Statute of Limitations for Being Pissed Off

This is branching off of another thread in GD to avoid a hijack. Anyway:

I often see people (on the internet and elsewhere) that express strong opinions about things that happened in the past. The argument usually goes something like: “X country sucks because of (insert whatever event here) that they perpetrated (50 years ago, the nineteenth century, the cretaceous period, whatever).”

When I read books about historical events, I tend to view them with a great deal of objectivity. I rarely feel shocked, or outraged, or anything else, on a personal level, especially regarding events that happened before I was even born.

So the question is: At what point is an event so far in the past that there is no reason or right to be offended by it? Is there a point at which an event becomes a matter for objective historical study but which no longer requires a personal emotional investment?

I don’t think you’ll get an objective answer to this. Having said that, I think a good starting point is whether those affected are still being affected today: Jim Crow, for example.

42 years

I had a former co-worker who hated all Japanese because of Pearl Harbor, including the ones who weren’t born until afterward. Sigh.

I think a lot will depend on the actions of Country X after whatever event caused them to be reviled.

I can see France getting over being invaded by Germany in WWII because Germany was repentant and regretful of the harm the Nazis caused.

I can see China still being pissed at Japan over that invasion, because Japan’s general response has been “What Nanking Massacre?”

Also, whether you personally know people who were affected. For example, I am not a Holocaust survivor, but my parents are, and many of my relatives of that generation are. They’ve told me some of their stories, and that does affect my world view in some ways.

I think it’s clear to say there’s no way to say objectively. The best you can do is get to some examples and even those will be incomplete. For example there are parts of the world where the crusades of medieval Europe are still very much a part of the cultural memory and inform the decisions of the people of that area. They may be ancient history to most Europeans or mere trivia to Americans/Asians, but they’re very much alive in some parts of the world.

Similarly, the way different populations were affected by the events and the efforts the survivors put into popularizing the events makes a huge difference. Look at the way the Holocaust is portrayed as being an extermination of the Jews, which is only about half of the picture in the most widely-accepted estimates. The Romani were closer to being wiped out than the Jews were, as a percentage of population, but they were less effective at getting their story told after the war. Similarly, the mass slaughter at the hands of Pol Pot and Stalin are less well known globally than the Holocaust, although some estimates put the death tolls as even higher.

The general global consensus is that Germany has had a national equivalent of a Road to Damascus moment and, as evidenced by their membership in the EU, NATO, etc. their populace is no longer held accountable for the sins of their (literal) fathers and grandfathers. Whereas parts of the world, and certain populations around the globe, have not yet forgiven Germany and its citizens for this crime.

Having said all of that, I have my own answer to the question of “At what point is an event so far in the past that there is no reason or right to be offended by it?” and that is “As soon as possible.”

If history has taught us anything, it’s that holding grudges against groups of people for the actions of other groups of people, or the ancestors of a group of people, is a huge stumbling block to having peace in the present. The areas of the world with the longest cultural memory, holding grudges since Biblical times(literally), are still the least peaceful.

The one-eyed man must turn his hand away from the eye he may feel he is owed, and break the cycle. The other cheek must be turned. The wronged are the only ones who can make things right. Once they take vengeance or allow vengeance to color their decisions going forward, they have done an injustice which creates another victim, who will also have the chance to break the cycle, or perpetuate it.

If one has been wronged, the hardest thing to do is to forgive and break the cycle, but it’s what we must do, because the arc of humanity is towards empowerment. What a hunter gatherer could not imagine, is now something young children do with ease. The kinds of death and destruction it would take the worlds greatest army, or a natural disaster, to create in the year 0 BCE is now within the reach of a small handful of people, who can do it in a morning.

We have the ability to broadcast our thoughts with no intervening censor, across the world, in seconds. There is a time coming in the very near future when chemical and biological weapons will be possible to fabricate in a garage with minimal effort and training. If we harbor the hate of our forefathers and couple it with the capabilities of our descendants, what hope of peace do we have?

Enjoy,
Steven

The Middle East still has issues with Alexander the Great!

yah but how did it take you to calculate that.

Iran does. Don’t know of anyone else.

OTH the world is still living with the effects of many long-a-go events, and direct effects at that. The Mongol invasions absolutely destroyed West Asia. I remember reading that even today the amount of land with agriculture in Iraq and Iran is 60% of what it was pre Mongols, even today.

While not in the Middle East, the highly humerous (to outsiders, like most Balkan conflicts) Macedonian/Greek conflict is partly “informed” by his identity.

I suspect the amount of land under cultivation is lower pretty much everywhere, thanks to modern agriculture.

Things reverberate. I don’t want to quote Faulkner and get us sued, but I would say historical grudges should fade pretty quickly … but just because something started happening a long time ago doesn’t mean it’s finished happening.

I’m still pretty pissed off about the Norman invasion.

But then I found out I got some Norman in me.

So now I’m pissed off at myself. :frowning:

Very well said.

I’ve got a hankering to put up a new update on my Facebook status, apropos of nothing in particular.

May I use this? If anyone asks for attribution, I’ll be happy to credit you, via a link to this thread and post.

They do?

The Egyptians living in Alexandria would be a bit shocked to hear that.

I guess some people in Iran might be pissed off about them, but even there I think you’d have to search. My father, admittedly not all that representative, never batted an eyelash when he found me reading any of Mary Renault’s books, not even Persian Boy.

Basil Fawlty: Is there something wrong?
German Guest: Will you stop talking about the war?
Basil Fawlty: Me? You started it.
German Guest: We did not!
Basil Fawlty: Yes, you did. You invaded Poland.
When it stops being funny. :smiley:

Phrasing the question in this manner is similar to inquiring why members of X minority group are offended by particular language or actions (with the subtext of complaining that they are Too Darn Sensitive).

It’s an all-time loser - outsiders don’t get to define for members of an ethnic group (or members of a nationality) just what they should or shouldn’t take umbrage at.

One can certainly have views on the subject, so here are mine.

The “statute of limitations” should be dependent on:

  1. how well-defined and accepted the offense is,

  2. how ancient or recent it is,

  3. what the offenders have done to apologize or make restitution for wrongs, and

  4. whether or not the victimized group is culpable for similar or greater wrongs.

For instance - some Muslims carry bitter feelings about the Crusades, which Europeans should not hope to wave off. They can however point out that it was one hell of a long time ago, and that Muslims invaded and held a much larger portion of modern-day Europe for a far longer time.

When I was a grad student I did some research that left me very depressed. It started with the murder and sexual assault of an eleven year old girl in 1927 and it only went downhill from there ending the lynching of an innocent man. Not that I hold people today responsible for what their ancestors did. It’s just that there’s no statute of limitations on feeling a particular emotion.

IIRC, they reduced the amount of arable land permanently by their scorched earth tactics; the land itself hasn’t recovered.