Depends. Is GOA actually influential? Has it hijacked our ability to discuss any gun restrictions to try and stop mass shootings?
That’s why I hate the NRA–its effects that make it hard to try and make America safer. I actually am fairly moderate on the gun rights issue, just wanting to try and create a balance between the gun owners rights and public safety.
I mean, I don’t even live inside a town. I know how guns can be useful (even if I’ve never had reason to use one–oddly not even when getting my hunting license as part of a Boy Scout-like group run by my church.)
No! You cannot question the NRA! Even if they come to my house and steal all my money to buy golden toilets for themselves, I know they will leave my guns behind, and I thank them for it. Never question them! NRA4EVA
As I understand it, that’s generally why Chapter 11, called the “reorganization bankruptcy”, is filed, to fix a debt situation.
People often associate Chapter 11 with financial distress because usually a business does it when it’s desperate. It’s very expensive to do, and extremely complex, so most of the time it’s only done when an entity is in trouble. You also lose some of your autonomy in regards to your business as it is ongoing, and the process is designed to mainly benefit the creditors, not the entity with debt. You often hear about a business that dissolves or gets bought out at the conclusion of bankruptcy, but that doesn’t always happen. For the most part, you really don’t want to file this if you don’t have to.
So it does seem odd for them to file when they are reportedly doing well financially, but though unusual it’s not illegal.
If I can use a sports metaphor, it’s like punting on first down when playing gridiron football. There are no rules against doing it but you never see it done because it’s a terrible strategy and coaches are smarter than that.
Yes, it has. Our discussions are utterly pointless because nothing can happen.
And, yes, there are many issues with guns, but the fact that not even mass shootings that affect children or churches are enough to get them to consider any sort of solution is a significant problem.
Oh, and, yes, there is every reason to completely dissolve a corrupt organization, if you suspect the corruption at the top began as corruption at the bottom. Plus, well, the fact they stated the maximum punishment is not a reason to assume that punishment will be enacted. It would only be enacted if necessary.
The fact they’re trying to escape suggests to me they think that it will be necessary–that the corruption the AG find will be that deep. They even admit that they’re doing it to avoid disincorporation.
They’re only making themselves look more guilty. It’s like a criminal saying that “they’re mentioned a possible death penalty, so I’m running away to somewhere that doesn’t have the death penalty!”
What I’m wondering about is whether it’s legal to try and reincorporate to avoid prosecution. And whether the state could just say they aren’t eligible for bankruptcy and the disincorporation portion of reincorporation until the legal situation is resolved.
They took their sweet time getting there. If LaPierre & Co. had any sense they’d have changed place of incorporation decades ago.
Hey, if the NRA brand becomes crippled to the point of creating a vacuum…
As of now the folks who feel the NRA is too willing to play along with the faction in power have the problem of being fragmented and not having real presence among the big political bosses. So their challenge is for some group (be it GOA or another) to emerge as the “consensus” 2-A Purist standardbearer and be willing to play some politics w/o ticking off the hardliner base.
Why wouldn’t it be legal? It’s not illegal to wear a pink tutu to avoid prosecution either. It won’t do them a damn bit of good. Going bankrupt won’t help them in the slightest. It only helps with debts and some civil lawsuits.
Why can’t anything happen? I mean, yes, now with Moscow Mitch being dictator, nothing can happen that doesnt make him happy.
The NRA is small potatoes as a lobby. Last time I looked it, along with the gun industry , wasnt even in the top 100. Certainly not in the top 20
The NRA has very little to do with few gun laws. The real fact is- Americans dont want strict gun laws. There are around 70 Million adult voting gun owners in the USA.
Nopw yes, American want “stricter” gun laws, like tighter background checks, etc. But those, by and large- would have no effect on mass shootings.
But the # who want something strict like a handgun ban is like 25%. And in any case, that is totally unconstitutional.
Your link says the AG is charging them with the failure to follow numerous state and federal laws. That’s a criminal prosecution, specifically fraud, because fraud is a crime believe it or not.
How would bankruptcy help them avoid that? I’m curious. I’m not a legal expert so somebody please correct me.
If they are guilty of fraud I don’t think that goes away because they move. They would be out of reach from the NY AG of course, but if they violated federal laws that’s some heavy baggage to carry into Texas. I don’t think a bankruptcy lets them get away clean here. But I guess we’ll see.
I am trying to be patient here, but - there is a difference between CIVIL fraud (what the AG is alleging) and CRIMINAL fraud. No CRIMINAL fraud is charged. Nor can the AG of New York STATE charge violations of Federal laws.
What the NRA is doing is 100% legal. Now, will the judge let them do it?
Is it moral/ethical in your eyes? If they succeed in their attempt to shut down investigation and possible prosecution by this move would all be right as far as you are concerned?
Attorney General James alleges in her complaint that the NRA violated multiple laws, including the laws governing the NRA’s charitable status, false reporting on annual filings with the IRS and with the OAG’s Charities Bureau, improper expense documentation, improper wage reporting, improper income tax withholding, failure to make required excise tax reporting and payments, payments in excess of reasonable compensation to disqualified persons, and waste of NRA assets; in direct violation of New York’s Estates, Powers & Trusts Laws; New York’s Not-for-Profit Corporation Law; the New York Prudent Management of Institutional Funds Act; and New York’s Executive Law. The illegal nature of the four individual defendants’ action also violated multiple rules of the NRA’s bylaws, the NRA’s employee handbook, and the NRA’s policy manual.
The failure of the NRA to comply with multiple fiduciary responsibilities and state and federal laws resulted in the NRA seeing substantial losses on its balance sheet: going from a surplus of $27,802,714 in 2015 to a net deficit of $36,276,779 in 2018 — contributing to a total loss of more than $64 million in just three years.
So if this is true and they’ve made false reports to the IRS for years, moving to Texas and filing bankruptcy shouldn’t make them immune to future charges. I know at this point the federal government hasn’t gone after them but I wouldn’t be surprised if it does during the Biden years.
I also expect that at least the individuals in the lawsuit won’t be protected. I may be wrong but I think they’re still vulnerable here. The NRA itself may not be, especially because the suit is basically seeking to stop them from operating in NY and they are choosing to do that on their own.
Moral? Ethical? Both sides are playing politics here and there seems little doubt that some members of Senior NRA leadership were doing some improper things- for which they can be individually investigated.
But never has such a large, long standing national org ever been shut down like this. Should you penalize five million members for the actions of a couple guys?
Nor is this gonna “shut down investigation” it will just keep the NRA as a Org incorporated… in a different state.
I see no indications of any criminal prosecutions on file. If you can find some, I would like to see them.
The AG of NY has absolutely no authority or purview whatsoever over Federal issues and in fact it I find it rather unethical for her to bring up allegations of which she can not possible have any evidence , since the IRS will not disclose anything to her. If they had made false reports to the IRS, only the IRS would know, not the AG of a STATE, unless the IRS has publically made those charges known- which they have rather strict laws against doing, unless criminal charges are filed. It is true that the bare boen of a non-profits tax return is publicly available info, however.
Yes, the basic of her LAWSUIT is the the NRA has committed several CIVIL violations. Has she filed any criminal charges? Please cite them.
