As a teacher who has basically worked in the inner city for over 15 years - including some areas that you literally took your life into your hands to go to work - you don’t know what the fuck you are talking about.
Now if the analogy were that health care were available in the inner-city but most who lived there had other priorities that made healthcare unimportant in their lives, that would be more accurate.
Fair enough. I’ll agree with this distinction.
Debaser, you might want to take into account that the poster I quoted above is NOT a raving liberal like me or luci or Czarcasm…you done stepped in it.
Either way, under my plan or yours the inner city is fucked.
We try really hard and spend a lot of money to get education there and it fails, due to the reason that Saint Cad spells out. Why would healthcare be different? That’s my point.
How? By agreeing with him?
Also: Give yourself some credit. You’re not as bad as luci or Czarcasm.
Nah. A trick question is: “Does the set of all sets that don’t contain themselves, contain itself?”
The question that was asked is more along the lines of “Can you go more North than the North Pole?” (Geographic North). There is one correct answer to the question and failure to produce it indicates a lack of understanding of the premises (i.e. not knowing what North, or the North Pole, or Government, or Medicare are).
It seems to have been a Birther thing that never even got off the ground and got any significant mindshare among Birthers. I hesitate to try to figure out their internal logic in case it infects me with the crazy. Both parties can pat themselves on the back for this one since the cross tabs say Democrats and Republicans tied at 6% saying Hawaii was not part of the US.
At least a third of the people who are voting Republican don’t know the first thing about healthcare in this country and yet are still willing to hold opinions about it. That much is clear even if you discount the 26% Democratic “Yes” response as a baseline for people (in either party) who would be confused by the question. As bad as that is in itself. Or, you could argue that a quarter of Democrats and almost two-thirds of Republicans were utterly uninformed and still opinionated.
This is downright sloppy considering all of the banking, retailing, and auto sales regulations we do have. You are arguing against a reality that already exists.
And still are.
Because the point is that if there’s a 60% success rate in the inner cities – a rate you’d surely call a failure – we still have 60% of the population who can read, write, and do math (or can actually get treatment for chronic diseases without being sent into bankruptcy), whereas the laissez-faire system you seem to advocate will make things worse. Under a system of obnoxious neglect – I’ll just use that as shorthand for what you propose – we would have far more unemployable, sick people than we do today. How you can think that public education is a failure that should be disbanded is a belief worthy of Mao and the Cultural Revolution, not mainstream political thought in a First World nation.
So the rumblings out of Washington indicate that the majority of the Republican reps would vote for the clean funding bill that Boehner has in front of him but refuses to put up for vote. And when I say majority I mean 180 out of 230 reps.
But Boehner won’t do it because he shit scared of the 50-80 tea party lunatics throwing enough crap around to force a vote for a new house speaker. He’s putting 800 000 jobs on hold to save his own.
How kind of you.
I don’t think we should disband public education. I certainly didn’t mean to give that impression. I was just correcting the analogy offered that health care should cover everyone to a basic level just like education does. Education doesn’t cover everyone to a basic level right now. Lot’s of people are slipping through the cracks. That was my point.
I could go on about ways I would improve education through vouchers, reducing the power of teachers unions, improved testing, etc. But that’s another thread.
I try to make sure that the things I say are right before I post them, and if I look at that damn Public Policy Polling PDF one more time, I’m going to blow a gasket. In the meantime, Debaser, here’s the overall narrative. I’m going to try to break it down into the pieces that you can Google sources for, and then you put it together for yourself.
Honestly I do think there are valid arguments either way about all (well, most) of the parts of the ACA, but having written all this out now, I don’t see any way you can’t say the Republican Party took the worst strategy to play the game for the Obama years.
When the dust settles on this era people are going to say the GOP made a historic miscalculation on the risk and reward of fighting Obamacare the way they have. If I was a Republican I would be pissed at my party’s leadership right about now.
Why should Obama agree to any concession on ACA when it was approved by the people, the house, the senate and upheld on challenge by the Supreme Court?
The GOP is holding ACA hostage at the expense of the American people and the economy. If Obama were to cave to what amounts to extortion then that sets a horrible precedent for any future President, regardless of party.
Any reasonable person, dem or rep can see that and anyone that does is far too biased than is healthy.
It was just a hypothetical to show the hypocrisy of their request.
I don’t entirely agree with your narrative, of course. But I appreciate you writing that all up. Most notably I take issue with your characterization of the “death panels” remark. But the less said about that the better. That will take up two pages of debate all by itself.
I do agree with you that there’s a good chance the GOP made a blunder here. I said so back on the first page of the thread I posted in…
When Grover Norquist is criticising you, then you know you done f’ed up: Grover Norquist on Ted Cruz: ‘He pushed House Republicans into traffic and wandered away’
In my defense, you hadn’t posted that yet when I was composing mine…
There are perhaps 3 or 4 politicians I would trust if I saw their lips flapping, otherwise that is how you tell a politician is lying.
And all the economics and business degreed people are the ones who effectively fucked over the country and caused the economic crash. For future reference, please keep in mind that I am very emphatic that their little buggy whip parable will not manage to be what happens now that most manufacturing is outsourced. Any spiffy new invention will continue to be outsourced and no new businesses will magically spring into being to replace all those outsourced jobs from the old manufacturing sector.
Just because your ass warms a chair at Yale and Stanford does not mean that you managed to get anything out of it besides a fancy piece of very expensive paper. You can be both highly educated and abysmally ignorant at the same time.
So we at the Dope have Threadspotting. Hypothetically, if Post-Spotting were to be introduced, Czarcasm, I’d nominate this one.
Would you be good enough to quantify that some, please? What is your sense of the percentage who are slipping through the cracks? Just an estimate will do.
That’s wrt basic education. For the same segment of the population, what would be your sense of the percentage who “slip through the cracks” wrt basic healthcare?
The callous disregard for actual, real, live hurting people is appalling to me.
I live near one of the Space Centers. 3,000 of my immediate neighbors are on furlough.
Since the space center is closed, many of the local associated contractors have gone into slow-mo. My neighbors tell me they plan to hunker down since they don’t know how long this will last or if they will get back pay. So, no shopping or restaurant food, strangling our local shops, etc. The ripple effect of this shut down is reverberating all over my whole part of town.
All for bullshit.
ACA is a law. No amount of grandstanding at this time will change that.
Republicans lost the election, they lost the Supreme court case, and yesterday’s millions trying to access the exchange should be a sign. Instead, all I hear about is the WW2 memorial being closed.
What about all the women, infants, and children who got cut off of WIC today? Do Republicans care anything at all about hungry infants or children?
Hell, my 401K has really just recovered from the last Republican assault.
What happened to the party that claims to be Christian, fiscally responsible, pro free-market and job creators?
All lies.