Revolution? Civil War? What's going to happen to the US?

If you don’t like foreigners criticizing Trump, stop Trump criticizing foreigners.
Same goes for Obama.

Exccept they do. Notice 24/7 riots in Califnrornia because liberals asre terrified that Trump has red pilled the masses? You’re right, it won’t be 400, it will be 538 electoral vote landslide.

I too agree that a somewhat flexible “fiscal decade” is inherently superior to the actual numerical decade.

And it is true for what we call “the fifties” and “the seventies” too.

Personally I have felt the sixties ended with the resignation of Nixon in 1974. Coincidentally perhaps but that is also the year of the first disco recording to hit #1 on the charts in the UK and US. The sixties were definitely over! :eek:

You have a cite for those 24/7 riots? I’m traveling out there for a wedding in a couple months and want to avoid the carnage, if possible.

I can’t wait to see a Ken Burns style PBS documentary on such a war:
“Dearest Abigail, It is uncharacteristicly warm here in Northern California, as has been the trend since President Trump abolished the Envir”
7 minute ago

“onmental Protection Agency in '18. A melancholy has fallen over the camp as our regiment has failed to make any headway penetrating the Pal”
6 minute ago

“o Alto Free Bubble Zone and supplies have been in short supply as much of our equipment is oursourced to China. More concerning is word tha”
5 minute ago

“t we are to face the 99th Massachusetts, the first all-inclusive infantry regiment, in glorious battle in the morning. It is rumored that t”
5 minute ago

“he men, women and…miscellaneous of the 99th have all achieved the rank of general, and each has received the Congressional Medal of Partic”
4 minute ago

“ipation. But do not be fearful, as by God’s will we will be victorious in pwning the rebels and uniting our divided nation. Please do not”
2 minute ago

“forget to like my battle footage on YouTube tomorrow. Your dearest love, Jedidiah. #civilwar2_0
1 minute ago

Trump is the king of distractions - fight chaos with more chaos.

Obviously he needs the ultimate political distraction, a war, with North Korea the most likely target.

The question is: will the citizens allow it one more time? And what form will it take - just a missile exchange, or US troops landing at Inchon?

It always works. The citizens back the President in time of war. Never underestimate the intelligence of the American people, (Mencken paraphrased).


That is awesome.

I guess those things must not be happening, because Trump isn’t becoming more popular.

This is almost impossible to prove or disprove.

I’d argue that what he is becoming is more beloved by some and more reviled by others. The headcount(s) may not be moving very much one way or another; I don’t know of good data. But I believe the oil and water are separating ever more rapidly and with ever greater vehemence.

At no small risk to the Republic.

A truly interesting phenomenon is that Trump may in fact be the first third party President. He’s obviously no Democrat. Neither is he exactly a Republican although he’s got some common cause with both the fat-cat wing and with the alt-wacko wing of the Republicans. But the “mainstream” Rs are much the biggest faction in their party.

So at least as to relations with Congress this resembles a third party victory. Not that Trump has, or will create, an actual factual party around him. But just in terms of the working relationship with Congress which will be more adversarial with both sides rather than aligned with one.

Right about now.

A little over 3 years would have been the correct guess :cry:.

If the American people will elect someone who’s an actual leader for president as opposed to someone starring in his own “reality” show, many issues will simmer down, IMHO.

If the U.S. has a second civil war, it will not be a neat sectional conflict like the first one. It will be like the English Civil War, where one side controls one town and the other side controls the next one over – and that’s assuming it does not descend to the neighborhood level, which it would.

Of course, no one can stand against the U.S. armed forces. So the only way a civil war can happen is if the armed forces themselves divide.

Bumping this old thread in light of this last week.

So some have taken up arms against the government. A third of the country still lives in a version of reality in which Trump did not both pour the gasoline and throw the match. Some not insignificant number believe that the cause is just. Some of them are in law enforcement and the military, enough that the heads of the military felt the need to explicitly remind the troops of their duty to the Constitution. Some of those groups and veterans thereof participated in the uprising. Some active duty members may have helped prevent a more adequate preparation for the attack and where to go to best find targets. Some Representatives may have helped the attack as well inclusive of one live-streaming where Pelosi had been taken. To some degree the armed forces are divided. A leader explicitly calling on those in those forces to act against the government and some following that call is not so unimaginable right now. Again some apparently have behind the scenes already.

I do NOT believe we are on the brink of Civil War or that this is one. I do think those who have declared our democracy dead or at least in the ICU overstate the situation. But damn. We are at much greater risk to that existential threat than I ever would have thought possible.

Sadly, yeah, the USA is in really serious trouble. I am not sure what the path back to a common social contract is, but BobLibDem was right. When you have 33%+ plus of the country that just openly lives in a world of fantasy and is contemptuous of democracy, that isn’t an issue that just goes away overnight.

You may be more on the brink of civil war than you think. I don’t KNOW that you are, but the division of the American people is the first and biggest step to that, and that step has been taken.

The election of Joe Biden isn’t a fix. It’s better than Trump being elected, but remember the first American Civil War? The spark that finally lit that waiting inferno was the election of Abraham Lincoln. The slavers wouldn’t accept that. Well, the Trumpists won’t accept the election of Joe Biden.

Most likely if Trump does not try to run for elections in the future there will be other people like Trump that believes in Trump view but more skilled like to carry it out and not mess up but more elite like.

Trump just allowed everyone out of the closest be it boomers that miss the 50s and 60s to the white supremacist to the strong religious folks.

And none of the other Conservative party did that not even Bush.

The first rule of creating a solution to a problem is: Define the Problem.

It is evident that we have failed to define the problem because we refer to Trumpists as a bunch of crazies. But, one half of the voting population is not just a bunch of crazies.

So, what do the Trumpists believe is in their best interests? What does that half of the voting population want “to happen to the US?”.

I agree with your general point here but … cite please? :slight_smile:

More seriously though - some significant fraction of them are., and that fraction overlaps a lot with his hardcore support.

What many of them want to happen is simply incompatible with what the rest of us want. IMHO. They want their relative position in the pecking order of America to be with them on, or at least near, top. I think the relative order matters more than anything else. They can be pushed down so long as “others” are pushed down farther than they are. The want to believe that their problems are the fault of some easily recognizable other. They want their beliefs to be the dominant unquestioned American beliefs and their cultural habits and norms to be the American norm, generously tolerant of other beliefs up to very defined points. They hold as truth beliefs that are just plain clearly incontrovertibly false but will not be shaken from them. Efforts to do so only solidify their positions.

That cohort is not all of those who vote for and persistently approve of Trump, but it is the solid floor of his support. They identify as a tribe beset upon by a threat of many others which has been being beaten down for years and years with what has been theirs taken away from them. They feel it has been unfair somehow.

There are others who I believe are just perceiving themselves as being left behind, as dropping down, who have not heard a clear message that they matter to the rest of us (maybe hearing themselves portrayed as unfairly privileged with whiteness), and who heard Trump as caring not only about them too but about them first - and that appealed.

I do not believe it is about positions on issues for what they think is in their best interests so much as it a sense of being valued as they who matter most vs as they who are not really thought about much other than as people to look down on.

But just IMHO.