What exactly is the Roman Catholic Church’s view of the female orgasm? I know they think any part of sex (condoms, “French ticklers”, etc.) that don’t strictly have to do with the procreation of children is forbidden. Does that include the female orgasm? I mean, it isn’t necessary to produce children. But it is “natural” (another common Catholic term and argument).
BTW, I’ve had 12 years of RC schooling. And, yes, I can honestly say in all that time the discussion of the female orgasm never came up. We talked of sex. But never that. So I am going to have to rely on you people to tell me;).
:):)
[Jim B.]
(The bracketed info is in case Cecil answers my question. The rest of you on the message board just disregard them.)
(I also made a grammatical error [before I got in the Edit window of time]. It should be “…any part of sex (condoms, “French ticklers”, etc.) that doesn’t strictly have to do with the procreation of children…”.)
I thought the Church’s disapproval was as to separating the sexual act from the possibility of procreation. Thus no artificial birth control (sex without procreation) or IVF (procreation without sex).
As long as both are present, I’m not sure there’s any proscription on adding extra features.
From what I was always told; it’s OK as long as mommy and daddy love each other and are married (not sure if love is actually required); women are supposed to desire and be aroused by their spouse for the purpose of wanting to do it so that they can procreate. Outside of the marriage/procreation relationship it is a sinful for a woman to bring herself to an orgasm; she needs to do an appropriate amount of Hail Mary’s (as determined by a virgin male priest) until the desire subsides. In other words, it’s f#@ked up. At least the version that I’ve been told is. Perhaps a practicing catholic willl come along and show me the errors in my understanding.
A search of female orgasm on the Vatican’s website only turned up one article:
It discusses orgasm in the context of celibacy - it makes mention of female orgasm without any mention of a need to avoid it, even mentioning it’s role in increasing the likelihood of fertilization:
Of course, the discussion moves towards the “problems” with having sex for the sake of sex, but it makes no mention of condemnation of the orgasm itself. Of course, this isn’t Catholic dogma because the author isn’t the church, but anything maintained on the Vatican’s site can be assumed to be mostly in line with what the Church accepts.
It also takes off the table “unnatural” sex acts (oral, anal); and I suppose that in strict interpretation, many fetishes will be frowned upon. But yes, as far as they have said anything about it they do not seem to have a problem with the wife in a properly wed couple getting off while in the process of church-approved sex.
Not accurate.
Methods or objects that prevent conception are prohibited, but any number of toys are permitted as long as they do not lead to the disruption of the eventual coitus. As far as I have ever heard, you could use a French Tickler as long as you cut off the tip so that it would fail as a condom.
There’s the old joke,
Q: Why do women have so many fewer orgasms than men?
A: Who cares?
The Catholic Church, like many sects, has gone through those puritanical phases where it disapproved of “having fun” on principle. This is logical, since indulgence in “fun”, sins of the flesh like sex, gluttony, greed, etc. detract one from proper contemplation of the glory of God etc. There’s a reason why the perfect life of devotion was for the monks to avoid fun stuff like singing, dancing, sex, good food, etc. and spend their time in meditation of God. Religions around the world often subscribe to the point of view - if it’s fun, it must be evil.
No surprise if even in more enlightened times, the church can’t shed the puritan ethic. Even more not surprising when a bunch of single celibate men (who willingly took up this lifestyle) dictate how married men and women should behave. Yes, have sex, but it should be for the purpose of procreation. Any pleasure is incidental and should not be the main motive. Since orgasm in a man is ncessary for procreation, well, I guess it has to happen… but try to say “oh God, oh God…” when you do. For women - well, if it happens, it happens, it can’t be helped, but remember the purpose of sex is procreation not self-indulgence. Say 10 Hail Marys and go sin no more…
As I understand things, procreation is to be done without any lust or impure desire. If you’re having an orgasm during procreation you are no doubt doing something wrong. That would go for men and women.
I… never really understood how that can work. But there’s enough shame to go around for everyone!
You understanding is incomplete. The Catholic Church’s position on sex (:D) is far more nuanced than the stereotyped “Thou Shalt Not”.
Basically, the Church holds that sex has two EQUALLY important functions: (1), procreation (obviously), and (2), maintaining and strengthening the relationship between a married couple. In their view, separating these two functions is wrong. Having sex mechanically, just for the purposes of conceiving a child, is just as disapproved of as having sex only for the jollies.
Whether or not you find this analysis persuasive (and, most of us, including Catholics, do not) the Church takes very seriously the fact that most people do find sex pleasurable, and approves of that fact.
It is interesting to note that, among couples with fertility issues attempting to conceive, it is almost a cliche that sex becomes burdensome. “She’s ovulating today. I gotta have an hour off at 10, and then another at 3. Again.”
The Catholic Church does, however, want to see people feel shame for a closely related issue: posting guesses and poorly-informed conclusions in the GQ forum, which it hopes will be reserved for factual answers.
Well, to be fair, Aquadementia was correct in saying that procreation should be without lust or impure desire. But what he missed is that the Church does not view desire of a husband for his wife, or of a wife for her husband, as lustful or impure.
While a “good” sexual relation has to end with ejaculation inside the vagina (and therefore the male orgasm should be postponed until that time,the ocurrence of a female orgasm while not in a penis-in-vagina situation does not have an impact on the legality of the sexual relation so long as it occurs in preparation for the “llegal” ending.
You can bring your wife to orgasm before, during and after sex/marital embrace/ coitus (especially if she’s near) either through vaginal, manual or oral stimulation. Some people (I know a priest said it, but I’m unsure of his name) have argued that since it more difficult to women to achieve orgasm, it will make her husband more invested in learning her needs and pleasures. Thus, increasing their bond.
This sounds a lot more like the post-puritan accomodation. “Did we say all sex and other pleasures were sinful and should be avoided? Why are you laughing at us? OK, you can do it, as long as your heart is not very lustful… as long as it’s only to ‘strengthen the marriage bonds’ not to get your rocks off…”
