Right now it appears that the GOP is divided enough to guarantee they can not win in 2024. This has them held hostage to Trump. It also means our country is held hostage and does not have a functioning 2 party system. Also their prospects for power is grim if Trump gets in as Trump would own them and they know it. They would lose power. This is an assumption that the GOP is enough divided MAGA/Non-MAGA that their votes would be split to allow the left to hold the presidency in 2024, along with Trump’s willingness to run as an independent if the GOP kicks him. For the good of the country, to maintain an adversarial, but both sides loyal to the US, 2 party system, should their thoughts and prayers be sent that Trump is taken out of the race crushing MAGA dreams? Is it in the GOP’s best interest for their quest for power that Trump fades from the political scene that they would be willing to turn to the divine to accomplish this?
Tun to the divine? Absurd. It’s on us, is all.
I wouldn’t be optimistic about the GOPs chances of winning the Presidential race at this point, but their odds in the Senate are looking quite good for 2024, as Dems are defending lots of vulnerable seats.
I suspect all the talk now about other candidates like DeSantis winning the primary are off the mark. In the end Trump will push the narrative that even a conviction is nothing more than a partisan hit and 40% of the voting public will go along with it (and 95% of the GOP will go along with). All he has to do is threaten ruining the party and they will cave.
Trump going to jail gets the GOP a better candidate in replacement while sacrificing none of its neverending grievance against the authoritarian Deep State.
I’m sure many Repubs are secretly hoping trump goes away for good, no matter the reason. As long as there’s no chance of another Jason-like rise from (political) death. I’ve sometimes wondered in the past why Repubs didn’t join together and build a united front against trump. Yes, it would hurt the party, but it would be like chemotherapy getting rid of a cancer in the system. Other than a few true believers in Congress, most Repubs can’t stand trump and are aware how dangerous he is (their concern of course is the danger to their own long-term best interests, not to Democracy). It looked like it could happen a time or two, like in the immediate aftermath of the Jan. 6 insurrection when even Graham and McCarthy spoke up against trump. But they eventually get back on board the runaway trump train.
Of course, the reason is because individual elected Repubs are mostly too spineless to piss off trump’s rabid followers for any length of time, so they they weasel their way back to public support of trump.
Because he has dirt on people? Why else would senators who had vehemently opposed him and suffered numerous insults from him like Rubio and Cruz become boot licking toadies? The man is toxic slime.
Actually, this is a part of a “functioning two-party system”. It all comes down to this:
If one party can’t get their shit together well enough to have a single candidate supported by a bare majority of their primary voters, how can they be expected to get their shit together well enough to run the government?
Think of the candidates and the primaries as job interviews for the whole party. How they got to this point is a pretty good indicator of what they’ll do after this point. One candidate shows up on time, is well dressed and clean, and has a nicely printed resume. The other shows up hung over, with no coat on a cold day, and dog shit on their shoe, asks you, “So what is this job again?” and half way through the interview, his drunken buddy bursts into the room and demands that you give him the job instead. Which person gets the job?
If Republicans really are worried about “leftists” having an opportunity to run the country, they need to do the work to sort out their fucking party. Whining about how hard that is just emphasizes that you’re not ready for the job.
Trump doesn’t need dirt on them. They’re fully aware of what happens to Republicans who publicly stand up to Trump – see Cheney, Liz – and few of them are brave enough to sacrifice their political careers.
To answer the OP … yes, I imagine folks like Rubio and Cruz are praying that the DOJ takes down Trump. Not only would it get him out of their way, it would fuel the narrative about how the left hates freedom and they could all promise to pardon him the second they become president.
Of course, he still needs to be taken down.
If the GOP has horrible candidates, yes that is part of it. However I would argue this is not the case with Trump/MAGA. Trump/MAGA is anti-US as I see it, and seeking to overthrow the US government. What I put forth is even if the 2020 election was stolen from him, the way Trump went about maintain his power, if he was successful, would have ended the authority of the vote to decide elections by setting precedent that use of force determines who gets to be president. Which negates the constitution, thus ending our democracy. This was further exemplified by none of his court challenges to the vote count bringing forth the case of mass voter fraud. (yes it was filed as such but none of the Trump lawyers brought it up to the judges, and when asked by a few judges they said they are declining pursuing that claim). This further equates that no evidence would be needed of why someone gets to be president.
Why? I’m not threadshitting, but I am questioning the bases of your opening statement. Trump may win, or may lose the 2024 Republican primary race for US President. Whether Trump wins or loses, why is there a belief that GOP stalwarts would support a Democratic Party candidate or choose to stay home and not vote? If Trump loses in the Republican primary, it’s quite possible that he’ll be a sore loser. But to really hurt the Republican Party candidate, Trump would have to run as a third-party candidate.
That would be the most damaging scenario for the GOP, but he could also hurt them with constant mud-flinging at GOP candidates and whining about about the whole system being corrupt. That wouldn’t get red voters to vote blue, but it could persuade a non-zero number to not vote at all – and as we’ve seen, even a small percentage of reduced turnout can make the difference in close races.
Answering the question in the OP’s title, yes, they absolutely should. As stated upthread, they’ll be happy to use him as a martyr in the fight against liberals and the deep state as long as he’s silenced and off stage so to speak.
But I disagree in part with why they don’t get rid of him. For a while, the Republican party has been losing voter energy - they still had the single issue (abortion, guns) voters, and the support of the Christian Right, and their policies appealed to individuals and corporations bent on maintaining existing wealth. But the middle? Support, but no enthusiasm.
Trump changed that equation. So they ran with it, and figured they could control it. Not that I’m the first to say this by any means. But, IMHO, they figured, in the words of JCSS -
They’ve got what they want
They think so, anyway
If he’s what they want
Why take their toy away?
