Republicans Ban School Mask Mandates

[asahi]

Yeah, consider that, in the race between Georgia’s attempt to suppress voting and Congressional Democrats’ efforts to put a stop to the practice, Georgia crossed the finish line and the Democrats probably never will. And when you factor in redistricting next year - not to mention Biden’s sudden tanking in the polls - I think we can see where this is heading.

Back to the issue of mask mandates, that Republicans feel politically safe encouraging their own voters to engage in patently dangerous behavior says volumes. They wouldn’t do it if they felt that they had to court moderates; they clearly feel that there’s a greater danger in appealing to moderates and greater reward appealing to anti-science cultists. They will look at the polls, look at the demographic data, and they will draw their district maps late this year or early next. And if they draw their maps just right, it’s entirely possible that they may never have to worry about losing another election after that.

[Euphonious_Polemic]

@asahi

And if they draw their maps just right, it’s entirely possible that they may never have to worry about losing another election after that.

They don’t even have to draw the maps just right. With the influx of Republican partisans into the process of counting and certifying votes, they don’t even have to really worry.

Republicans have learned the lessons well:
It’s not about who gets the most votes. It’s about who counts the votes.
And if that doesn’t work, they can fall back on attacking state capitols. There seems to be very little consequences for that (apart from tossing a few foot soldiers into jail - and they’re just acceptable losses from a Republican point of view)

[asahi]

Yep, ProPublica has an informative article on this. It’s some pretty scary shit, and it’s not “doomsday” or “Chicken Little-ish”; this is really happening and it’s largely being overlooked by the MSM.

Heeding Steve Bannon’s Call, Election Deniers Organize to Seize Control of...

I think the American experiment is over and most people don’t realize it. What’s more, they don’t realize that you can’t just go back to the experiment once you’ve tossed it into the garbage disposal. This will fundamentally alter the United States of America forever. And it will fundamentally alter liberal democracy as well.

[running_coach]

@Temporary_Name

I will readily admit that his credentials are sketchy, but it is unfair to say he simply deemed himself to be a doctor. He has training, graduated and was board certified by the actual sanctioning board before he started his own board. It is further obvious that he has no training or understanding of immunology above the most basic facts taught in sixth grade, but he does seem to be a doctor of some competence.-

Then why did he need to start his own board? Why does he need to be certified in something he has no training in?

[needscoffee]

From Wikipedia:

In 1995, Paul was certified to practice by the American Board of Ophthalmology (ABO).[27] Three years earlier, the ABO had changed its certification program, which previously awarded lifetime certifications, and required ophthalmologists to recertify every 10 years, while those who had already been given lifetime certification were not required to recertify. Paul felt this was unfair and began an aggressive campaign to have all ophthalmologists recertify every ten years. In 1997 he set up the National Board of Ophthalmology (NBO) to offer an alternative certification system, at a cost substantially lower than that of the ABO.[28][29][30] Its certification exam, which Paul completed for his own certification, was an open book take-home test that Paul helped write.[28] Paul appointed exclusively his own family members to the board of directors and registered the Board to an incorrect address.[28]

Named board members were Paul, his wife, and his father-in-law.[31] His father-in-law, the board’s nominal secretary, stated “I never did go to any meetings … There was really nothing involved. It was more just a title than anything else, for me”.[28] The NBO was, itself, never accepted as an accrediting entity by organizations such as the American Board of Medical Specialties,[21] and its certification was considered invalid by many hospitals and insurance companies. Paul let his own ABO certification lapse in 2005, which did not affect his practice in Kentucky; the state does not require board certification. By Paul’s estimate, about 50 or 60 doctors were certified by the NBO.[28] The NBO was incorporated in 1999, but Paul allowed it to be dissolved in 2000 when he did not file the required paperwork with the Kentucky Secretary of State’s office. He later recreated the board in 2005, but it was again dissolved in 2011.[32]

[Temporary_Name]

@running_coach

Then why did he need to start his own board? Why does he need to be certified in something he has no training in?

According to Wiki, because the original sanctioning board changed the system so those who had qualified before were grandfathered into a system where they never had to recertify while new applicants had to recertify at substantial personal cost every ten years. That struck the good doctor as unfair so he started his own board with an open book test he wrote himself. As I said above, it is quite sketchy and incestuous, but by the few accounts I have read it was because of money not because of competence.

Wiki is not exactly the gold standard of information, but the other sources I read said essentially the same thing, here is the text:

In 1995, Paul was certified to practice by the American Board of Ophthalmology (ABO).[27] Three years earlier, the ABO had changed its certification program, which previously awarded lifetime certifications, and required ophthalmologists to recertify every 10 years, while those who had already been given lifetime certification were not required to recertify. Paul felt this was unfair and began an aggressive campaign to have all ophthalmologists recertify every ten years. In 1997 he set up the National Board of Ophthalmology (NBO) to offer an alternative certification system, at a cost substantially lower than that of the ABO.[28][29][30] Its certification exam, which Paul completed for his own certification, was an open book take-home test that Paul helped write.[28] Paul appointed exclusively his own family members to the board of directors and registered the Board to an incorrect address.[28]

No one anywhere that I read denied that he graduated from Duke University School of Medicine. I also read that he did pass the previously existing board (the American Board of Ophthalmology or ABO) but was pissed about having to recertify every ten years at personal expense while older members were not required to recertify. When he was not able to effect those who were grandfathered in, he started his own board (the National Board of Ophthalmology or NBO). As I readily admit, it seems sketch and wholly insubstantial.

