It sounds like the Browns made a similar offer to the Rams, including 3 1st rounders and possibly additional picks (we’ll probably never know). I wonder what put the Skins over the top. Did it really come down to Shanny and Jeff Fisher being close friends?
So the Vikings beating Washington results in them losing out on this deal? At least this will take away the Vikings fans saying that the team should draft RG3. We’ll see how Ponder (or Webb) looks this season with Kalil protecting the blind side.
Collusion! Somebody check Jeff Fisher’s bank records.
No, I’m just saying that the story as presented doesn’t make any sense. If the Browns were offering the same deal - only with the first rounder this year requiring the Rams to move down only half as much, the next first rounder also acquired this year instead of next, and the third first round a year early too, it’s unlikely they’d take Washington’s deal. Also, the idea that Cleveland tried to up their offer at the last minute, but were too late, was pretty ridiculous. Too late for what?
I suspect those items were leaked by Washington sources to make Washington look a bit less ridiculous. “See, other teams were willing to give up crazy amounts too! We’re just so awesome that they picked us”
If Cleveland really was offering the same deal, St. Louis would’ve taken it. They weren’t.
I think the difference was the 2nd first round pick Cleveland was giving up was this years no. 22 pick. It’s a pretty good bet that Washington’s first pick will be earlier then that next year.
I ws under the impression the #22 pick was never going to be offered by the Browns.
I’m so happy my team has Andy Dalton and didn’t have to participate in this craziness.
Peter King of “Sports Illustrated” notes that when the Giants traded two first, a third and a fifth to San Diego to draft Eli Manning in 2004 it was viewed as excessive. But the Giants now have two Super Bowl rings in the last four years, largely due to Manning. Of course the Giants are run completely different from the sideshow that Snyder does in Washington.
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2012/writers/peter_king/03/10/redskins.rams.griffin/index.html?sct=nfl_t11_a1
Of course if RGIII turns out to be Ryan Leaf II, then it’s the worst trade ever (or second worst, after Herschel Walker to Minnesota). A very steep price but it could be a trade where both teams win.
People still don’t get that having a elite starting QB is really the only thing that matters and it must be solved no matter what. The Redskins gave up a ton and it’s a huge risk, it will be very difficult to build a team around him without those picks and that matters. But regardless, spending the next 3-4 years without a star at QB is worse. I’d very much rather be the Redskins than the Browns right now.
It’s whats being reported here in StL. Either way as a 49er fan I’m not happy.
I disagree. Philip Rivers is a perfectly good QB. Give him New York’s defense (especially those pass rushers) and maybe he’s the one with two rings.
People don’t want to admit it. We like to think of football as the ultimate team game. Some of the more macho fans want to believe it’s all about running and defense like it was in 1985. But the way the current NFL is - it’s all about the quarterback. If you have a top quarterback, you’re going to be successful every year. You’re going to be in the hunt. You’re going to have watchable, exciting football. Can you succeed without that QB? Yeah, but it’s harder, and rarer, and requires hitting on many other positions rather than just hitting on one.
A top QB would be worth 10 or 15 first round draft picks - or in other words, it would be worth not having a first round draft pick for the career of that QB if that were the cost of having him. The only issue here is the uncertainty that any rookie can develop into that top QB. But if you’re confident that they will be, it’s hard to imagine a price too high to pay.
The Browns should’ve paid a ridiculous price for RG3, because the cost of not doing so is even greater.
Not having a QB is like having cancer without insurance. No matter what the drugs cost you pay for them, you worry about the bills later. Same with QBs, you pay what it costs, period. Some people catch the problem early and get by cheaply, but when you don’t you do what you have to do.
I’ve seen no evidence–in Oakland, in the later years in Denver, or in Washington–that Shanahan is a good head coach when he does not have John Elway on his team.
Exactly: You have to have a QB.
Elite QB’s are well worth it. If you told me RGIII would, without a doubt, develop into an elite QB, I’d agree wholeheartedly.
But you can’t. Nobody can. It looks like a fine trade when you only look at the benefit without considering the cost and the probability that he becomes an elite NFL QB. Only looking at the upside gets GM’s and coaches fired. The first round is riddled with busts at the QB position, while the three current elite QB’s (Brady, Rodgers, and Brees) were all taken outside the top 20.
The price the Redskins traded is too high for just potential. If RGIII becomes an elite QB, it might have been worth it. But if he just sits in that grouping of good, but not elite, like many QB’s are, it’s a huge waste.
