I assume the woman was instructed on how to position herself so as to consistently appear in the camera.
Along the same lines, I would not be surprised if this actually took place in more than 10 hours.
Yes. Earlier I thought she had more to do with the video than just being the actress. All she did was walk down the street. She certainly deserves no condemnation whatsoever for that participation.
Most likely most or all of the people threatening her made the same assumption.
:mad: How’s that suppose to help?! Those puppies have not even been properly skinned!
You may be right.
I’ve spent some time in New York as a tourist, but probably didn’t realize that nodding pleasantly and saying “Hello,” or “Afternoon!” as I passed people was marking me as an alien.
But could it be that the ethos is not universal? That there are some transplanted New Yorkers who still feel okay about greeting people with a brief platitude about the day?
THIS is what men should be taking away from this video. Many of these guys are guilty of nothing more than social cluelessness and honestly may not understand the reaction of the woman that ignores their “Hello” or “Good Morning” or other attempt to engage them.
But they need to realize that lots of guys are attempting to engage this woman as she walks down the street and a lot of them are rude, nasty and insulting if ignored. Lots of them are rude, nasty and insulting anyway.
I once said thank you to some guy who said I had beautiful eyes. His response was “I’d like to keep them in a jar by my bed.”
My best friend and I ignored a “compliment” of some sort. The guy shoved her in the back and into the path of an oncoming car - I managed to catch her and she fell back onto the sidewalk not into traffic.
Once I ignored some dude that said “nice legs” or something like that. But another woman walking nearby reacted and the guy said " I wasn’t talking to you, you’re ugly."
A man I had never seen before- a good looking one at that - approached me on the street in front of my apartment building and asked me if I wanted to get a cup of coffee sometime. I said no and he berated me for “not giving him a chance.” This happened 3 days after the death of my boyfriend.
This is one thing I don’t miss about being young and attractive. Believe it or not, I kind of “got it” that a lot of the guys that tried to engage me on the street were well-meaning. The problem was that it seldom ended there. If you return the “Good Morning” the guy would attempt to engage in further conversation. If you engaged in further conversation he would ask you out. When you said “No” you had been leading him on because you returned his fricking “Good Morning”. There’s no winning.
No raindrop thinks it’s responsible for the flood.
And, for me, it wasn’t always men doing the harassing – I have been catcalled by other women,( twice) while walking in Greenwich Village,
Bolded, underlined text does not actually link to anything when I click on it.
I am most annoyed.
Kstarnes, you aren’t by chance a **feminist **are you!?
Well, as a long-time resident of DC, I’m calling bullshit, and noting that you are actually acknowledging that as a male you get much less attention in a city than a woman; and that the attention you do get is related to money, not sex.
What you are saying is roughly equivalent to, “I know how starving children must feel; work was so busy today I had to skip breakfast and lunch.”
People teach their children, most emphatically, “DON’T TALK TO STRANGERS !”, for a reason. It acknowledges the hard truth that the ones being sweet and smiling are the ones to fear the most.
Women and children share the characteristic of being physically disadvantaged and somewhat easily overpowered. That is the reason we teach and continually reinforce caution.
Men see a man paying her compliments. Women know, from a lifetimes experience, any response to those sweet ‘compliments’, a glance, a smile, and that guy will immediately turn into the very guy you all want to see punched in the face! Get a clue!
Women live everyday in a world that demands a keen spidey sense. They ride public transit, get in cabs, walk into mall bathrooms, step onto elevators with your sorry asses. And they do so in the face if having been groped or rubbed up against, presumed by some creeper, followed by some douche onto a bus, etc, etc.
I’d be interested, if that were your 14 yr old daughter, which of those Romeos you’d be happy with her engaging with?
You can’t have it both ways. Either your daughter needs to be cautious because it’s a dangerous world or she needs to toughen up engage with every douchebag’s opening line thrown her way.
And you get approached by panhandlers? Really? If you were getting approached by panhandlers with this frequency, day in, day out, it would be something you would bitch bitterly about from sun up to sunset.
I am shocked by some of the attitudes expressed here.
City pedestrians of each sex face these non-felony hazards:
Dog Shit
Bicycle Messengers
Aggressive Panhandlers
Women endure catcalling in addition to these. However, the first three can be easily addressed through legal ordinances. Can you write one against catcalling that won’t have some civil libertarian invoking the ghost of Emmet Till?
[QUOTE=Morgenstern]
I was standing in line a few days back, and a pretty young lady with beautiful green eyes was in front of me. Are you saying it would have been improper for me to compliment her on her pretty eyes?
[/QUOTE]
Yes, it would be improper, unless you are very much older than the lady in question - old enough that it can be presumed that you lack the ability or the interest to have sex with her.
The rule is that a gentleman does not address a lady to whom he has not been introduced. “Introduction” has evolved in meaning over the last few years - “the roof constitutes an introduction” under certain circumstances, ordinary interactions of commerce are an introduction, etc. - but the general principle remains.