To summarize, he DOES have training, he graduated from a genuine medical school. According to what I have seen, he was sanctioned through the original ABO before throwing a temper tantrum, quitting, and then launching his own organization (the NBO). I assume as a doctor, he also holds some sort of license to practice issued by the state. (And I am pretty damn sure he does not get to have input into his own state licensing – that would be up to the state itself despite his role in the federal government.)

Listen, no one dislikes Rand Paul more than I do. But as bad as he may be at it, he is a real doctor with a real degree from a real medical school. It seems he passed the “real” certification exam before he created his dodgy board with its open book, take home test that anyone of us could pass without any training.

Now, I happen to believe he is completely full of shit and is trying desperately to discredit Fauci for purely personal or political reasons. But saying he is not a real doctor just makes us look as stupid and partisan as the other side. Show me some authoritative source that says he never graduated from Duke Medical, or that he does not hold (and has never held) a license to practice medicine and I will dance under a full moon with you over it. But don’t believe something just because you want it to be true. If I did that I would still be a Republican like all my family and neighbors and I would be as wrong as they are.

Now I am sorry for this distraction, it has little to do with mask mandates but it does demonstrate just how dysfunctional the Republican Party is on this issue (and dozens of others too). It is mostly because they are:

1. A personality cult
2. Far, far too committed to an ideology (and one that defies any logic I can detect)
3. Completely devoid of decency or humanity or sense of statesmanship or even fairness
4. Obsessed with destroying the opposition with a profound fear of their ideas,
5. Convinced they are the army of (the One True) God doing divine work, and lastly
6. Incapable of reasonable thought (or real life, or real life consequences – reality I guess)

[Temporary_Name]

@needscoffee

Paul let his own ABO certification lapse in 2005, which did not affect his practice in Kentucky; the state does not require board certification.

Thank you needscoffee, I was perhaps a bit too verbose and you beat me to the punch.

He obviously WAS certified by the (genuine) ABO if he let the certification lapse as quoted above. The other certification from his own NBO never meant Jack Squat to anyone who mattered and the organization does not seem to exist at all anymore as it has been twice dissolved.

No matter how low an opinion we may hold of the man- he is a real doctor. Why are we arguing this among ourselves?

(Unrelated Note: Pennsylvania does not seem to require board certification either, but they DO require a license to practice medicine as I am sure all states do. I happen to know this because my cousin is a board certified surgeon in northwest PA, and it is not difficult to get him to admit it.)

[Kimstu]

@BigT

If you actually had some way that you thought just being nice would somehow win, I might listen.

If you seriously believe that the strategy and attitude I recommend for Democrats is nothing more than “just being nice”, then obviously you aren’t listening to me and there’s no way I can get you to listen.

[BigT]

@Kimstu

@BigT

If you actually had some way that you thought just being nice would somehow win, I might listen.

If you seriously believe that the strategy and attitude I recommend for Democrats is nothing more than “just being nice”, then obviously you aren’t listening to me and there’s no way I can get you to listen.

It appears that I have offended you, and, for that, I am genuinely sorry.

However, I do not believe this is a fair way to argue. I said a lot more than just that one line. In order to argue against what you said, I had to listen to you. Sure, maybe I misunderstood, but that’s not the same thing as not listening.

I actually had hoped that I had misunderstood, and you would tell me that at least some of the tactics I proposed were in fact valid, and we would establish where the line is of being too aggressive.

Hence why I was very disappointed with the Lincoln argument. Not only was it snark, but it seemed poorly thought out. When the Confederates attacked US property and put US lives at risk, Lincoln went to war. He suspended habeas corpus for the sympathizers. He actually dabbled into authoritarianism.

So he seems a very poor example for the point you were making.

[Kimstu]

@BigT

It appears that I have offended you

Not in the least, so don’t worry about it. But if you could read everything I posted and still only come up with that repeated word “nice” as your characterization of the approach I was recommending, then we are obviously just talking past each other.

If you don’t perceive any middle ground between “hypermasculine messaging” and “just being nice”, then naturally you’re not getting my point and are not going to agree with my position.

[MandaJo]

Here’s my deal. Whenever I hear “the Democratic party needs to get tough and gritty and realistic”, I strongly suspect that the next play is going to accept the “political reality” of needing to drop women’s issues or minority issues. Like, “we can’t take an L right now, and we need to recognize lots of independent voters have a bias, so Kamela Harris needs to step aside for Some White Dude” and things of that nature.

[SenorBeef]

Sure, we had to endure Donald Trump and the complete radicalization of our political right that will eventually lead to a million or more COVID deaths as well as a fascist takeover of our country, but we did get the first female presidential candidate, and obviously the feel goods we got from that are way more important.

[Max_S]

@Max_S

Arizona

• Ariz. Sess. Laws Ch. 404, § 12 (June 30, 2021)
• According to Maricopa County Judge Randall Warner, new state laws become effective 90 days after the end of the legislative session, in this case September 29. Therefore he denied a biology teacher’s request to strike down Phoenix Union High School District’s mask mandate.
• On August 17, Governor Ducey announced $163 million in federal funds will be made available as grants to Arizona schools that “follow all laws” (read: do not have mask mandates).
• On August 18, President Biden issued a memo to Secretary of Education Miguel Cardona to crack down on such shenanigans involving federal money.

Does anyone want to comment on the situation in Arizona? Governer Ducey seems to be getting pushback from all fronts. Republicans are really sore with him for pandemic restrictions from back in January, and also his refusal to contest the 2020 presidential election. Democrats are obviously peeved with his handling of school mask mandates and the present surge.

Note that Gov. Ducey terms out next year, but has said he will not run against Senator Kelly (D-AZ) next year.

~Max