
Because, see, as special ed just pointed out, nobody else, not OaOW in the post you were answering, ever suggested that there were two scum who made slips. He just saw what he thought was a slip, and then noticed that somebody else had the same thing going on, and unvoted. Nobody ever suggested that both were scum. Until you did in order to say it was not the case.
nothing
And just to point out that I’m referring to your post from before Freudian’s, and so the above doesn’t explain it.
Nothing.
ShadowFacts is dead (hi, old horse ;)). He has no part in the game. It’s just a standard bit of colour intended to convey the fact that the town is threatened by outside forces, who have started by trying to weaken the cohesion of the community by killing the perceived head man.
i am rubber and you are glue. whatever you say bounces off me and sticks on you.
i ain’t a real big fan of “breadcrumbs”. maybe more subtlety would be my style.
so if you see some inconsistency please share. it was a claim and the fact that you don’t want to admit it is really annoying. but that’s the way it swings. when i flip town then maybe other folks and yourself, depending on alignment, will realize that this was a humongous strawman.
yasee i’ll give you this ed we understand each other. in your mind i will always be a conninving little shit and i will always think the same of you. but yaknow what sometimes maybe stuff is as it appears and you could be flat ass wrong.
OK, peeker, this will be my last comment on this:
If this series of posts is equivalent to a name claim, then one of us needs some communication lessons. Because truly, I don’t see anything in any of these posts that indicates anything is a name claim. If you really don’t see it, then I sorta feel sorry for you.
especially when compared to the series of posts that led to my name claim:
oh, and just to add. i always liked shadow. he cracked my cherry, so to speak, when it comes to this game. we were a two person masonry in my first game ever. i think nook might have been there as well as another player. i swear he spent about 75 percent of his time smoothing over my screw ups. probably why he has never played again.