I think it’s a great idea. Of course, I’m speaking from the perspective of an American; I’m not Iraqi. But I think it would add a lot to the debate over the war.
In the above article Shannon Love responds to a suggestion by Reason writer Steve Chapman that the Iraqis should conduct a plebiscite on the war, with the expectation that the Iraqis would want us to leave. From Love’s response:
“People opposed to Iraqi democracy like to harbor delusions about how the people of Iraq believe that they would be better off if we packed up and left tomorrow. For some strange reason, Iraq-democracy opponents often seem to believe that the most extremist, authoritarian, vicious and violent members of the polity represent the majority. Chapman, for example, bizarrely quotes the street gang members of Sadr’s militia as evidence that the majority of Iraqis don’t want us to help them.”
“More objectively, we can expect the people of Iraq to vote to have us continue to assist them, for the simple reason that they have already repeatedly voted through their representatives to have us do so. We have no reason to believe that a plebiscite will produce a radically different outcome.”
Some interesting comments from Love’s readers follow, but I’m sure we can do better.
People often think it’s a great idea to directly vote for something if they think it will produce the result they want. Iraq is a democracy, and the parliament has voted at least once (IIRC) on the subject. They can ask us to leave anytime they want.
Not the same thing at all. Probably 99% of Americans would agree that we should leave at some point after the job is completed. But that 1) wasn’t a vote 2) wasn’t a plebiscite and 3) said nothing about an immediate or early withdrawal date. Aside from that I have to admit there are some remarkable similarities.
And we’ll just tell them no. The government is just a prop held up by us, not a real or legitimate government. Iraq isn’t a democracy, it’s an occupied colony.
I don’t believe that. Well, I agree that it’s an occupied colony, but perpetual occupation has never been a US policy. We’ve always been into soft hegemony, which is the point of nation-building a democracy.
It seems pretty obvious that a perpetual occupation is just what the neocons intended, and still intend. It was supposed to be the base for a further campaign of conquest.
If the Iraqi government asked us to leave, and Bush refused to do so, he would be impeached and probably removed from office. But it’s moot anyway, since he’s only got a few months left. We couldn’t get all the troops and stuff out before Jan anyway.
Probably not, which is why I used the present tense.
Bush wouldn’t be impeached if he nuked Iraq and published video on the Internet of him masturbating to the carnage. Short of ordering Congress shot nothing he could possibly do would get him impeached.
Exaggerated, yes, but a grain of truth. We’ve just recently gotten the official investigation results: he lied. Ripples of apathy across the nation. If gross incompetence and/or malfeasance doesn’t rise to the level of high crimes and misdemeanors, in Og’s name, what does? At this point, there isn’t even word of censure, much less impeachment! Hell, even Bill was censured, fer cryin’ out loud, for lying about an innocent game of Boink the Bimbo. This guy lies us into war, and its all “Hail to the Chief” and “Mr. President”, when he is due no more respect than a rabid chihuahua!
I’m sorry to interrupt Ms. Love’s ranting with actual facts.
An overwhelming majority of the Iraqi people believe that the presense of american troops is making things worse in Iraq, and that American troops should leave as soon as possible.
Moreover they have felt the same way for more than four years. (Cite)(Cite)
Well, except that these are the lawmakers that the quote in your OP hangs her hat on. If the Iraqis have voted for representatives that want us to leave, what does that say?
Actually your cites don’t show that at all. It shows they felt that way from 2004 to early 2006. But there’s been a major change since 2006. The insurgents have joined us to defeat Al Qaeda. And that’s one of the main reasons we’re winning so big.
And tell it to the Germans, Japanese, Belgians, French, Panamanians, Kuwaitis, Dutch, Italians…
America had a brief flirtation with empire building with the Phillipines. There was tremendous ambivalence about it from the beginning. That’s it. There are much worse enemies you could worry about.