Saying Oswald didn't shoot Kennedy, right?

[blindboyard]

In reaction to that other Oswald thread, a question for anyone thinking Oswald didn’t shoot Kennedy.

Well, he became a suspect, although he was never convicted. The police presumably had some reason to think he was the man.

So, iwhat are your thoughts on how he came to be charged with the crime, or became prime suspect?

[Cicero]

I have a book in front of me called “Reclaiming History”. It is about the assassination of Kennedy. I bought it at Christmas and have not finished. In normal size print it would run to 14 volumes, plus a DVD.

You want to explain in a post why he was a suspect?

If you want a smaller book try Case Closed by Gerald Posner. It tells most things.

[BigT]

They found his stuff in the shooting place; the bullet directory fits, he shot a cop while fleeing. He had tried to assassinate before but missed. He told his wife about trying to kill people. And that’s just off the top of my head.

And, yes, Case Closed is really good.

[Superhal]

I believe Oswald shot Kennedy, but I don’t believe he was the only shooter, and I’m not sure he made the killing shot. I’m particularly swayed by the magic bullet evidence and the lack of an autopsy on the body.

[Johnny_L.A]

What magic bullet evidence? Do you mean that you’re not convinced by the reconstruction that shows the bullet followed a straight path? Or the assumption by people who don’t know the geometry of the jump seat etc. who claim the bullet danced around?

[crypto]

I find it amazing that people believe that it is impossible for a conspiracy to have killed Kennedy.

Oswald was set up from the word go. Gerald Posner - how can you trust a grown man with a haircut like the Dutch Boy painter?

[Valgard]

@Superhal

I believe Oswald shot Kennedy, but I don’t believe he was the only shooter, and I’m not sure he made the killing shot. I’m particularly swayed by the magic bullet evidence and the lack of an autopsy on the body.

No autopsy? How about this one?

John F. Kennedy autopsy

[blindboyard]

@BigT

They found his stuff in the shooting place; the bullet directory fits, he shot a cop while fleeing. He had tried to assassinate before but missed. He told his wife about trying to kill people. And that’s just off the top of my head.

And, yes, Case Closed is really good.

All this the police found out when they were investigating, but what made them arrest him to begin with? He wasn’t suspected of the other assassination attempt (Wallace, right?) until after his arrest, he’d ordered his gun in a fake name and no match was made between him and the prints found on the gun until after he was dead (wasn’t possible, AFAIK, with that pre-computer Life on MArs style fingerprint tech). His wife didn’t grass him up. The witnesses to the Tippett killing didn’t know him and only gave descriptions, not his name.

So I’m not wondering what evidence there is that he did it, I’m wondering on what evidence the police initially arrested him. What evidence may have been available to them at the time, sort of thing. Apart from not paying for his cinema ticket, I mean.

[samclem]

@blindboyard

So I’m not wondering what evidence there is that he did it, I’m wondering on what evidence the police initially arrested him. What evidence may have been available to them at the time, sort of thing. Apart from not paying for his cinema ticket, I mean.

While I’m not expert at this, I think your answer can be found by reading the article at Wikipedia

Police evidently knew within the first few minutes after the assassination that the shooter was in the Book Depository. Oswald, an employee there, was the only employee to leave, according to the article.

According to the Warren Commission, immediately after firing Oswald hid the rifle behind some boxes and descended the rear stairwell. About ninety seconds after the shooting, in the second-floor lunchroom he encountered a police officer accompanied by Oswald’s supervisor; the officer let Oswald pass after the supervisor identified him as an employee. (According to the officer, Oswald was drinking a soda and did not appear to be nervous or out of breath.) Oswald crossed to the front staircase, and left the building just before police sealed it off. The supervisor later pointed out to officers that Oswald was the only employee to absent himself after the assassination.[91][92]

It goes on to say

Minutes later,[ed–after shooting Officer Tippit] Oswald was seen “ducking into” the entrance alcove of a shoe store, apparently avoiding passing police cars. Soon after, the store’s manager saw Oswald slip into the nearby Texas Theater without paying.[104] He alerted the theater’s ticket clerk, who telephoned police.[105]

As police arrived, the house lights were brought up as the store manager pointed out Oswald sitting near the rear. Oswald appeared to surrender (saying, “Well, it is all over now”) but then struck an officer; he was disarmed after a struggle.[106] As he was led from the theater, Oswald shouted he was a victim of police brutality.[107]

At about 2 p.m., Oswald arrived at the Police Department building, where he was questioned by Detective Jim Leavelle in the shooting of Officer Tippit. When Captain J. W. Fritz heard Oswald’s name, he recognized it as that of the Book Depository employee who was reported missing and was already a suspect in the assassination.[108][109] Oswald was booked[when?] for both murders, and by the end of the night he had been arraigned as well.[110]

Just read the sequece there, and it should be clear why they were after him.

