Wis. lawmaker wants teachers to carry guns
Hmm… considered the special needs of a teacher, what weapon would be most appropriate for maintaining order, and taking down intruders?
Maximum spread? Stopping power? What are the decisive issues for today’s educator?
Cattle prods.
This just blows my mind. My husband works in a prison with 2,900 known rapists, murderers and assorted other Very Mean People. Firearms are not permitted on the premisis. (The thought being that a gun can taken from a guard and misused.)
So . . . teachers need protection more than people who work in a prison? Wow.
Brilliant. His reason is an attack on an Amish school, where I bet they’re just drooling over the prospect of concealed weapons, and Israel where military service ensures most people can handle weapons safely, yet still it’s not deemed appropriate for teachers to carry them. (Sure, the security guards have them, but this is like comparing armed police at airports to “why don’t all cabin crew have guns?”)
In your cell phone. I’m sure the Japanese are well on it.
Me for an AK-47. Why screw with a classic?
Screw that. I want some serious firepower. Nothing less than a .30cal machine gun mounted on my lectern. But I’m gonna need fire support for my trip to the Men’s Room, so maybe a grenade launcher for the guy next door. We can cover each other.
I’m uncertain whether I’m in favor it or not. I would like to suggest the following provisos be implemented before anyone considers putting guns in our classrooms.
[ol]
[li] While I do support the Second Amendment right to keep and bear arms, I forcefully object to the notion of arming anyone who is not comfortable with the notion of having a handful of deadly force readily available. Pacifists and others who abhor violent confrontation should not be forced to carry an instrument of violence any more than the Jewish kids should be forced to eat cheeseburgers. Any teacher who wishes not to be armed should be allowed to say “Not me”, without repurcussion, no questions asked. “I don’t want to” should be enough of a reason to opt out.[/li]
[li] I’d want anyone who volunteers to carry a weapon to pass rigorous psychological evaluation. It behooves us to be certain we’re not arming anyone who ought not to be armed in the first place.[/li]
[li] Hi Opal.[/li]
[li] Everyone who passes the first two hurdles must attend an accredited course in firearms safety.[/li]
[li] Having passed the previous requirements, the candidate must pass an accredited firearms proficieny course with the weapon and ammunition they are expected to use.[/ol][/li]
If all the above criteria are met only then should teachers be allowed to carry a firearm in the classroom. I’m sure a few of you might add or change some steps, but my point is, I am not in favor of just handing out guns in the teacher’s lounge and saying: “Watch your back”. I am most certainly not in favor of “bring 'em if ya got 'em”, so I expect the schools (or perhaps the local police department) should issue the firearms which will be carried, and retain ownership thereof.
Since teachers come in all shapes and sizes, I would suggest they issue 9mm self-loading (semiautomatic), double-action only (no hair trigger) pistols, as there are many well-made examples being made. While 9mm isn’t the most powerful handgun ammunition on the market, neither is it the least effective at stopping an assailant. The recoil of a 9mm firearm is modest enough that most adults should have no difficulty using it.
As far as what type of ammunition to use, I’d suggest using “safety bullets” (I forget the technical term) that disintegrate upon striking a hard surface, such as a classroom wall. These rounds have the desired effect upon flesh-and-blood targets while greatly reducing the chance that a missed shot will travel into the next classroom or beyond, endangering unintended victims.
I’m not sold that arming teachers will prove a cost-effective means of defending children in schools from violent attack, but I can understand why someone might feel compelled to promote the idea.
~~SSgt Baloo
I don’t think anyone should make it easier for me to kill a student.
For the primary school teachers, a shotgun, because the little bastards tend to swarm. For middle school teachers you need something with rapid fire. High school teachers won’t be safe with anything less than a deer rifle.
What, we aren’t talking about teachers vs. students?
Seriously, if my wife were in that situation (not that she would ever carry a weapon, particularly while she’s in the classroom) I’d want her to have the noisiest gun with the loudest bang. None of this “pop pop pop” stuff. I want her to attract attention and scare the pee out of everyone around.
I think we need to clarify that this proposal is to allow teachers to carry concealed weapons–they would not be required to carry them by any means. I would expect at most the percentage to be equivalent to people in the general population who are licensed to carry a concealed handgun–about 1%-- and likely much less, considering the anti-gun attitudes of most educators.
I find it interesting that this proposal comes from Wisconsin of all places–one of only 2 states that does not have a provision for non-law enforcement to carry concealed handguns. I think that this proposal is likely meant to start people thinking about the bill which will once again be introduced to the WI legislature to allow issuance of concealed handgun permits.
I would also like to note that this is not without precedent–a number of states allow people with concealed handgun permits to carry in schools. None of those states where the recent shootings have occured allow it. And Utah has school districts where teachers are allowed to carry in the classroom.
I think the best way to implement this would be to make it similar to the program allowing pilots to carry, requiring lots of training and regular requalification–requalify at least every 6 months, the way many police departments do.
No, teachers wouldn’t be openly carrying weapons around 2900 convicted felons daily. The guns would be concealed. If you conceal properly, nobody knows you are carrying. And it is not that hard. I have carried around many police officers, and they have never suspected that I was carrying a bigger handgun than they were (I have asked a couple that I knew).
Plus the teachers should have to have training in weapon retention before carrying in school. I’m sure your husband has had that too, but a school is a much lower risk environment than a prison.
Which would be best? I present to you -
#10 M14 – 7.62x51, 44 inches, 2799 fps, range 503 – 800 yds, 700 rpm,
#9 Sturmgewehr 44 – 7.92x33, 37 inches, 2133fps, range 546, 500rpm
#8 Springfield ’03 - .30-’06, 42 inches, 2700 fps, 656 yds, 10 rpm
#7 Steyr AUG – 5.56x45, 3084 fps, 31 inches, range 546, 650 rpm
#6 Mauser 98 – 7.92x57, 2822 fps, 43 inches, range 656 yds, 10-15 rpm
#5 FN FAL – 7.62x51, 2700 fps, 42 inches, range 656, 650 rpm
#4 M1 Garand - .30-06, 2838 fps, 43 inches, 656 yds, 30 rpm
#3 Lee Enfield SMLE - .303 Enfield, 2438 fps, 44 inches, 656 yds, 15-20 rpm
#2 M16 – 5.56x45, 3281 fps, 39 inches, 437 yds, 700-950 rpm
#1 AK47 – 7.62x39, 2329 fps, 34 inches, 437 yds, 600 rpm
Just a thought. Hard to conceal tho…
This is what I would suggest, too. The training should be more than just basic gun safety and a rundown of the laws regarding concealed carry in their state. They should have some training in how to deal with a hostage situation. And any teacher whose gun is seen in school outside of a dangerous situation should be reprimanded (if it’s accidental) or fired (if it’s on purpose).
Probably one of these:
Gun that will shoot around corners.
That way the teacher can crouch behind his/her desk or find a safe spot in the hallway and pick off their target.
Possiblya Claymore might be more effective for broad hallway areas.
If you want to pack heat, go for a FLAMETHROWER!
:o <misbehaving kid
A sensible teacher will integrate their choice of weapon into the current lesson plan - so a Springfield Musket for American History Class, a nice Heckler & Koch for German lessons, possibly a javelin for Classics / Latin?
In Swim Class a harpoon would fit nicely - Japanese Whaler attachment optional - and in Home Economics I would recommend the use of arsenic-laced iced fancies (in an Agatha Christie stylee).
Some of the MS/HS teachers I recall from my childhood should not be allowed anything sharper than a bowling ball, because they are semi-psychotic tyrants.
Giving them a gun is utter madness.
Hey! I resemble that remark!
