So is hot weather in the Sahara. So?
OK, I agree this thread is not being used to discuss the OP, just to trade humerous saying. So I will move on.
There’s that irony again.
Hot weather in the Sahara is consistent. Cold weather at the South Pole is consistent. That certainly does not mean that hot = cold.
Even simpler: If one person is consistently wrong, and another is consistently right, it does not mean that wrong = right.
My bolding.
Actually, that’s not the simplest or quickest OBE IME. Anecdotally, a lot of the ones I’ve read about, had related to me or experienced myself involve looking at the world, realising you’re not in your actual body (but almost always in the same room) and the shock of the realisation “snapping” you back into your body. I’ve experienced that a few times, but never the rest of what you describe, which seems to be more a sort of generic mid-level OBE, what with the moving around etc.
You seem to be under a mistaken impression that I don’t believe OBEs occur. I know damn well they occur, we just differ markedly in our explanation for them.
Also, I disagree that *every *NDE starts with what (I’d think of as) an OBE. I’ve (again, anecdotally) had an NDE related to me (guy had apparently “died” under anaesthesia) that involved a straight jump into a sort of “waiting room of souls” location without any astral body stuff happening first. I would call that an NDE without OBE.
He couldn’t have jumped into a waiting room for souls if he hadn’t left his body. It is true that some don’t notice they are out of body until they are returned to their body. Each experience is unique, but with similar events. I have read thousands of spiritual experiences and had a few dozen myself. One can not say what will happen, with spirit anything is possible. I am glad you have experienced and believe. Look for the trends and patterns while reading a few hundred experiences.
Love
I’ve had an out of body experience, but I was really, really, really under the influence. Many different influences, to be exact. It was pretty cool, but nothing more than an illusion.
But he *did not *experience not being in his body - which you said (and I agree) was a central feature of OBE: “You know you are out of your body, no one needs to tell you”. As far as he was aware, it was his body in the “waiting room”.
I have experienced. I believe it’s a brain glitch. I’m glad that makes you glad.
I would have to talk to him to discover how he felt about it, and what happened. Some people wake up and feel they are facing south, but their body is really facing north, some feel a lift-up of their spirit and know their body still remains on the bed. There are hundreds of ways of experiencing being out of body. If your belief system doesn’t believe it is possible, then you will likely think it to be a glitch. It is amazing to me how many brain misfires, glitches, burps, and farts that scientists attribute to things they can’t explain.
We leave our bodies on a regular basis during sleep, some more that others. The spirit does not need sleep so wanders around in the spirit world producing dreams that can’t be interpreted logically. There are flying dreams, just skidding along slightly about ground, dreams where you are running from some kind of monster, collages of known things out of order, meeting people you know, etc., then when it is over falling down an elevator shaft or off a high something brings you back into your body. As I said before read and learn, you will be glad you did.
Oh, and schizophrenia is multiple spirits inhabiting one body. And lying is a devious spirit which has entered the body. Reading is the act of going back in time and interrogating another person’s spirit. Farting is the expulsion of the negative spirit.
This is fun.
Haven’t explained yet. There is a critical difference.
Guess that means you won’t be learning or reading.
I don’t see any difference, some of those misfires science has been trying to explain for over 100 years. Like OBEs, and NDEs.
I’m sorry, but reading what? You have been asked for a cite repeatedly and haven’t brought a single one out. Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence, and you don’t seem to have any except for “things that can be read.”
Well I’m sure I’m way out of my league here but how can they be sure they have recreated an OBE unless they have experienced one for themselves? And Lekatt, how can you be sure they haven’t unless you have A had one your self and B done one with their machine?
I’ve been peeking in on this one too, and wondered the same thing, put someone who has had a OBE in that machine, and for that matter use his feedback to program the machine further.
But all and all I still think at best this machine can only simulate the real thing, it will never be able to duplicate it IMHO.
Well, if the consciousness can’t tell a difference, is there really one?
I have been out of body more than once, their machine is only a set of goggles that allow you to see yourself as you would if out of body. Same thing can be done with mirrors. The difference between the two is somewhat like going on an ocean cruise and watching a movie of it.
This is an important point. It is how things work.
Well I’ll take your word for it. The set up they have looks a little on the hokey side to me, but then again I’ve never had a OBE either. As long as you feel comfortable making that call. Putting a video camera behind my head wouldn’t, by my mind, qualify, as an OBE, as long as your sure that’s not what it’s like. Any body else here ever had one?
I wouldn’t. He may have had a “natural” OBE, but he has no experience at all with the set up described in the article, and has no basis at all for making the comparison that he did. Which is not to say that he’s necessarily wrong. It could very well be that there’s a vast difference between a “real” and artificial OBE. But lekatt is not in a position to know if that’s the case, and has already demonstrated his heavy bias against these scientists, so he’s not reliably objective on the subject.