It has been announced that my son’s kindergarten class, at the local public school, will be “observing” St. Nicholas Day on 12/5. The story of St. Nicholas will be told to them as a sort of multi-cultural fable - you know, kids in Europe have this tradition and this is a story they tell, etc. The kids will put their shoes outside of the classroom and parents have been asked to donate small treats to put in the shoes.
I have to say that I’m a bit intrigued by all this. My husband and I are atheists and, unlikely as it may seem, I think we’ll possibly be the people least offended by the activity. We’re in the Bible Belt in a school district where a yoga lesson in an elementary school phys ed class was protested and halted by a local Christian group. I’m imagining that the evangelical Protestant parents aren’t going to be thrilled with the kids learning about a Catholic Saint in class. Then you have the Catholic parents who may not appreciate the story of one of their Saint’s being presented as a fable. There will be the non-Christian religious parents who may not be happy about the overtly Christian story being part of a kindergarten lesson plan. Finally, you have the people who have spent a lot of time convincing their kids that Santa is real. It’s not going to be a huge leap for these kids to make between the “pretend” St. Nicholas and the “real” Santa.
As atheists who have presented Santa to our kids pretty much as a fun game of make-believe, I have no problem with this at all. They’re going to hear a little fable, play a little pretend, and my son will add this to collection of myths he knows. I’m tempted to volunteer, though, just to be around to see if there will be a protest by anyone else.
My very Christian 3rd grade teacher taught us all about St. Nicholas, and we did the shoe thing in class. I don’t see a problem with it. I bet it will be just fine.
It is just learning about other cultures and traditions.
We had a whole day at school devoted to the Christmas traditions of a lot cultures that are represented in our area. Norwegian, Polish, German, and Russian to name a few. We cooked foods and did crafts, and had people from the community come in to tell stories, and show us items they had from the old country. This was in 1973, so maybe times have changed. ?
I, for one, will also be interested to hear what happens with this. My kids go to schools that manage to be inclusive without getting caught up in the overly-PC, “We can’t celebrate anything lest we offend someone” crap.
Yeah, a parent complained that the kids were being taught a religious activity and contacted a group called Called2Action, which was successful in getting it taken out of the curriculum. Here’san article about people protesting yoga being taught in public schools and it mentions the Raleigh, NC incident.
Well, yes, I can certainly see how teaching kids something that helps them relax and even gets them some physical activity is Wrong and Dangerous. :rolleyes:
Aww, I love St. Nikolaustag! (We used to celebrate it in my German class in high school – even making “shoes” out of construction paper to set in the hallway. :p) I don’t see how it would be any more harmful than teaching the fable of Santa – except that children might be a little confused about the names at first.
And protesting yoga is completely ridiculous. You can choose to incorporate divine beliefs into it, or not. There’s nothing inherently religious/spiritual about it.
Yeah, but I bet they leave Black Pete out of it. That would cause a ruckus. Black Pete is one fable which gets entirely lost in the translation. There are as many tales about Black Pete as there are, well, Black Petes, and every St. Nicholas has dozens of them in attendance. The kids like Black Pete even more than they like the Good Saint, even though if you are a bad kid, Black Pete will pop you in a burlap bag and take you to Spain (shudder) where you will be beaten with a bundle of sticks by the same Pete until you learn to be good. Whereupon you may return to Holland and take up residence amoung the virtuous again.
The usual treats are the spice cookies known as windmill cookies in the US (here known as speculaas), pepernoten (which are just like speculaas only small, about dime-sized) which are thrown in the air by Black Peter for good little children, and chocolate money. Also candy/gum cigarettes but I don’t think they are available in the US any more.
In the part of Holland where I currently live, many people do not celebrate Christmas at all except as a religious event. Christmas presents and Santa, I gather, are German and Not Dutch. But they do a lot of yoga, mostly (to judge by the sales figures) on their Wii Fits.
Oh and as far as I can tell, even the religious Dutch do not actually believe in God (or have the decency to be embarassed if they do) so you ought to enjoy the holiday immensely. Secular Millenialists, every one.
Just to be clear, I don’t have a problem with this at all. I think it will be fun. I’m just wondering if there are other parents who are going to have a problem with it.
My son just got home from school with a paper chain made up of 24 links. He’s supposed to remove one per night to count down to Christmas. It’s accompanied by a little poem about Christmas Eve and a picture of a Christmas tree.
