Can’t recall if I said this yet. If I have, take it as a reminder.
Good News : I have found a job* – Expect lower post counts from me here on out.
Bad News : It will take time away from Mafia**
*@Peeker, Skeezix,: This is a different job from the one I told Poker about. Unless something happens, I will be able to play tonight.
** If you guys say “Bad news?! Meeko is gonna post less? That’s GREAT news!” or something similar, OMGUS FOS on you preemptively. — I fully expect to still play***, and will not need a sub. I’ve let Sach know already.
*** Even if I joke, the truth oft said in jest. I would agree that I could stand to post less in Mafia games. Even if Colorless had my post count uncharacteristically low. Lynch the lurker doesn’t work, if you don’t work it.
but then why would i even bring it up? seriously, i could have argued about the wisdom of a name claim. hemmed and hawed for a bit and then ultimately did what i did anyways.
and frankly, everything that i have done subsequently makes the first post abudndantly clear. sorry, subtley apparantly doesn’t get much play in these parts.
and to be honest every time i have tried to bury the damn horse certain folks keep dragging the beast out and continue to beat the poor thing.
and i really don’t like this universal holier than thou anti town crap that people like to fling arbitrarily. you know what is anti town, voting freaking town. now that’s anti town.
so hopefully folks will be able to learn from this interlude and then get down to killing scum instead of folks whose viewpoint and approach is not congruent with theirs.
Look, the vote was for me, so I have as much reason to pay close attention to it as anyone. I categorically reject the idea that it was anti-Town. It was a joke, an obvious joke. peeker never presented it as anything other than a joking start to the game. How was it anti-Town? Did it lead others to follow his reasoning and vote for me? Was it likely to?
Do you consider all early-game joking to be anti-Town? Why?
And then you vote for Drain Bead for “fostering anti-Town behaviors?” That’s the biggest reach I’ve seen so far in this game. My vote currently holds on Chronos, but I am strongly inclined to switch it to you for this vote alone. Even if I accept your contention that a joke vote in the early game is an anti-Town behavior (and I don’t), and even if I accept your contention that Drain Bead somehow “fostered” that behavior by pointing out that it has not generally functioned as anti-Town in the past, even then:
Why vote for drain instead of peeker? From your perspective, supposedly, drain is encouraging anti-Town behavior, and you don’t “have anything better to go on.” But from your perspective, there really should be something better to go on, because if drain’s “encouragement” of a particular behavior is bad, surely actually engaging in that behavior should be worse, right? Why aren’t you voting for peek? Is it because you know it’s going to be a bad lynch and want to be distant from it?
You know what, on further consideration:
unvote Chronos
vote Zeriel
But I still want to make some observations about Chronos, which I will try to do today before the deadline.
On the peeker case, it’s true he could have been breadcrumbing his name claim until it was safe to claim the wicked witch. But wouldn’t it have been easier to just wait to completely to claim? That’s what’s holding me back on this case. (and on preview, he’s said as much)
On Meeko, yes it appears that he might be protecting Kelly, but if he truly believed in his gambler’s fallacy, he was just being silly, not Scummy.
On Kelly, the vote/unvote does appear suspicious as does the subsequent lurking.
One typical Day 1 conversation we haven’t had is on the potential Night 1 actions of a Vigilante. I’m not completely against a player using that power on Night 1 if it might provide additional data for the Town and/or remove a suspiciously low volume poster.
And now, on to my vote.
**Vote Drain Bead**
Do you really think this is why people are voting for peeker?
Why would you have paid so little attention to the arguments? I would think a Townie would pay better attention to the 'whys' of the arguments.
1. You seem to be setting up an 'I told you so"** case if peeker flips Town
2. Scum might know there is a case, but not be paying attention to it if they knew peeker was Town
[quote="Drain_Bead, post:552, topic:532942"]
FOS at everyone who brought up **peeker** voting **story** straight off as a reason to vote him.
He's done it in every game I've played with the two of them, and I think every time I've seen him do it, he's been Town. He's probably done it as Scum too, just not in any games I've been in. Point is, he does it in every game, so it's pretty much a null tell. At this point, I'd worry more if he *didn't* do it. And most of you have been in the same games, or watched them, and know this.
[/quote]
** Not, I used this argument against storyteller once and it started the original "debacle"
I have never liked joke votes in the first place. In the second place, nothing peeker does is EVER clearly a joke. In the third place, it took him getting called on it and almost a hundred posts to unvote you. When I was satisfied he was joking, I unvoted him (well before he unvoted you, mind you).