But you and I’ve gone around on the value of QB’s and their cost (cough Jay Cutler cough) many times before, I don’t anticipate you’ll change your mind.
How’s Alex Smith been as a #1 pick for a team that “had to have” a QB?
It’s not a matter of winning this year; they weren’t going to win this year no matter what they did. It’s a matter of giving the team a sense of direction, which they now have. Unfortunately, they’ve given up so much that they’ve seriously compromised their ability to do that. It’s a “Gift of the Magi” situation.
[QUOTE=Onni]
People still don’t get that having a elite starting QB is really the only thing that matters and it must be solved no matter what.
[/QUOTE]
If that was really the case, they could have drafted QBs in the first round three years in a row, and increased their odds.
Not very good. Stupid F**king Mike Nolan had a chance to pick an elite QB, but he chose the guy who wouldn’t talk back to him. :smack:
First off, as a 'Skins fan I initially felt the need to vomit after hearing the trade. But then I remembered how little joy this team has brought me for the last decade or so. I’m not jumping off any building if it turns out to be a bad trade.
Realistically, the 'Skins are giving up two first-rounders and a second-rounder. They swapped slots with the Rams for 2012. So it’s not so horrific-sounding as the OP wrote (not a dig, this is how everybody is talking about it, basically).
The Redskins have been absolutely shit at QB since Jay Schroeder. There have been some hints of success (Trent Green, Gus Frerotte, Jeff Hostetler) but much more disaster (Shuler, Banks, George, Matthews, Wuerfel, Ramsey, Campbell, McNabb, Beck, Grossman… these are just the sacks I can remember). Shuler was a bust, true, but he’s the last franchise-looking QB to show up in Redskins Park. I guess you could argue Campbell, as a late first-rounder, but I don’t think anyone thought he would turn the direction of the franchise.
It’s a gamble, yes. But a franchise QB is absolutely worth it. The question is, is RGIII that guy?
He does have a freaky throwing motion and those bombs aren’t the prettiest. But, my goodness, he has the maneuverability of a Steve Young/Mike Vick type. Look at some of his YouTube compilations. I know, I know - “you know who else had those moves in college - Vince Young!” To that I say, everything about this kid screams maturity and humility. He suffered with some horrible Baylor teams until the past two years, when they caught fire. He makes smart decisions, and that’s what strikes me as the best thing about him. Smart kid who graduated early, Dean’s List, kid of military parents… nothing is certain in the draft and player development but I think his upside is huge.
Kyle Shanahan had a lot of success in Houston with a young QB. It strikes me that he’s been working with head cases, namely a past-his-prime prima donna who thought he was smarter than the coach (McNabb) and one guy with a medical condition where he lacks depth perception (how else do you explain Grossman’s penchant for throwing into double- and triple-coverage?). I wonder, also, if Shanahan’s youth played a factor in coaching McNabb and Grossman. With a younger guy, maybe he’ll be able to get through and actually, you know, coach.
The rookie cap rules means that the $40 million Washington has under the cap can be spent on impact free agents, like a Vincent Jackson, and some O-line help. I would say the remainder of the draft should be on linemen on both sides of the ball. Quite simply, Washington has had average- to above-average play out of every position in the past decade with the exception of QB, OL, and K.
If RGIII ends up been average-to-good he will be an incredible upgrade at the position. And if he is that guy, and he stays healthy and provides stability at QB, it might be worthwhile for a franchise who has lacked leadership at QB since Mark Rypien’s days. The fan base is going apeshit over the trade. I suppose we’ll have to wait and see… but with this franchise, you never know.
Five years from now, if the ‘Skins are still horrible, Daniel Snyder needs to sell the team. He so far is cursed - every move he’s made, even the ones that were universally lauded (Gibbs’ re-hiring) have gone wrong.
There are some real promising young stars in DC - Orakpo, Kerrigan, Helu, Davis - and RGIII can reinvigorate interest in an ailing franchise. He doesn’t have to win now (which is why Manning would have been a terrible fit), they can put some big-play receivers and O-linemen to help him out on the field with the cap space.
Bottom line, if there’s any chance that RGIII could be even a moderate star in this league and a starter for 5-7 years, it’s absolutely worth it. It’s not like the Redskins have had any skill in building through the draft thus far. 
(Excepting Orakpo and Kerrigan.)