…your opinion.
Again, what about it do you disagree with?
Everyone who thinks about that whole scene agrees it’s stupid.
…your opinion! Seriously: what more do you want me to say? You thought it was stupid. I thought it was hilarious. Tastes differ.
Incorrect.
I don’t mind if you found it hilarious. I found it amusing when I was watching it also.
But my whole issue is that it made no logical sense. That whole bit is full of plot holes and logical inconsistencies.
I’d like to get your opinion on how it all went down. Was Magnussen still in the office or not? Why would Janine let Sherlock up if he was still in the office (even though, as I’ve already said, even if he wasn’t in, it’s still completely unbelievable that Janine would let him in) How do you think Mary got in? When and where did she encounter Magnussen and the bodyguard? Just give me like a basic scenario
…how exactly do you want me to phrase “you are over thinking a thirty second scene in a TV show” so that you would understand it? Mary is a professional assassin who managed to not make enemies of Sherlock and had been, along with Sherlock, manipulating Janine for months if not years. Do you really need to be shown on screen how she got into the building? Imagine the most inventive, outlandish scenario that would annoy you the most and I’ll take that one as what happened.
Sherlock manipulating Janine isn’t a plot hole. Its a stretch: but so is the entire concept of a brilliant consulting detective that solves crime with his good buddy Watson. It appears to be a stretch to far for you which is sad: but it isn’t a stretch to far for me.
magnussen had to know at some point someone he was blackmailing would just kill him. i’m sure that mary wasn’t the first to try.
any thoughts of the moriarty video being the first salvo in his “upon my death set the following into motion” plan? being a media mogul would make having the video break into broadcast very possible. from what we are shown it could not have been more than a week from when he was shot to the video appearance.
Why did Janine invite Sherlock up if Magnussen was sitting in his desk in the next room, with a bodyguard?
That whole scene was emblematic of all the lazy writing of the episode and series in general.
We’re asked to believe because of the engagement ring.
Did she want to get fired?
I mean, the idea of her allowing Sherlock to go up even if Magnussen wasn’t there is enough of a stretch. I doubt anyone who’s basically the gatekeeper to a highly-restricted office of an intensely creepy, strict, cold boss would simply allow her BF to his inner office.
But then we learn Magnussen and a guard were in the very next room. It makes no sense.
You asked the question, I answered. You’re welcome.
Wasn’t it incredibly stupid for Magnusson to only have the files in his brain? I mean, once it was revealed that no files exist, his death is an obvious fix to the problem of him.
He had no backup plan, which is ludicrous.
tbf, it makes no sense that he didn’t have the physical evidence on which he relied. I’m not sure why SH believed that.
But that would mean the writers could’t win; it exists and SH was a fool, it doesn’t and Magnusson was a fool.
I guess the easy option was for it to exist and for SH to blow it up, but that’s too cliched.
…because Magnussen said to Janine “let him up! Lets congratulate that man! Champagne on me!”
Thats your opinion. I disagree. I don’t think the writing was lazy at all.
Master criminals believe a great plan doesn’t need a backup. Usually they are so proud of their ludicrously ornate plans they have to show them off to the guys who come to stop them rather than just shooting them. Magnussen was playing his role correctly and had every hope of stretching out Holmes’ and Watson’s elaborate deaths for at least another reel, but Holmes is no James Bond.
Lazy writing leaves lots of plot holes, loose ends and inconsistencies.
This series was all about individual enjoyable scenes, but they don’t hold together well. I find it hilarious that Gatiss and Moffat admit that their story is less interesting than the one where Sherlock doesn’t interrupt Mary (in the podcast). They impeached their own writing.
Seriously? You yourself can’t even come up with a decent explanation of that scene, just joke ones.
…what makes you think I’m joking?
And seriously, why do you care about what I think happened in thirty seconds of screen time?
When I first saw Sherlock with the ring proposing the very first thought in my head was “Sherlock, you magnificent bastard!” My second thought seconds later, after I realized what a terrible thing Sherlock was doing to Janine was “Sherlock, you horrible bastard!” When they got upstairs and you could see Janine’s body lying on the floor: I stopped laughing because my thoughts were that Magnussen had indeed been observing everything, had seen he had been betrayed by Janine and had killed her. And I quite liked Janine so I was hoping she wasn’t dead. And if Molly hadn’t gotten involved this could well have been one of the scenarios that played out.
So why did Janine let Holmes up? Because I’m sure Magnussen didn’t care. It was a super secret installation in Holmes’s head: but why would Magnussen care? Everything Sherlock was looking for was in Magnussen’s head. If Molly hadn’t taken Magnussen it wouldn’t have surprised me at all if Magnussen was at the top of the elevator when Holmes walked out and Magnussen would have delighted in mocking Sherlock’s efforts to break into the building.
I’m perfectly happy that the version of what happened that played out in my head is logically consistent and had no plot holes. We get that the version that played out in your head pissed you off. But what do you want me to do about that?
I’ve just got round to watching the second one. I haven’t read any further than when you start discussing the 3rd. I’ve got 2 questions about it I probably missed.
- Why (attempt to) kill the guardsman?
- How did he manage to be John’s wedding photographer?
If you answer please quote me so I canm search for my username without reading the rest of the thread. Cheers
Supersecret intallation only in Holmes head? Is that why it had ridiculous layers of security, including some that apparently weren’t even legal according to Sherlock? Did he imagine all these things?
Why would Magnussen care? Why wouldn’t he care? There’s a reason he’s protected by so much security all the time everywhere he goes. And even if at that point Magnussen would welcome Sherlock sneaking in to mock him or whatever, how does that play into this scenario at all? Janine never asked Magnussen if she could bring Sherlock up.
None of your reasons make any sense.
…what exactly was ridiculous about the layers of security?
She could have been doing it without Magnussen knowing. Or she may have told him months before they were dating and he had told him she could let him up. Ultimately it doesn’t matter: we saw a tiny fraction of what actually would have happened. I don’t need to see everything that happened nor have it explained to me with explicit exposition.
I’m answering the questions you asked. I enjoyed the programme, and loved all three episodes. I can’t say the same about the first two series of Sherlock…I didn’t really like them and never watched them through. So don’t put labels on me. I’m not a “fanboy.” I don’t feel a need to “rationalize” this scene. I’ve told you exactly how the scene played out to me while I watched it. What more do you want me to say? You can continue to hate the scene while I will continue to love it.