Why not vote for peeker? Because **Peeker **stopped his anti-town behavior and I’m willing to accept it was a joke (which wasn’t apparent when I voted peeker).
Why vote for Drain? Because, and I’ve done this since time immemorial, Drain used language that indicated she was doing one thing (smudging a group of people who voted **peeker **for his vote on you) when in reality she was doing something similar but markedly different (smudging me, and me alone.). You know how much I love it when people do that, it’s been one of MY longest-running mafia things (starting from when I nailed NAF with it in my first game) and it catches scum for me regularly. So you can vote for me about it, but it’s silly.
This is an interesting point. I had treated it as a throwaway line in your vote post - focusing on the thing about “fostering anti-Town behavior” - but it is in fact much more interesting and relevant.
Don’t know about any of you, but this is probably going to be my last post for the Day. I still like my vote for Kelly and would love it if he/she* would respond in some way, but even if he/she does I don’t think I am going to be able to do anything about it.
I would also like to point out that right now we are looking like we are going to lynch Peeker on a matter of principle, and I think that is a mistake. We also don’t seem like we have nearly enough votes on the table for this late in the Day. If I am counting correctly I think we have 6 people who don’t have a final vote down (let me know if I got that wrong). That’s way too many non voters with less than 3 hours to go in the Day.
*can I get some help on this one, I have seen it both ways in the thread
I went back and read the post, and I don’t see what you do at all. I basically agree with Drain, and I have no problem at all with joke votes early in day one, particularly when it is an obvious, recurring joke vote.
I do not see the smudge, i do not see the hidden agenda to target only you
Okay, I have a lot of work and lately my work browser has sometimes been weird about posting to the Dope, so I’m not sure if I’ll be able to come back at lunch at all. I don’t like the peeker lynch - the Chronos case feels like a stretch to me, and I think people are using it as an excuse more than a reason.
I still think TexCat looks the scummiest to me at the moment, but I’m going to shift my vote elsewhere because it doesn’t look like anything else is going to shift there, leaving my vote on a two-off.
I don’t know what to make of the Zeriel/Drain thing and I don’t have time to give it a proper consideration so I’m not going to throw my vote that way on an impulse.
So I’m going to shift to my second choice of long standing:
unvote TexCat vote Kelly
for a dubious vote/unvote and then disappearing. Could be noob town, could be noob scum, but I like the lynch better than a peeker lynch.
I agree that this is not a very good scene for the town collectively. Freaking vote.
Right this second it is a viable option for scum to do just about anything and skate on it – including not even voting. It wouldn’t be a big deal to mislynch today, but it would be a pretty big deal to mislynch based on a clusterfuck that most of us were complicit in and that, as it stands, may not even give us useful information.
With less than 2 hours, I see no votes from MHaye, Oredigger, Rysto, Kelly, Guiri, and now storyteller who just recently unvoted. (Hope I didn’t miss any votes. Please correct, if I did.)
I see the smudge and pointed it out (#553), Drain FOSed “everyone who brought up peeker voting Story straight off as a reason to vote him” but, when you look at the actual votes for Peeker (spoilered in my post) made by Texcat, Chronos, Meeko, Freudian Slit and Mahaloth, none of them mentioned the vote on Story in their reasoning, just Zeriel.
I don’t feel as strongly about this to vote Drain although I can see why Zeriel wanted to.
I’ll follow-up my earlier suspicions (#559) with a:
Vote Rysto
(for starting the discussion on the name claim, not actually taking part in the discussion (but posting), and then being almost the last player to actually claim. Weak but I’m more comfortable with this one-off vote than the alternatives).
I don’t like the fact that Kelly’s been absent for so long and is not around to defend himself but he may have rl stuff going on so I won’t vote him toDay.
I’m going to vote Freudian Slit. First, there’s this sequence of posts:
(bolding mine)
That “I do hope he unvotes” bit feels really, really off to me. I’m having a lot of trouble expressing exactly why it’s bothering me so much. A part of it is, if Freudian doesn’t think that OAOW’s vote was bad, then why does she hope that he unvotes?
This is another weird post. If peeker is the scummiest person, then why is Freudian voting for Red here?
I’m sorry for taking so long to vote. I’ll admit, all of the noise is really getting to me.
I didn’t think it was a great vote, but I honestly didn’t see it as a scum tell.
peeker seemed scummiest, but then I know that he always does.
I also wanted to add to my last post addressed to peeker that the reason you wouldn’t have just hemmed and hawed is because it would look a lot less suspicious than that weird video which, as Chronos pointed out, could go either way. It just looks like the perfect way for scum to try to “get away with” that kind of evil role.