He’s a craze
And so the Republicans, fearing a split party, or having Trump turn the base against them, followed along with each step of the craze. But the base is still worked up. Sure, the craze is likely fading, although if Trump gets back into his groove of othering, he will likely be a lot more successful than the man-baby “cheaters” bit that hasn’t been working nearly as well for him.
Still, I think the current (R) heel-turn a la Paul Ryan is clever -
“I’m proud of the accomplishments [during the Trump administration] – of the tax reform, the deregulation and criminal justice reform – I’m really excited about the judges we got on the bench, not just the Supreme Court, but throughout the judiciary. But I am a Never-Again Trumper. Why? Because I want to win, and we lose with Trump. It was really clear to us in ’18, in ‘20 and now in 2022.”
Show resect (if half-assed) for what Trump accomplished towards Republican (not Trump’s) goals, but drive home a point about losses, inverting Trump’s own argument. People love Trump in part because he makes them feel like winners. If Trump loses, or his candidates lose for whatever reason, he’s a loser. Which has always been Trump’s message, and why (IMHO) he can’t back away from the losing narrative of the stolen election.
I disagree with this because our last two elections have shown a large number of people voting against a candidate. One of the reasons Clinton lost in 2016 (although Dems refuse to believe this) was many voters voted against her. Yes the option was Trump but they didn’t vote for Trump - they voted Not Hillary and picked by default the other option. Same in 2020. A lot of people did not vote for Biden but rather for Not Trump. Hell, you could have run Patty Murray or Ned Lamont and they would have won. So let’s not discount that whoever the Pubs run, Trump, DeSantis, Collins, etc. There will be considerable Not Biden votes.
Because the way I see it many GOP’ers will not vote for Trump because Trump has crossed the line into a traitor to the US, yet many MAGA’s will. I do think this is about a 50:50 split on the right, so if Trump runs GOP loses. And even if the off chance that Trump runs and wins, the GOP loses as Trump would be the one with the power, not the GOP.
I would question this as I’m seeing more and more christians coming out against Trump. Perhaps this is just media driven however - meaning the media is finding and giving voice to the same number of christians, we just now know they exist, IDK.
When an exposed lier and election cheater (you can hear Trump’s own voice threatening the official to find him votes, votes that did not exist) has been found, I have to question if Trump really won 2016, or did he cheat there too. I usually find also that those who accuse others are usually the ones guilty of it, and Trump has been very accusatory of others of election fraud, and after all his accusations and nothing ever proven, again was caught doing it himself. I am not so sure Trump was legit elected in 2016, though according to the process he was our president.
However I do agree that a massive anti-clinton, anti- woman as president campaign was launched which did work well, as well as the proven track records of negative campaigning.
I think this is a strawman to make it not about Hillary. I did not hear a lot of anti-woman campaigning in 2016. Maybe (here’s a thought) people voted against Clinton not because of her sex but because people didn’t like her for non-sexist reasons.
Now if you want to talk about a woman candidate that was voted against for daring to be female, we can discuss Amy Klobuchar, the likeability penalty, and the vitriol the Democrats threw at her for daring to act like men do.
I’m not going to follow this, not because it’s not a worthy subject but will detract from the thoughts and prayers theme of the OP.
Agreed.
And I think we can agree that for whatever reason there were considerable (as in a ton more than previous presidential election - maybe enough to swing an election) Anti-Clinton votes in 2016, Anti-Trump votes in 2020 and there will be Anti-Biden votes in 2024, Anti-Whoever is President in 2028, 2032, 2036, … and that this has nothing to do with the other candidate (i.e. whoever they are running against) but rather is a reflection on the divisiveness in US politics.
Meaning Trump will get many votes just by not being Biden.
Then again, Biden would get many votes by not being Trump.
It’s hard for me to delineate where the personal and political vitriol towards Hilary crossed into outright misogyny but I think Dems should continually be morphing into a party which celebrates its strong female candidates.
Leaving aside the fact that there’s nobody (except folks who want to be seen as pious and righteous) to hear and respond to any putative prayers, I take issue with the implication that the GOP can be meaningfully characterized as loyal to the US.
I hope the above doesn’t count as a threadshit. Please accept my apologies in the event that it does.
Anyway, I don’t think the GOP should root for the America-hating fuckstick’s incarceration, for the simple reason that I got here first, and I’m not in love with the idea of sharing the moral high ground with the likes of them. Petty of me, I know, but at least I’m willing to own that peccadillo.
If I wasn’t clear, I apologize, I was indicating before the crazy times, the Christian Right was a dependable source of votes along with other single issue voters, but that the Republicans had been failing to create a strong sense of motivation in the masses, which is something Trump managed to do quite well.
I would say based on my reading of recent trends, that a large number of nominal Christians are more about Christian rule via the Republican party than any effort to espouse non-militant Christian belief, which is causing a substantial portion of the vast grouping of ideologies under the ‘Christian’ umbrella to stop identifying as such.
But with various religious rights rules coming into play and likely more on the way, there is a non-zero possibility of using federally funded religious education to offset that. Not that I think it is certain, or even particularly likely, but something I would have written off years ago entirely.
But that’s getting past the thread. The point is that as a nominal-at-best-Christian, Trump isn’t particularly good at manipulating that particularly group of votes. Sure, he drives up the portion that already are primed to hate, but he has that effect on said group regardless of religious leaning. A better candidate could likely fake it better, and thus bring back those who you have heard of that are repudiating his crudity, or cruelty - and the sooner Trump is convicted or otherwise incommunicado, the sooner the Republican party can firm up those votes.