I just earned a masters degree at a small university here in Alabama, and in having a close look at my diploma, I see that it spells out the year as “Two Thousand and Ten.”
I’ve always told students that one should not use the word *and *this way in spelling out the year, that this word is reserved as shorthand for the decimal point in a number. For instance, writing out the number 1.5 would be done as “one and five tenths.”
Am I just old fashioned on this, in the same way that I’m accused of being old fashioned with regard to the use of two spaces–not one–after a full stop, or in my use of the Oxford comma?
I was taught the same thing you were about the “and,” but we’re in the minority. I don’t use it myself, but it seems the rest of the world does, so I stopped fretting about it.
As for the double space, that has never been the standard on typeset or variable-spaced fonts. It was used for typewriters, and should have died with typewriters. I have had to create macros to remove the extra spaces from articles and letters submitted to my newspaper.
The rule is correct under all circumstances, but you have the rule wrong. The rule is that any large number, when written out, is a short list; such a list should use “and” only once. When writing a check, therefore, we write “one thousand, eight hundred, twenty-four, and 37/100 dollars.” If writing a year, we don’t have any fractions at the end, so we write “one thousand, nine hundred, and sixty-three.” 2010, having only two components, does not require a comma, so we write “two thousand and ten.” It’s also possible (and in fact more common) to look upon a year number as the name of that year, dispensing with the entire “list” business: “nineteen sixty-three,” “two thousand ten,” “A.D. eight twenty-nine,” and so on. Generally, we don’t write those out: we just say them, and write the number. On a diploma, or any other document in which we instill a sense of formality and dignity (pomposity?) by writing out the year, the use of “and” is not merely permissible, but preferable.
If “and” is to be read as a decimal point, then one and five tenths would mean 1 + .5/10 = 1.05 if you wished to be pedantic – as most people here seem to wish
I once attended a talk where the speaker consistently put “and” in every historical date he mentioned. Nineteen and twenty-three Eighteen and sixty-seven, etc. It was very distracting. Not sure if this was a generational thing, or a regional thing.
Individual preference, I’d say. I’ve heard it done every which way.
On wedding invitations, I was once told by a etiquette maven, it used to be that the date was shown but the year was typically omitted. The more modern style is to show the year but to spell it out, as in, “Two thousand and ten.”
I think he is saying that he wouldn’t say that. And that is evidence that “and” does not indicate the decimal point (the “tenths” takes care of that), but is merely serving as the marker for the last item in a list (of two things in this case), which is the common function of “and.”
No, I say “one and five tenths” or “one point five.” I.e., I agree with you. I was commenting on the proposition that “and” is to be considered a decimal point which I disagree with. If “and” means a decimal point then “one and five tenths” should mean either (1.5)/10 = 0.15 or 1 + .5/10 = 1.05. And I don’t believe it does nor does anyone I think.
It’s not literally meant to represent a decimal point the way saying “one point five” represents 1.5. The ‘and’ indicates “and now the whole numbers have ended and the fractional parts of a whole number begin”, which is what a decimal point represents. One and five tenths means 1 + 5/10ths which is the only logical (and pedantic) way to interpret it. There’s absolutely no reason to insert two decimal points like you’re trying to say it does.
To say verbally what you’re trying to would be more like “one and five tenths of a tenth” which is in no way suggested by “one and five tenths”.
I think there is a regional difference in usage:
British English: Two thousand and ten; one hundred and fifty-five
American English: Two thousand ten; one hundred fifty-five