Black Pete is really cool. The story I got is not on any of the websites in English and it goes like this:
St. Nicholas was born during the third century in a village which is now on the southern coast of Turkey. His wealthy parents, who raised him to be a devout Christian, died in an epidemic while Nicholas was still young. Nicholas entered the Church and was made Bishop of Myra while still a young man. Bishop Nicholas became known for his generosity to the those in need, his love for children, and his concern for sailors and ships.
Under the Roman Emperor Diocletian, Bishop Nicholas was first exiled and then imprisoned. His jailer was a Turkish fellow named (what else) Pete. Pete decided that Nicholas was innocent of the crimes with which he was charged and decided to help him escape. This he did at peril of his life, as if Nicholas was not present to be executed, Peter would be executed in his place. Nevertheless, he made arrangements, including a magical horse named Amerigo about whom many legends are also told, staged a breakout and escorted his prisoner to the shores of the sea where a boat was waiting to take him to Spain.
Nicholas did not know that Pete would be executed for his deed. A boy, son of one of the sailors on the boat, tipped him off as Pete prepared to return to the prison and his fate. Nicholas ran after him, calling him back, and prevailed upon Pete to travel with him as his companion, convincing the proud Pete that he, Nicholas, was far too feeble to travel alone.
He promised to take care of Pete and his family for as long as they continued to walk the earth. Pete finally took him up on his offer and they are still on the lam together, often with some of Pete’s large family.
If I was a parent, I might have a problem with it due to their age. As a parent I would encourage belief in Santa, and there are some five-year-olds who would be able to connect the dots between what they’re being told about St. Nick and Santa Claus (most dopers could have made the connection that young). If this is the case, something meant to be fun could turn out to deeply upset kids by accident. Believing in Santa is a fond memory still, and I wouldn’t want that stripped from kids at such a young age.
This is an activity worth doing, though, just not quite so young. We did the international Santas thing in 5th grade, each of us picked a country to study and presented our findings to the class; mine was France. It was fun for everyone, since we were all old enough to know Santa wasn’t real.
Some of them have heard about “Jolly old St. Nick” enough not to think twice about it. I wonder if they ever consider the origin of Santa Claus. It’s usually only the extremists that are so vocal in their objections. Many evangelical Protestants are quite peaceful.
We had a visit from St Nicholas last year at our rather-evangelical-by-Australian-standards (which I suspect may mean veering-on-the-Liberal-side-by-US-Bible-Belt standards but never mind) church. Complete with, as far as I remember it, explicit joining of the dots between the original Bishop and the modern day Santa Claus.
I don’t recall hearing of anyone having hysterics over ‘spoiling’ the Santa Claus story or any other hissy fits over the subject matter (though I’ve observed over the years that ministers can get ragged on for pretty much anything they say in a service, and Christmas is the worst time for it)
So we have this white guy (Saint Nicholas) who has an army of ‘assistants’, all of whom are black, dressed in odd, clown-like clothes, named Pete and known in folklore to be pretty stupid as well as to engage in dancing and climbing. Also, all the good kids get presents and candy, but those who’ve been bad get taken back to Spain (which is supposed to be a threat although I find the thought rather enticing) in the big bag of presents, now empty, by Black Pete. So in addition to being a dimwitted servant, these Petes also serve as some sort of boogieman, or at least, that is the role they used to play.
All in all, Black Pete is a blatant remnant of the racist mentality of the olden days. Although I would not advocate getting rid of them at all, I could imagine people in the black community here might be a tad offended by these Petes.
I sort of doubt anybody who is offended is offended by picturesque remnants of olden days. I do think that Pete serves as a lightning rod for people’s discontent about contemporary prejudices. But it is important not to confuse the finger pointing at the moon, with the moon.
I dunno what you guys get up to above the rivers, but down here Pete is smarter than the saint by a long shot. Or possibly they don’t tell the allochtonen the good stories.
Though we agree on one thing, a free trip to Spain in December sounds very unlike a punishment to me. I personally would refuse to return to virtuousness until about mid-May.
Some evangelical Christians believe that yoga is a way for demons to enter your body and take over your soul, or something. This is a major plot point of the Christian novel Piercing the Darkness, in which, IIRC (it’s been awhile, I read this book for a class in college), a group of Satanists encouraged an elementary school to do yoga and meditation and demons invaded the childrens’ souls, all of which is protected fiercely by an ACLU-like organization.
Don’t worry, though, in the end, some good Christians uncover the Satanic plot and everyone is okay. Yay!