[RealityChuck]

@Stink Fish Pot

I find it amazing that people believe that it is impossible for a conspiracy to have killed Kennedy.

Funny, I find the opposite amazing. I’m just not naive enough to believe in grand conspiracies.

Oswald was set up from the word go. Gerald Posner - how can you trust a grown man with a haircut like the Dutch Boy painter?

Right. Because a person’s stylish appearance in an infallible guide to his trustworthiness.

[Valgard]

@Stink Fish Pot

I find it amazing that people believe that it is impossible for a conspiracy to have killed Kennedy.

Oswald was set up from the word go. Gerald Posner - how can you trust a grown man with a haircut like the Dutch Boy painter?

The question isn’t whether it was possible that there was a conspiracy to kill JFK. The questions are:

1. What were the details? “It was a conspiracy” has little to no explanatory power.

2. What is the actual credible evidence for (1)?

3. How does the evidence in (2) compare with the evidence that Oswald killed JFK all by his lonesome self?

All kinds of things are possible but if they are highly improbable, have no evidence and there’s a mountain of evidence that something else is in fact what took place, the “possible but extremely unlikely” theory isn’t going to get much credence.

[handsomeharry]

@Cicero

I have a book in front of me called “Reclaiming History”. It is about the assassination of Kennedy. I bought it at Christmas and have not finished. In normal size print it would run to 14 volumes, plus a DVD.

You want to explain in a post why he was a suspect?

If you want a smaller book try Case Closed by Gerald Posner. It tells most things.

Case closed would be a book as to why Oswald *did *kill Kennedy, not as to why an innocent person was arrested for it.

Best wishes,
hh

[ivan_astikov]

Has the business about a Mauser rifle being found in the book depository, but the bullets fired were from a Mannlicher, been covered on here?

ps. Do you really believe everyone would have just continued working, after the president has just been shot? I’d be highly surprised if Oswald was the only one who finished the day early.

[palindromemordnilap]

@blindboyard

what are your thoughts on how he came to be charged with the crime, or became prime suspect?

Do some people believe Oswald was completely uninvolved? I’ve never heard that theory. The usual conspiracy theory is that he was a scapegoat working with more experienced and savvy conspirators.

Oswald’s past history suggests he would have made a perfect patsy. And in his only public statement after his arrest he tried to tell the world he was set up. If he had been allowed to live he surely would have expanded on that claim. So the fact that he was killed in police custody by a person with a terminal illness also fits the theory that he was a scapegoat.

I’d like to turn the question around: Is the fact that Oswald was identified as a suspect sufficient to presume him guilty? There are so many cases of police focusing on a suspect who turns out to be innocent that I can’t begin to recount them.

[samclem]

@ivan_astikov

Has the business about a Mauser rifle being found in the book depository, but the bullets fired were from a Mannlicher, been covered on here?

From Wikipedia

About a half hour after the assassination of President Kennedy, a floor-by-floor search of the Texas School Book Depository Building was commenced by Dallas police, joined by sheriff’s deputies.[24] The rifle was found by Deputy Sheriff Seymour Weitzman and Officer Gene Boone among cartons on the sixth floor.[25][26] They initially came to what the Warren Commission concluded was the mistaken belief that the rifle was a Mauser, rather than the Carcano that Oswald owned. Captain Fritz of the Dallas Police Department, who arrived shortly after, later admitted that he did not know that much about the differences between a Carcano and a Mauser at that time.[27] In fact the appearance of the two types of weapons is similar, since the Carcano action (see this article) was historically based on the Mauser design, and the rifle stocks were similar.[28]

So, they seem to have known bupkis about the fine points of rifles. Maybe they were better at telling the difference between a jelly doughnut and a creme filled one.

@ivan astikov

ps. Do you really believe everyone would have just continued working, after the president has just been shot? I’d be highly surprised if Oswald was the only one who finished the day early.

Oswald was the only employee who left the building, not quit working.