WIth one exception - unless the lady would like him to do so. And the onus of discovering that she does, and the consequences if he guesses wrong, are both on the gentleman. A gentleman, IOW, may not assume that the lady wishes to become acquainted because she is wearing tight pants or is attractive. She must give some indication that she wishes to be approached.
People laugh at the old rules of etiquette. But brought up to the modern day, and with due respect paid to changing circumstance, they are actually more important than before for personal interactions with strangers.
[del]Nice ass[/del] Regards,
Shodan
Who has called for outlawing catcalling?
After spending eight years in NJ and Miami, I grew accostumed to strangers keeping their eyes to themselves and not “speaking”. When I landed in VA, I experienced culture shock as I was re-introduced to the custom of hearing “howyoudoin’” and “good morning” from strangers. My initial reaction was offense, but then my Southern ways came back to me and relaxed.
I feel confident in saying those guys in the video are not transplants who are unfamiliar with the NYC custom of keeping your mouth shut. I say this because I doubt they’re saying “good morning” to random guys walking down the street. They’d be walking around with black eyes and crutches if they were.
And to the kstarnes, again,
Seriously, fella. Your perspective is screwed up.
You deliberately titled your OP in such a way as to suggest “Prostitute makes false accusations of assault in attention-grabbing entrapment effort,” but the very article you linked to is titled “Woman receives rape threats after . . .”
And really that’s where you just need to stop and think about how fucked up that is right there.
No, she wasn’t actually touched by anyone. That would have been assault (no scare quotes necessary). She certainly was harassed (still no need for scare quotes) with unwelcome and inappropriate catcalls and stalking.
If I saw anyone I knew subjected to that kind of behavior, I would be furious. Hell, I’m furious just seeing a stranger have to put up with that shit.
What’s really super fucked up is that you seem to sympathize, perhaps even empathize, with the creeps who harass her.
Wowfuckwow! Do you also write fan fiction where Gaston is a poor, misunderstood soul who just can’t get that stuck-up bitch Bell to acknowledge that he’s really an OK kinda’ guy?
DUDE!
X chromosomes are really nothing to be afraid of!
Why, you have one yourself. Right inside you!
(Ah, what the heck. I’m just farting up-wind, aren’t I.)
You’re shocked? We’re posting on the Straight Dope Message Board, where being empathy-impaired is not only the norm, it’s embraced. I am not surprised at all that only guys are downplaying this woman’s experience, or that people are questioning the validity of the video, or posters are bending over backwards trying to rationalize why these men should given a pass, or posters are trying to apply mathematical expressions to invalidate basic human emotions. These responses are par for the fucking course. I’m shocked that you are shocked, quite frankly.
There is not much to downplay, besides the creeper walking along side her for 5 minutes the reactions were mildly obnoxious and quite a few of them were polite. I’d say the reactions video didn’t support the narrative they were trying to sell. She was a beautiful woman, I wouldn’t have said anything but I’d sure be smiling ear to ear if she walked by me.
It’s as if two strangers who have first met in a chance encounter on the street have never taken up a conversation that led to future interactions, maybe a date, maybe a relationship, or more.
“Hi, How are you doing today? My name is X, I work across the street and noticed you doing Y. Would you like to grab a cup of coffee with me?”
Harassment I tell you.
Breaking news: men are pigs. I’m disappointed in the quality of the catcalls, they show very little creativity. More evidence of America’s cultural decline. The “reality is racist” sub-plot was a nice twist though, golfclaps all around.
Depending on the circumstances, this might still make a woman threatened, or not. If I’m leaning against a building in NYC and a woman walks by with a purposeful stride, then to say “Hi” is mildly obnoxious and could make her feel mildly threatened. If I say “you’re beautiful!” or “smile!” then it’s more so.
I recognize that some women might reasonably feel threatened and uncomfortable, even just a little bit, so I’m not going to take these actions. Even if there’s a slight chance some particular woman might like it. I don’t want to be part of a woman feeling threatened or uncomfortable to even the slightest degree – I don’t want to be a jerk.
Others who don’t want to risk making a woman feel threatened or uncomfortable should also refrain from such activity.
Since other posters have interjected race into the conversation, I’ll join in.
In my experience, black guys are more likely to call out to a pretty woman and be aggressively or obnoxiously friendly/complimentary. But white guys are more likely to do the horn-honking thing and intimate that because you’re a woman on the street, you must be some kind of prostitute.
I know that will be hard to believe for some posters here, and I know I’m just a sample of one. All I know is that when I was younger and I’d be walking down the street, all the drivers who would pull over to ask if I needed a ride or wanted to “hang out” were white guys. All the guys who would call out from stoops or sidewalks (or passenger side windows) with “hey shortie!” or “what are you doing tonight, girl?” were black guys.
This kind of harrassment knows no color.