Should the American Left reclaim Patriotism?

[Babale]

@BigT

The liberals and even progressives can be patriotic, but we can’t easily go into hyper-patriotism, since that gets into nationalism.

Can you define ‘nationalism’? What precisely are you worried that we would start doing if we got too patriotic?

I agree that you don’t want to let any political idea - love or appreciation for your own country being one but that goes for anything we might believe in - override our reason. So that would be my reason for opposing hyper-patriotism - the risk that we would be blinded to real flaws that we’d otherwise be able to rationally examine.

But I’m not sure if that’s what you mean by ‘nationalism’ or if there’s something else you’re worried about.

@BigT

Especially in the current climate of patriotic one-upsmanship, we are at a disadvantage. We have to do this while simultaneously standing by thode who burn the flag or kneel or whatever.

I don’t know that we do need to support people just because they kneel or burn flags.

I didn’t support Kaepernick because he kneeled, I supported him because of the goals and ideas he wanted to bring attention to by kneeling. If someone else knelt during the anthem because they wanted to protest vaccine mandates I would think they are an idiot and I certainly would not support them.

@Jackmannii

At the very least, damping down disdain for recognizing military service and flag displays would be a good start.

Yeah, I agree, and this is why I wonder if this shift away from Patriotism is related to the Iraq and Afghanistan wars, since it would explain the negative attitude towards the Armed Forces.

@Jackmannii

Don’t be afraid to show pride in the positives, and emphasize the phony nature of “patriotism” on the part of Trump and his followers. Wrapping yourself in the flag while sneering at prisoners of war and embracing un-American worship of dictators isn’t at all patriotic.

Exactly. Supporting Trump is unpatriotic and unAmerican. What makes America America is its values, and Trump shits all over those. There’s nothing more unAmerican than that.